Members Goofball Jones Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I was looking around Youtube at various people playing bass...and people trying to copy Jamerson's bass lines to different songs. Everyone trying to get every single note perfect. My question is...did Jamerson get every note perfect every time he played the same song? Or did he go more with the groove and style...instead of him trying to remember every single note he layed down on a studio recording? This goes for any of our bass heroes. When you see John Paul Jones up there, he's not hitting EVERY note exactly like it was in the studio, right? What I'm getting at is I've seen a lot of people beating themselves up because they "messed up" or "missed notes here" when trying to perfectly copy a song and they get frustrated. Shouldn't the vibe and feel of the song come through first instead of just being a copying machine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rummy Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I guess it depends on the type of music. For the most part, I think groove and vibe are more important than precision and accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members collinwho Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I agree. Although if I was learning something like "I Want You Back" from the other thread, I would try and learn the song perfectly first. Of course, sometimes the real reason to learn the line perfectly isn't to play it with other people, it is to learn how a pro like Jamerson created such wonderful bass lines so that you can then apply the same techniques to your own. In that case, I definitely learn it perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassordeath Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I was looking around Youtube at various people playing bass...and people trying to copy Jamerson's bass lines to different songs. Everyone trying to get every single note perfect.My question is...did Jamerson get every note perfect every time he played the same song? Or did he go more with the groove and style...instead of him trying to remember every single note he layed down on a studio recording?This goes for any of our bass heroes. When you see John Paul Jones up there, he's not hitting EVERY note exactly like it was in the studio, right? What I'm getting at is I've seen a lot of people beating themselves up because they "messed up" or "missed notes here" when trying to perfectly copy a song and they get frustrated. Shouldn't the vibe and feel of the song come through first instead of just being a copying machine? I hate to do this but...I am quoting Christina Aguilara (sp?) "it's the song inside the tune, full of beautiful mistakes". She is dead spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I agree. Although if I was learning something like "I Want You Back" from the other thread, I would try and learn the song perfectly first. Of course, sometimes the real reason to learn the line perfectly isn't to play it with other people, it is to learn how a pro like Jamerson created such wonderful bass lines so that you can then apply the same techniques to your own. In that case, I definitely learn it perfectly. Took the words out of my mouth. If I'm studying a player, I want to learn a song how he played it note for note, with every nuance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitargod0dmw Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I think it depends on the song and the person playing it. Try to play a difficult prog song without hitting all of the notes exactly...and it might sound like crap. Generally when we cover a song (which is rare) I'll go with the feel. Usually I don;t sit down and learn the bass line, I'll just learn the song as a whole and play each part as I need to. If there is a memorable part that needs to be played accurately, then I'll play it that way. If there is room for error, I'll wing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassordeath Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I think it depends on the song and the person playing it. Try to play a difficult prog song without hitting all of the notes exactly...and it might sound like crap. Generally when we cover a song (which is rare) I'll go with the feel. Usually I don;t sit down and learn the bass line, I'll just learn the song as a whole and play each part as I need to. If there is a memorable part that needs to be played accurately, then I'll play it that way. If there is room for error, I'll wing it. I agree with you. It's funny how I get used to how a band I am in sounds on a cover tune and then here it on the radio or whatever and think it sounds wrong. The song grows, regardless of who is holding it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goofball Jones Posted January 9, 2008 Author Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 No no, don't get me wrong...learning Jamerson and how he created everything is wonderful and I try to get the notes right too. I'm talking about in a live situation if you're covering it. I've seen some tribute bands that even advertise "note for note" bass or guitar playing and they sound...well...sterile. Like the sum of their parts is less than their whole....they're missing something. But then again, they ARE tribute bands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BoundandBlocked Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 [YOUTUBE]wDQlSSOXU6A[/YOUTUBE] If you watch this video of Teen Town, you'll see that the keyboard is doubling the bass for most of the song. Initially it appears as if Jaco is just wanking around, but he is actually playing a reproducible bass part. Sorry, I've been on a Jaco YT kick lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ModmanQ6 Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I don't play things note for note. I definitely try to capture the feel and essence of the original line, but put my own spin on it. I feel that music is like a conversation and I have something to say as an individual... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 in a live situation if you're covering it. Then no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goofball Jones Posted January 9, 2008 Author Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 Then no. Like how I totally break down my question to get the answer I want? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaulyWally Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 Unless the music is sequenced/computer generated, there are no perfect notes. That's part of what makes the music special. And that's also part of what gives it the groove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitargod0dmw Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 Like how I totally break down my question to get the answer I want? That's the only way some of us retards can understand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RSBro Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 This was always my beef w/ Metallica- every night, every song, every same note you heard on the record. You can hear live recordings that are decades apart, and the songs are exactly the same. You'd think they could at least mix it up a little! If I'm learning a line to improve my overall ability, I'll learn it note for note. If it's a cover, I'll get it 80% right and add my own flair to the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members collinwho Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 Also, I don't play my own songs note for note . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members T. Alan Smith Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 Most people will tell you that a professional knows how to either cover their mistakes or make their mistakes work in the context, and I agree with that assessment...to a point.I believe that perfection is more about the combination of the above with really nailing the feel and vibe(i.e. being in the moment). I know I play differently when I hit a certain spiritual plane. As for Jamerson and the like, remember- he was actually creating the style ...not copying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members coyote-1 Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 Jamerson was banging out recordings. Most of that stuff was not take #73, but take 2 or 3.... good as those cats were, they were playing it LIVE and then moving on to the next of four sessions that day. It was not about "you missed by 0.00002 seconds on that F#, let's punch it in". Consequently those recordings will remain classics while the stuff produced today, for all its supposed perfection, is ephemeral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Goofball Jones Posted January 9, 2008 Author Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 Consequently those recordings will remain classics while the stuff produced today, for all its supposed perfection, is ephemeral. Hey, don't chew be acoming in here with yer high-falutin werds! But seriously, good use of that word! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bbl Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 I agree. Although if I was learning something like "I Want You Back" from the other thread, I would try and learn the song perfectly first. Of course, sometimes the real reason to learn the line perfectly isn't to play it with other people, it is to learn how a pro like Jamerson created such wonderful bass lines so that you can then apply the same techniques to your own. In that case, I definitely learn it perfectly. Just FYI, that line was played by Wilton Fender, not Jamerson. But I agree with your post. And Jamerson didn't play any filler - every note had a purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members collinwho Posted January 9, 2008 Members Share Posted January 9, 2008 great line! i still say it's jamerson! Yeah, I'm aware of that. I mixed my references there and it became unclear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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