Members Camel Posted November 21, 2003 Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 Ive been looking at kits and have been pondering on this. I was just wondering why only two toms as a standard ? I may go for a fusion kit just to be safe, and to be honest I need to spend some real time in my drum store - I know that ;-) I do like the Yamaha hip gig, as I have v limited space, and I know I could get an extra tom if need be. So why only two for jazz? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members CoolDrum3 Posted November 21, 2003 Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 I don't think it's necessarily true that they only have two. Have you tried to go out and buy a 4-piece only kit in the beginner to intermediate range? Good luck! The standard is five, though you're always welcome to not use some pieces, which is what I sometimes do. Most times, the only way to get a 4-piece is to order it. Now to your original question... I've played with 2, 3, and 4 toms depending on the style of jazz I was doing. With classical jazz, like piano, drums, and bass (ie: Vince Guaraldi), less is more. You don't do a whole lot of fills and complex beats on the toms. In a fusion jazz setting, 3-4 seem to be the popular pick. The added influences of other styles lend themselves to creating more tonal textures...hence, making the use of toms more desirable. Another thing to think about, is alot of jazz clubs are tiny places with cramped stages (if there even is a stage). Large kits are just not a feasible option...hence, the creation of the cocktail kit (ie: hipgig), and the 4-piece kit. Depending on the setting and music, I'll do a jazz show with just a bass, snare, hi-hat, crash/ride, and maybe a crash. Now THAT'S the ultimate in minimalist drumming. The best part is I can setup and tear down from a show in less than 10 minutes, rather than my normal half hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members john clarity Posted November 21, 2003 Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 it's something i've been thinking of from a practice point of view lately- stripping the kit to minimums, hihat bass snare ride, and developing and mastering new stuff with less gear. then perhaps adding one tom, same idea, floor tom, more cymbals, an progressing back to where you start.at the moment , i've gone back to snare bass tom floor tom, hi hat and ride, and trying to be more creative with that. there is a freedom inherent in having less gear around you and in your face too!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Camel Posted November 21, 2003 Author Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 Cooldrum3, thanks for the reply. I didnt think about the small stage aspect. In fact I watched the Mingus Big Band in Ronnie Scotts and there was so little room, the drummer was pushed to the back and had a tiny kit. I do like the hip-gig, its seems like a really nice kit and I want to go and try one out. Has anyone here tried / owned a hip gig? Yeah Im off to jam with a double bass player tonight, I may leave a tom or two at home ;-) Thanks guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members psycht Posted November 21, 2003 Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 Along the same idea as Cooldrum3, you gotta ask yourself... "does the music really call for it?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fafnir777 Posted November 21, 2003 Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 I know this may sound crazy, but a lot of times drummers were carrying their kits in Cabs or on the train in New York.So, what would you carry?An 18" or 20" kick with 12" & 14" toms would be a lot easier to deal with than a monster sized kick and 4 toms. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mofishes Posted November 21, 2003 Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 The ride cymbal takes priority over toms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members CoolDrum3 Posted November 21, 2003 Members Share Posted November 21, 2003 Originally posted by john clarity it's something i've been thinking of from a practice point of view lately- stripping the kit to minimums, hihat bass snare ride, and developing and mastering new stuff with less gear. then perhaps adding one tom, same idea, floor tom, more cymbals, an progressing back to where you start.at the moment , i've gone back to snare bass tom floor tom, hi hat and ride, and trying to be more creative with that. there is a freedom inherent in having less gear around you and in your face too!!! You got the right idea. That's one of the reasons I like to strip down my kit for practice sometimes. It helps you to focus on creating new ideas with the little bit you have. It also helps with overplaying...something I'm notorious for...mainly because of my progressive background. Having less gear really is very freeing . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rambler1959 Posted November 22, 2003 Members Share Posted November 22, 2003 thats all you need baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TheBoatCanDream Posted November 23, 2003 Members Share Posted November 23, 2003 I start out with a four piece kit, then I want to add another tom, then another splash, then an auxiliary snare, then a bass drum as a tom, then some more splashes, then a bell disc, then an extra crash, then an extra ride, then a stack, then a..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members john clarity Posted November 24, 2003 Members Share Posted November 24, 2003 Depending on the setting and music, I'll do a jazz show with just a bass, snare, hi-hat, crash/ride, and maybe a crash. Now THAT'S the ultimate in minimalist drumming. The best part is I can setup and tear down from a show in less than 10 minutes, rather than my normal half hour. ya call that minimalist?!?i once did a jazz gig with just a snare and brushes... hot club de galway- double bass, fiddle, spanish guitar and me.... come to think of it,i've done loads with just a snare- lots of church ones, where it's just quiet hymns with brass, great workout for keeping it quiet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joestanman Posted November 25, 2003 Members Share Posted November 25, 2003 you call THAT minamilaist?! Oh yeah? well one time, I just played a show with a cymbal felt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agogobill Posted November 25, 2003 Members Share Posted November 25, 2003 most jazz drummers are always high on drugs, and cannot afford many drums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members john clarity Posted November 25, 2003 Members Share Posted November 25, 2003 nah, we're talking JAZZ gigs here...get with the program!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rumblebelly Posted November 25, 2003 Members Share Posted November 25, 2003 Originally posted by agogobill most jazz drummers are always high on drugs, and cannot afford many drums. That's the best response yet. You see a lot of punk drummers playing a 4 piece too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TheBoatCanDream Posted November 25, 2003 Members Share Posted November 25, 2003 Even though my kit tends to get huge whenever I strip it down, a 4 piece kit just seems more natural and raw to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members burque Posted November 26, 2003 Members Share Posted November 26, 2003 Originally posted by Camel Ive been looking at kits and have been pondering on this. I was just wondering why only two toms as a standard ?I may go for a fusion kit just to be safe, and to be honest I need to spend some real time in my drum store - I know that ;-)I do like the Yamaha hip gig, as I have v limited space, and I know I could get an extra tom if need be. So why only two for jazz? Thanks When jazz, or more specifically "be-bop" jazz was popular in the late 40's and early 50's, almost all of the originals were playing in clubs in New York and the musicians travelled a lot between clubs. Having a smaller kit, along with smaller drums (like a 20" bass as opposed to a 26" bass, which was pretty common in the big-band jazz era) meant that a drummer could travel around the city pretty light just using a taxi cab. It's really that simple. After a while, a small four piece kit was considered the norm for acoustic jazz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sarcastic jac Posted November 28, 2003 Members Share Posted November 28, 2003 Originally posted by agogobill most jazz drummers are always high on drugs, and cannot afford many drums. actually, they hock their toms for $$$ to buy drugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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