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Heel-toe with both feet


Zeromus-X

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I've been practicing playing heel-toe stuff for a few weeks on and off now, and I've got it down really well with my left foot. I've got it down pretty well with my right (still miss a few times though). But I can't get both feet to work in coordination with each other!

 

If I sit down and try it, I can do this:

 

(LT = Left Toe, LH = Left Heel, RT = Right Toe, RH = Right Heel)

 

LT-RT-LH-RH-LT-RT-LH-RH-LT-RT-LH-RH-LT-RT-LH-RH

 

...which doesn't work at all. If I try to do it the "right" way:

 

LH-LT-RH-RT-LH-LT-RH-RT-LH-LT-RH-RT-LH-LT-RH-RT

 

...it doesn't seem like my legs have the ability to coordinate with each other, and I end up just kinda hitting random beats in no pattern whatsoever.

 

I assume this is just a "keep practicing it" thing, but when I was learning it with one foot, it came pretty quick, and I could see myself progressing because I'd be more accurate with it. It seems like doing it with both, there's no progress, only continuous sucking.

 

How long did it take you guys to be able to do this consistently?

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You need to be fairly competent at doing single strokes and keeping time.

 

If your trying to go too slow it is more difficult to keep heel-toe solid and in time. You can however go quite slow if needed.

 

Try something at a moderate speed, say between 125-135 BPM. A speed you can comfortably do 16ths in time with single strokes.

 

 

There are an infinite number of exercises you can do.

 

ex. For every 4 measures throw in 1 double with your lead foot.

 

Then 1 double with your second foot - keeping the 16ths going.

 

Then try 2 double with lead foot then two double with other foot.

 

Then try 1 double with lead immediately followed by 1 double with the other foot.

 

Then 2 doubles then continuous doubles.

 

You can also throw in alternating doubles or a double then a rest then another double and really mix it up and go crazy.

 

You might be running into difficulties if you're trying to keep each individual double evenly spaced time wise. One double should sound like a John Bonham thing like on Good Times Bad Times or like the intro to We're an American Band by Grand Funk.

 

2 doubles one right after the other with alternating feet will be an in time quick 4 bass drum hit.

 

Without actually hearing what you're doing it's kind of difficult to guess what the actually difficulty might be.

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Yeah man, you need to learn to do singles solidly before you're going to pick up doubles with both feet. It's a huge pain in the ass and it took me serveral months before I was happy with how it sounded, and I still sometimes get pissy about things not sounding uniform at times.

 

RH-RT-LH-LT is the way to do it however.

 

Getting it to sounded like a solid stream of beats rather than groups of four takes a good while.

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Originally posted by Dark Slide

Yeah man, you need to learn to do singles solidly before you're going to pick up doubles with both feet. It's a huge pain in the ass and it took me serveral months before I was happy with how it sounded, and I still sometimes get pissy about things not sounding uniform at times.


RH-RT-LH-LT is the way to do it however.


Getting it to sounded like a solid stream of beats rather than groups of four takes a good while.

 

 

Oh, don't get me wrong. I think I'm pretty solid with singles. Right now my current continuous speed without heel-toe is "Payphones and Pills" by Darkest Hour. I don't have a metronome handy so I couldn't tell you how many BPM it is; I just know that that particular song reaches my limit of solid double kicking. As for single foot heel-toe, I can hit it every time with my left foot, and play triplets like crazy (LH-LT-R) with no problems. Doing triplets with RH-RT-L is a bit trickier and is on and off. I suppose I've got to keep working on that.

 

Overall I know it just means I need more practice but I just didn't know how long it "usually" takes to pick up on this kinda stuff. Everything else I've done has shown improvement after a few days except this, and I'd love to sit down and be able to pump out several-hundred BPM fills.

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I'm right handed. For some reason, I'm more prominent with my left foot when I'm playing though. I'll find myself often switching off to my left foot as the "main" one from time to time. I'm used to starting off on that foot as well, and I've been playing "Demanufacture" to practice my heel-toe stuff, and that little triplet ends up starting on the left foot if you start the song with the left foot. Kinda hard to explain I suppose.

 

I'm gonna sit down for a few hours tonight and practice with only my right and see what happens.

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Originally posted by Dark Slide

I think it's official that you're a complete freak.

 

Lol. Well, he can't be a COMPLETELE freak, since he likes Darkest Hour. Rock! :cool:

 

I think you need to work on JUST your right foot, and nothing else.

 

Try doing simple beats with two quick bass drum hits over and over, like this:

 

s - -x - -x - -x

b oo-oo- oo-

 

That should get you going. I think it's good to be able to do one footed stuff good, anyways. Then you can mesmerize people with your magical simultaneous hat and "double bass" work. ;)

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Originally posted by Ponch_A_Rella

On a side note... I am just starting to learn Heal-Toe Doubles. I have a DW5000 pedal. Any tips on how I should set the pedal up??????

 

Yup yup, what I would probably suggest is that you take it to your local drum shop and have them work on it. I am sure for a little $$ they could turn it into a perfectly acceptable Iron Cobra. :)

 

To be perfectly honest, I don't like DW's because of the lack of adjustments (amongst other things) but for working on heel-toe, I suggest tight springs, and keeping the beater angle and pedal board angle pretty close to 45 degrees each. You really want your board as flat as possible when your beater hits the head IMO.

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Speaking of how great Iron Cobras are...I just got one of their doubles! I used to play two singles, which was great, and these fell pretty much the exact same!! I am still working on getting doubles...I have my footboard at 45 deg. as are my beaters and now I am just practicing away!

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