Members grace_slick Posted August 11, 2009 Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 I’ve just realised I have yet ANOTHER problem with my singing!!! I think they’re all tied in together, but just wanted any thoughts on this specific issue. I find it REALLY hard to sing quick songs. Like, fast-paced songs with lots of words required to be said quickly. I SUCK at this! I feel like my voice can’t get through cause I’m stuck on all the consonants, and I feel instead of the voice coming out my mouth and going towards the back of the room, it’s coming out higher up in my face and getting thrown against my nose area! I’ve tried a few things. Singing the songs a bit slower makes it MUCH easier. Singing them not using proper clear and articulate consonant sounds and more vowel sounds also makes it easier, but it sounds slurred and odd. Singing it not using ANY words and just saying DAAA or LAAA or something makes it great. My voice feels more free and like I’ve got control over it, but you know…you kinda need to be singing the WORDS for most songs!! Anyone else found this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MotleyHart Posted August 11, 2009 Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 I reckon its cuz' your focusing on vocal trampolining. I find it easy and preferable to sing fast. Now, try focusing on the lyrics. You may not sound the best, but if you maintain the beat etc you'll sound fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 11, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 Vocal trampolining? Lol. I assume vocal trampolining means the things people like Mariah Carey do? Have you heard me sing? I don’t do that a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MotleyHart Posted August 11, 2009 Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 No but you fixate on notes instead of words and singing fast is ALL about the words Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kurdy Posted August 11, 2009 Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 Yeah, I admit I have a bit of a problem relating to this. I find it easier to sing quickly and rhythmically, because it's less vocally demanding. I don't have to hold long notes or worry about tone as much. Typically (though not always), songs that are more rhythmic have melodies that are simpler, and have fewer skips and leaps. It's closer to the way we talk. Not to mention I find it a lot of fun singing that way, really digging into the rhythm of a tune. Mick Jagger is a great example. He isn't a good singer in the technical sense, but he sounds totally confident. Listen to "Satisfaction" or "Brown Sugar" as examples. He really takes a bite out of those words. Actually, come to think of it, I think fewer female vocalists sing this way than male singers. Most female singers typically either try to sing smooth and pretty, or they sing diva like, with all the vocal gymnastics. Probably why, if you're a female, it's tougher to find good examples of how to do it. I guess the best example for a female would be Michael Jackson, although he technically wasn't female. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SevenString Posted August 11, 2009 Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 I think that getting your diction to the point where it is somewhat independent of your note production will help a lot. http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showpost.php?p=34757541&postcount=3 http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showpost.php?p=35332689&postcount=14 Especially important is getting that even flow of air, so that no matter what your mouth is doing, you still have consistent projection. Also, try working on your diction on the fast passages INDEPENDENTLY from the singing part. What I mean is, concentrate on SPEAKING the troublesome part, up to speed with clear diction. Like I say in the video, if you can't enunciate clearly while speaking, you sure as heck can't do it while singing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 11, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 Yes, that's true. All true. I do focus on notes sounding good and nice and in tune and whatever much more than lyrics. Lyrics get in my way. And yeah, women do tend to do this, and I am indeed a woman. And yes, diction is an issue. I tend to be a tad lazy even when speaking. I can sometimes join some words together instead of enunciating clearly...except when angry, when all my words are clear and biting. lol. But I can't sing like that. I think this is also why I'm having issues with fast words and singing...(yes, the tune itself is easy and basic but I'm more comfortable with more complicated tunes and less words really)...I have noticed I need to be more precise with the diction so I'm doing this and by doing so, the vocal quality is suffering as I feel tripped up on the words. Beh. I find they take away from any vocal power I might have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kurdy Posted August 11, 2009 Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 Yes, that's true. All true. I do focus on notes sounding good and nice and in tune and whatever much more than lyrics. Lyrics get in my way. And yeah, women do tend to do this, and I am indeed a woman. And yes, diction is an issue. I tend to be a tad lazy even when speaking. I can sometimes join some words together instead of enunciating clearly...except when angry, when all my words are clear and biting. lol. But I can't sing like that.I think this is also why I'm having issues with fast words and singing...(yes, the tune itself is easy and basic but I'm more comfortable with more complicated tunes and less words really)...I have noticed I need to be more precise with the diction so I'm doing this and by doing so, the vocal quality is suffering as I feel tripped up on the words. Beh. I find they take away from any vocal power I might have. Actually, I think diction is much less important than getting the rhythm precise, and really paying attention to how the syllables fall on the beat. If you're doing musical theatre, then yes, it's important to enunciate clearly, so that everybody in the audience, including the people in the balcony, can understand what you're singing. But it's different with rock and pop. Many rock and pop vocalists have been known to slur or mumble their words. That's because in these genres, it's more about the sound of the words than the actual words themselves. Diction tends to be less important. Actually a common criticism of some vocalists is that they are too loungey or too Broadway, and that's usually how singers are described who tend to over-ennunciate and over-emote. So if you're doing more rock or pop-oriented stuff, I think the important thing is the rhythm, and just letting those syllables roll off your tongue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kentrel Posted August 11, 2009 Members Share Posted August 11, 2009 Do you mean the Jason Mraz type singing? I agree with the other poster. I think rhythm is the most important part rather than the singing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 12, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 12, 2009 Yep, yep, I hear ya, definitely. I know that song and yeah, he’s singing lots of words but they don’t sound rushed or anything…I actually don’t like the song, but I get what you’re saying and how he does it in a way that sounds good. I think for me it’s an issue of stable breath control, as I think I must be losing air on the consonants. I am trying to enunciate so the words can be understood, cause see…it’s a bit hard to explain, but there’s this one song in particular and it’s just got lots of words but it’s not even like songs like Billy Joel’s We Didn’t Start the Fire or anything with 50 billion words…it’s just really awkward for me for some reason. I can sing Billy’s song fine! So I’m not sure what it is. I think it’s the type of words, the rhythm of the words and the fact the song is a bit too high for my comfort level, with singing a lot of words. Ugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nuclear arsenal Posted August 12, 2009 Members Share Posted August 12, 2009 well, try singing it at a speed you can handle and very slowly speeding up. get to the point that you're fumbling, back off a touch, and work there until you're comfortable, then speed up again.i don't know if this works, but it's what they say you should do for playing the guitar faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kentrel Posted August 12, 2009 Members Share Posted August 12, 2009 well, try singing it at a speed you can handle and very slowly speeding up. get to the point that you're fumbling, back off a touch, and work there until you're comfortable, then speed up again.i don't know if this works, but it's what they say you should do for playing the guitar faster. In my Brett Manning CD set this is how he teaches vibrato and pitch bends. Slow and controlled, then speed up gradually over several sessions\weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MotleyHart Posted August 12, 2009 Members Share Posted August 12, 2009 The reason he sounds good is because he practices a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members xraylemur Posted August 13, 2009 Members Share Posted August 13, 2009 I always just kind of talk through the songs a few times through before I worry about notes at all, because you mostly are talking notes more than singing if that makes any sense. But I could be misunderstanding the type of singing you mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members quicksilvergirl Posted August 18, 2009 Members Share Posted August 18, 2009 Chrissie Hynde of The Pretenders is a prime example of a female rock/pop singer performing fast songs and keeping the lyrics intelligible but melodic. Check out "The Wait," "Tattooed Love Boys," "Time the Avenger," and parts of "Precious" and "Middle of the Road." She also has a killer broad vibrato she uses on some of her material, but she doesn't overdo the vocal gymnastics. Also check Tina Turner's live recordings of "Respect" and "Proud Mary" (the fast part of the latter). Masterful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jersey Jack Posted August 18, 2009 Members Share Posted August 18, 2009 Well, I guess this thread proves once again that successful rappers have to have a conderable amount of talent and (like everyone else) have to do a considerable amount of practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 Yeah, I never thought about rappers like that. Hmm. I think why I'm having issues with this particular song, as opposed to some others that also have a lot of quickly-said words is cause this song, I don't feel the rhythm at all. I find it a clumsy awkward rhythm and that combined with the words is causing me much discomfort! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WinosaurJR Posted August 19, 2009 Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 So.. I guess this is out of the question? lol http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0d-c4pIeDs4 In all seriousness, Grace, I need to find a video or something of you singing. It sounds to me like you're always putting yourself down, pointing out all of your supposed faults. I doubt it's as bad as you say. And it's nothing that practice and determination can't fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 Ok, ok! Here's some brief samples! Tell Me on a Sunday http://www.box.net/shared/u4jibbrgcn All I Ask Of You (Phantom) - doing both the Michael Crawford part (BADLY! lol) and the Sarah Brightman part http://www.box.net/shared/lc683uq4op Me again. TRYING to be a bit more enthusiastic-voiced. http://www.box.net/shared/c53rqrgnv2 http://www.box.net/shared/dtn09tprj1 Me doing a bit of Pie Jesu by Sarah Brightman. Well, it's not really sung properly, because I have no idea what the hell she's saying in it. So I was just going noo noo noo or something. lol http://www.box.net/shared/h3g3o0o4yn This is me doing a bit of a Kate Bush song, Warm and Soothing. It's a really early song for her and one of her more obscure ones... http://www.box.net/shared/2qoysodoxm And other crap…lol http://www.box.net/shared/u4ea9iqtmi http://www.box.net/shared/f91i5nc0a4 I don't mean to be ultra self-critical or put myself down. I just want to improve and maybe it comes across as harsh. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JonPaulP Posted August 19, 2009 Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 Me doing a bit of Pie Jesu by Sarah Brightman. Well, it's not really sung properly, because I have no idea what the hell she's saying in it. So I was just going noo noo noo or something. lol Qui tollis peccata mundiDona eis requiem, dona eis requiem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 Thank you, however it is of no interest to me now. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JohnBenussi Posted August 19, 2009 Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 Even though you're still too busy to hear my voice:cry:, I listened to allof your demos and I like your voice! It is very soothing and sort of hypnotic in a non-gregorian chant sort of way, I think that is a good thing. My only critique is your audio interface that you use to record your voice.The level is very low...There are probably free plug ins somewhere that would allow you to normalize the volume or something prior to exporting it to an mp3 file.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 Oh, thank you! lol Sorry!! I totally forgot about your recording!! I have to make a phone call now, but will listen to it tomorrow and comment, ok? (I didn't put all those recordings there out of ego, by the way. lol. Winosaur kept asking for it) The thing with my voice is I don't WANT soothing! I want Grace Slick, Stevie Nicks, Heart...BAH! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WinosaurJR Posted August 19, 2009 Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 I don't mean to be ultra self-critical or put myself down. I just want to improve and maybe it comes across as harsh. lol It's good to want to improve, and your posts make ME feel a little hopeless on the inside.. lol But.. Are you freaking kidding me? You sound great to me! Much classier than the stuff I hear on the radio, and not hidden by effects. Very honest and bare sounding to me. Not sure which ones I just listened to, but you have a very calming voice, doesn't sound monotone to me. If you still feel that it's monotone, just try to sing like you're raising your voice, as if your brother or sister just really pissed you off. Not sure if that's a good image to put in your head. lol Your voice would be perfect for some ethereal, dreamy stuff. I'm not all that knowledable about "Mazzy Star", but I've heard 'em, and your voice reminds me A LOT of their singer - Melancholic, and hypnotic, romantic, and nostalgic for some reason. You even have a similar tone. I'd love to hear you do a recording of one of their songs, because even though I'm not too familiar with them, you'd definetly nail it. The only thing is, your voice has more of an operatic quality to it, unless I'm hearing differently. Very airy and ethereal, though. I really like it. You sound like you could really go somewhere musically. Keep working at it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fF0lRYhhiwI (I'm pretty sure this is their big hit, and unless it's just my ears, you sound a bit like each other. Doesn't mean you sound just like her, because I'm sure you don't want to.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted August 19, 2009 Author Members Share Posted August 19, 2009 Wow, thank you! *blush* That's really nice to say. I only know one of their songs actually, Fade Into You, and I really like it. I do like her voice (on that song anyway, cause I like the song itself), but yeah, I don't really want to sound like her particularly. I want lessons so I can get to where I want to be...at least some of the time. I don't want to be all soft and docile most of the time. I want to be cool. lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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