Members lug Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 Well, I was responding to a comment about that one area. If you need another area of ineffectiveness, try social security. Here you are correct. He couldn't lead the American people around the misreprensentations of the democratic party who chose to further their political agenda over the well being of the social security program. I blame Bush! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 Yep. He didn't mean it as a lie. He was very sincere about that. Unfortunately he didn't get it accomplished on a national level. No Child Left Behind has met with little fan fair, too. Same deal, wildly successful on the state level...not so much on the national level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators ThudMaker Posted February 6, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 6, 2008 Here you are correct. He couldn't lead the American people around the misreprensentations of the democratic party who chose to further their political agenda over the well being of the social security program. I blame Bush! An effective leader would have gotten the job done. He would have been able to effectively communicate his goals to the populace. That groundswell of support could have forced Congress to act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 An effective leader would have gotten the job done. He would have been able to effectively communicate his goals to the populace. That groundswell of support could have forced Congress to act. So to be an effective leader, you must get 100% of your agenda across? Wow, we've NEVER even had an effective leader yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators ThudMaker Posted February 6, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 6, 2008 So to be an effective leader, you must get 100% of your agenda across? Wow, we've NEVER even had an effective leader yet!Nope. I'm suggesting that if he was a good leader he would have been able to effectively communicate the need for SS reforms. He didn't get that job done, so a groundswell of support didn't call Congress to force them to legislate on the issue. People can bitch about bloated budgets and the Iraq War all they want, but SS reform was/is necessary. He had 8 years to do something and missed the opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 Nope. I'm suggesting that if he was a good leader he would have been able to effectively communicate the need for SS reforms. He didn't get that job done, so a groundswell of support didn't call Congress to force them to legislate on the issue. People can bitch about bloated budgets and the Iraq War all they want, but SS reform was/is necessary. He had 8 years to do something and missed the opportunity.Well, he had a little help. He can really only communicate what the media wants to. He laid out perfectly understandable arguments but the media covered the dems "He's pulling money out of Social Security" false argument at a 10 to 1 ratio. Bush's biggest failing is with a media that feeds on controversy over fact. In fact, I believe the next Prez will have similar troubles simply because it sells copy. His ability to go to war twice and his tax cuts will probably be seen as his biggest accomplishments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jugghaid Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 The media has always treated social security as the "thrid rail of american politics". Don't touch it, don't change it or you are the anti-christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators ThudMaker Posted February 6, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 6, 2008 The media has always treated social security as the "thrid rail of american politics". Don't touch it, don't change it or you are the anti-christ. Agree with both these posts. I would add that some of these future views of Bush may be altered depending on whether or not the next President squanders some of his "accomplishments." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators isaac42 Posted February 6, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 6, 2008 He was going by his Texas experience. Dems and Repubs work hand in hand here all the time. I've even seen them cross party lines on supporting candidates w/o repercusions from their own parties. The national stage is a bit more caustic. True. It works because Texas Democrats are more conservative than US Republicans, on average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators isaac42 Posted February 6, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 6, 2008 Well, I was responding to a comment about that one area.If you need another area of ineffectiveness, try social security. Medicare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators isaac42 Posted February 6, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 6, 2008 Same deal, wildly successful on the state level...not so much on the national level. Wildly successful? What color is the sky on your planet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bass8987 Posted February 6, 2008 Members Share Posted February 6, 2008 http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/02/05/schneider-mccain-the-favorite-of-anti-war-republicans/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators ThudMaker Posted February 7, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 7, 2008 Wildly successful? What color is the sky on your planet?NCLB worked quite well in TX to the best of my knowledge. It simply didn't translate to the national level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted February 7, 2008 Members Share Posted February 7, 2008 Wildly successful? What color is the sky on your planet? State moved from somewhere around a 45th national ranking to around 25th in just a few years. These were judged on a national level, not by anyone here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted February 7, 2008 Members Share Posted February 7, 2008 NCLB worked quite well in TX to the best of my knowledge. It simply didn't translate to the national level. Someone posted that the national finacial input is really only about 8 percent of the school budget so it doesn't have as much bite. No real source on this so take with a grain of salt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators isaac42 Posted February 7, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 7, 2008 State moved from somewhere around a 45th national ranking to around 25th in just a few years. These were judged on a national level, not by anyone here. So it may have worked well in Texas. I've read dissenting opinions on that, but, assuming it's true, why did it fail in so many other states? After all, if it was NCLB that made the difference in Texas, it had to have failed in all of the states Texas passed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Emprov Posted February 7, 2008 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2008 NCLB worked quite well in TX to the best of my knowledge. It simply didn't translate to the national level. What makes you say that it doesn't work on a national level? I honestly don't know much about its success or failure. My kids are getting a great education and that's my main focus. We had to move into a really nice area to provide that education for them though. It's amazing how a high percentage of illegals in the classroom will lower the grades of their english speaking fellow students. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted February 7, 2008 Members Share Posted February 7, 2008 So it may have worked well in Texas. I've read dissenting opinions on that, but, assuming it's true, why did it fail in so many other states? After all, if it was NCLB that made the difference in Texas, it had to have failed in all of the states Texas passed. You missunderestimate what I'm saying. It worked in Texas as a state program under Bush. He tried to translate this to the national level but it's not nearly as effective there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators ThudMaker Posted February 7, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 7, 2008 What makes you say that it doesn't work on a national level? I honestly don't know much about its success or failure. My kids are getting a great education and that's my main focus. We had to move into a really nice area to provide that education for them though. It's amazing how a high percentage of illegals in the classroom will lower the grades of their english speaking fellow students.Well, I live in a very affluent school district, too, so it doesn't really affect our district. The way I understand it the problem lies in that so much depends on testing that the teachers teach to the testing instead of actually teaching the children the subject matter. When there's government funding on the line that's what they will get. Cavy is a teacher and posts here. He may be able to explain from a teacher's perspective what the issues are with NCLB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lug Posted February 7, 2008 Members Share Posted February 7, 2008 True. It works because Texas Democrats are more conservative than US Republicans, on average.That has somthing to do with it but mainly we are a lot nicer and more considerate than the rest of you scum sucking, back stabbing, nancypants, ner-do-well, commie-fascist apeasing, rude-assed states. Have a nice day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Emprov Posted February 7, 2008 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2008 Cavy is a teacher and posts here. He may be able to explain from a teacher's perspective what the issues are with NCLB. I help out in my first grader's class on Thursday mornings, I may just talk to my daughter's teacher tomorrow. She's pretty green and granola though so that may affect her opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators ThudMaker Posted February 7, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 7, 2008 That has somthing to do with it but mainly we are a lot nicer and more considerate than the rest of you scum sucking, back stabbing, nancypants, ner-do-well, commie-fascist apeasing, rude-assed states. Have a nice day! It might have something to do with packing heat, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators isaac42 Posted February 7, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 7, 2008 You missunderestimate what I'm saying. It worked in Texas as a state program under Bush. He tried to translate this to the national level but it's not nearly as effective there. I see. From what I've read, it was Bush taking credit for what Richardson actually did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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