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Design my new rig: smaller footprint, same big sound!


Clatter

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They used to make Dual Recto Combos...back in the 90s, I believe. I ~think~ I saw one once. A guitarist friend of my drummer at the time had the Dual Rectifier Head and 4x12 cab, but decided he wanted to go with something different, so he kept the 4x12 and was using a Fender 2x12 Combo of some sort with the addition of 1/2 of the 4x12 speakers, then he had the alleged Dual Rectifier 2x12 combo pushing the other half of the 4x12. Insane.


I'm 88.5% sure it was a Dual Rectifier.

 

 

 

AFAIK, the Road King has a Dual Rec label on the front... atleast I'm pretty sure I remember seeing it on my guitarist's amp...

 

 

 

- georgestrings

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AFAIK, the Road King has a Dual Rec label on the front... atleast I'm pretty sure I remember seeing it on my guitarist's amp...

 

 

It does say Dual Rec on it...it's based on the same design. It's basically a 4 channel dual rec with cool tube switching technology for each channel.

 

The Single Rec, Dual Rec, Triple Rec, Tremoverb, Recto-O-Verb, Roadster, and Road King are all rectifiers. All of them are dual rec (100 watts) except for the Single and the Triple.

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My guitarist has a Road King, which he's looking to trade into a Marshall half stack - just thought I'd mention it...




- georgestrings

 

 

Your guitard needs better ears. :poke:

 

I like Marshall's and all, but the low end/low mids that the Mesa does just sounds a lot better to me. Marshalls just sound too top-heavy for my ears at times.

 

Tell him to get a Bogner Uberschall- gawd that's a sweet amp...

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Whoa, my head is spinning!!! Thanks so much for all the input, you guys!! :thu:

 

Okay, the more I thought about it, the more I realized I have two separate problems. Originally we had planned to rent our full-on stage setup because we felt like it was important for us to play our music through the proper gear. For us, the tones and sounds are as important to the experience as are the songs themselves. We felt that using fewer drums or different amps wouldn't be presenting the songs in the way they were meant to be heard. Can you imagine Neil Peart playing on a 4-piece drumset? I know that sounds weird, but this is our first chance to play overseas and we want to sound great. And I think it's more important because of our unique band setup; if we were the White Stripes or DFA 1979 it wouldn't be such a big deal but our whole schtick is our big sound. If the amps aren't dialed in right, the whole thing could sound like a big mess.

 

So here are the two scenarios with their unique problems:

 

1) The UK

We will be playing 3 shows with Toup

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Your guitard needs better ears. :poke:


I like Marshall's and all, but the low end/low mids that the Mesa does just sounds a lot better to me. Marshalls just sound too top-heavy for my ears at times.


Tell him to get a Bogner Uberschall-
gawd
that's a sweet amp...

 

 

When we recorded our first album we used a blend of the Mesa and a Marshall half stack. We had rented them for the recording, so when it came time to come up with a touring rig I went to the store and tried the Marshall, which sounded okay. Then I plugged into the Mesa and was completely blown away! That tone is just gorgeous with a Ric. On the latest album we actually added an Orange rig and blended it in from time to time.

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When we recorded our first album we used a blend of the Mesa and a Marshall half stack. We had rented them for the recording, so when it came time to come up with a touring rig I went to the store and tried the Marshall, which sounded okay. Then I plugged into the Mesa and was completely blown away! That tone is just gorgeous with a Ric. On the latest album we actually added an Orange rig and blended it in from time to time.

 

 

I just like the drive a whole lot better on the Rectos. My last guitarist had like a 96 PRS Custom 22 and through his Dual Rec and 412 cab, it just crushes all. My previous one had an LP Black Beauty and a JCM 800 and 412 cab, and the tones just are incomparable, at least to me.

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Oh, and here's another question: how the heck do I transport my basses??? I'll take at least my Ric and one 12-string. I need to get a new Ric case anyway; the 12 has a padded case right now. Should I just get new hardshell cases for each bass, or should I get one uber case that holds a bunch of basses??

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SHeesh Amy, your rig has my head spinning! In a good way!


But I don't envy the work that's ahead of you to get you on tour in Europe. I'm sure you'll kick ass there especially with people like Jazz Ad helping you out.

 

 

Thanks! I just know we can make it work out. It just takes a little thinking and a lot of coffee

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Will the audience notice? Maybe not, but they might think something doesn't sound right.


 

 

 

Not meaning to be harsh, but they absolutely will not. I'm sure you know this--we all do--but we all need to be reminded of it sometimes with our ever-expanding rigs, our quest for limitless tone options be it through more basses, amps, guitars, keys, etc. The truth is that once you get to a certain level of quality with your gear, then it's really all subjective to the player's ear. The audience just wants to see and hear you play your songs. They want you to look like you're having a good time and they, in turn, want to have a good time. Regardless of what solutions you end up coming to, you really need to get by it...just put it all to bed and care about 2 things...1. working with the setup you have to the best of your ability by playing that bass to the best of your ability and 2. entertaining.

 

Again, the audience really doesn't care as long as they can have a good time.

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Oh, and here's another question: how the heck do I transport my basses??? I'll take at least my Ric and one 12-string. I need to get a new Ric case anyway; the 12 has a padded case right now. Should I just get new hardshell cases for each bass, or should I get one uber case that holds a bunch of basses??

 

 

You could get one uber case for the basses or single cases for each? Whatever you get, you should get ATA certified cases.

 

Oh btw, have you got a gig planned for Dublin or is it only the U.K. you're playing?

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That's an absolutely valid point, and I can see that applying in the situation where I have to use others' gear, where even if it doesn't sound like what I'M used to, the audience will never know or care. My hope and dream is that the true nature of our overblown live show can come through because that's what we're all about, producing a ton of sound for two people. If any of the elements are missing, chances are people won't know something's missing, but they also might go home thinking "meh." If we have our full setup--all my amps and basses, Joe's giant drumset with octobans and gong bass drum, the harmonies we fly in--that has more potential for an audience to really get the full experience, both sonically and visually. I'm not saying it can't be done with less, the songs just aren't designed to be done with less, ya know? We would have taken a different approach to songwriting if we had fewer sounds to use. I don't know if that makes sense, it's hard to convey.

 

For example, we've played at a club in Cincinnati a few times. Twice we played with the same band. After the second time, the person in the other band admitted that when they'd seen us before, they didn't "get it." This time around the sound guy really had everything dialed in and had the distorted amp up in the mix where it should be, and the other band person said she got it this time.

 

I guess I'm trying to say I'm concerned about the sound beyond just the subtle nuances of tone. We have one shot at this, so if people don't like it, I want it to be because they don't like it, not because we weren't able to bring the rock the way it should be brought! :D

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You could get one uber case for the basses or single cases for each? Whatever you get, you should get ATA certified cases.


Oh btw, have you got a gig planned for Dublin or is it only the U.K. you're playing?

 

 

I just sent an e-mail to a booking agency yesterday about Scotland and Ireland. We would LOVE to play in Dublin!!!!!!!!!

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That's an absolutely valid point, and I can see that applying in the situation where I have to use others' gear, where even if it doesn't sound like what I'M used to, the audience will never know or care. My hope and dream is that the true nature of our overblown live show can come through because that's what we're all about, producing a ton of sound for two people. If any of the elements are missing, chances are people won't know something's missing, but they also might go home thinking "meh." If we have our full setup--all my amps and basses, Joe's giant drumset with octobans and gong bass drum, the harmonies we fly in--that has more potential for an audience to really get the full experience, both sonically and visually. I'm not saying it can't be done with less, the songs just aren't designed to be done with less, ya know? We would have taken a different approach to songwriting if we had fewer sounds to use. I don't know if that makes sense, it's hard to convey.


For example, we've played at a club in Cincinnati a few times. Twice we played with the same band. After the second time, the person in the other band admitted that when they'd seen us before, they didn't "get it." This time around the sound guy really had everything dialed in and had the distorted amp up in the mix where it should be, and the other band person said she got it this time.


I guess I'm trying to say I'm concerned about the sound beyond just the subtle nuances of tone. We have one shot at this, so if people don't like it, I want it to be because they don't like it, not because we weren't able to bring the rock the way it should be brought!
:D





I get the visual thing. I used to not be satisfied unless I had 2 of my 3 Boogie Road Ready cabs on stage. Being in a 3-piece, I also always liked it when the guitarist put a 4x12 on both his side and my side of the stage. Spreads the sound out and we look and sound like a larger band. The look part...well I suppose that's why bands have put up dummy Marshall full stacks on stage.

The sound...well, I don't know...put more mics on stuff. :D With that, you're at the mercy of whomever is running sound. You aparently have some clout to where you can actually make requests of a sound engineer. If most of us showed up with your rig, the sound guy take one look at it, then go about his normal business...which would be him insisting that he put his DI in front of the entire rig because he "knows what that sounds like". :rolleyes: The rest of the rig would be completely for show and for the benefit of who's on and directly in front of the stage.

So I don't know...I guess boil it down to what's absolutely essential...if the 3-way split is essential, then try your best to work within that realm. Perhaps accepting that it won't sound spot-on your normal live show, but it might give you a chance to expand your musicianship and showpersonship. :idea: Sounds like your drummer is already embracing that by working out parts on a smaller kit.

Where did you play in Cincy, btw? (I live there and have gigged a lot until recently, anyway. I know a lot of the sound engineers, too.)

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I'll reiterate, with a bit of a modification.

See if you can work on getting your sound by running through a mixer and sending a combined feed through a strong PA rig.

Make the sound as "back-line" independent as possible, if possible.

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I'll reiterate, with a bit of a modification.


See if you can work on getting your sound by running through a mixer and sending a combined feed through a strong PA rig.


Make the sound as "back-line" independent as possible, if possible.

 

 

This makes the most sense. Then you can run a summed signal out of a mixer to a monitor setup.

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This makes the most sense. Then you can run a summed signal out of a mixer to a monitor setup.



So long as the sum adds up to perhaps a stereo signal, otherwise, you'd lose the illusion of width and space. I don't know what she normally does, though...if she prefers all 3 amps to sound stacked on top of each other or spread out? :confused:

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Between stereo and aux outs, if she can get her sound independant of tone-shaping heads, she could run 3 power amps to 3 PA cabinets and still get all the isolation/seperation. At that point it wouldn't really matter much much if she was using Mackie, JBL, Behringer, whatever...

I would still try to work on a summed signal, though.

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I'll reiterate, with a bit of a modification.


See if you can work on getting your sound by running through a mixer and sending a combined feed through a strong PA rig.


Make the sound as "back-line" independent as possible, if possible.

 

 

That is a cool thought. My biggest concern there is the "strong PA." And the monitors.

 

My philosophy (at least ever since I started doing this crazy setup) is to be as independent of the PA and sound engineer as possible (reference the Cincy story). My goal is to achieve the exact sound I want with my amps so that even if there's only PA for vocals (this actually happens a lot) my rig can stand on its own without mics/DI and I can go off of stage volume. It's hard for me to wrap my head around this new concept!

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Where did you play in Cincy, btw? (I live there and have gigged a lot until recently, anyway. I know a lot of the sound engineers, too.)

 

 

We've played at Sudsy Malone's 3 or 4 times and at Plush as part of the Midpoint Music Festival. There's a perfect example of gear hauling

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That is a cool thought. My biggest concern there is the "strong PA." And the monitors.


My philosophy (at least ever since I started doing this crazy setup) is to be as independent of the PA and sound engineer as possible (reference the Cincy story). It's hard for me to wrap my head around this new concept!

 

 

See, here's the thing...

1 - Renting a generic strong PA (for your backline) would probably be much easier and cheaper than any special bass/guitar rig set-up.

 

2 - Since you'll be feeding FOH a feed from your on-stage mixer, there is really little for a sound engineer to screw with.

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In theory it sounds beautiful. In reality, I don't know jack about how any of that actually works. That's not to say I couldn't learn (and probably should anyway), but with less than two months till we leave and a million things to do, I'm not sure I'd have time to rent something similar over here and work it out. Keep in mind I haven't picked up a bass since our show November 30; before that it was for our show Sept. 1; and before that it was May. I reeeeeeally need to practice!!!! :) It's hard to wear all the industry hats while also doing regular life things.

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