Members Captain Fathead Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 Why do they always have to kill themselves at the end? Why can't someone castrate them with a rusty machete instead? Because they're cowards. Seriously, WTF? This makes me hate people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Svi Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 This really hits close to home. So sad. So sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RIC N BACKER Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 I'm a teacher, I can handle firearms, and I have experience with tactical shooting. If I could, I'd dare one of those pricks to try to harm my students. This sh*t seriously pisses me off. the un fortunate thing is these {censored}ing dickwads go to a place where people are not permitted to protect themselves. you includedyou know a criminal is less likely to go try something like this where there is a possibility they can get shot back at.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members filterthing Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 you know a criminal is less likely to go try something like this where there is a possibility they can get shot back at.... I guess that would leave a police station as the one place you will never see this happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RIC N BACKER Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 I guess that would leave a police station as the one place you will never see this happen I wouldnt say never but it isnt likely. if someone walks into a Police station and starts shooting, its a good bet he is going out ina plastic bag. I am not trying to turn this into a gun rights debate, Im just sayin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Funkee1 Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 I totally agree.I'm an alum of NIU (MSEd in '94). This really blows. I thought of you when I saw this on the news! Edit: That's what I meant to say, instead of "this Thread" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fran da Man Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 6 + the gunman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fiery Furnace Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 I'm assuming this is gonna turn into a gun debate eventually, so let me just say now... how can you guys keep tolerating this? How long until your sons or daughters are next? Don't you feel compelled to finally do something significant? Or is it just okay in American culture for a few people to get murdered every once and a while? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Captain Fathead Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 I'm assuming this is gonna turn into a gun debate eventually, so let me just say now... how can you guys keep tolerating this? How long until your sons or daughters are next? Don't you feel compelled to finally do something significant? Or is it just okay in American culture for a few people to get murdered every once and a while? And we're off. From what I can see, there are several options: 1). increase security at the college, check bags at the door, increase police presence. That's not going to go over that well, and is really gonna change the feel of going to college.2). Allow students to carry weapons on campus. I disagree with this one strongly, because if people can carry guns, they probably would. I'd hate to see a drunken fratboy decide that he wants to fire his gun at a local professor's house because his friend dared him.3). Allow professors to carry weapons- meh. I'm indifferent to the idea in general, actually. I guess I wouldn't be opposed if they went through screening and training, so they knew what they were doing, but I don't think it's a professor's job to act as a security guard. There's no easy solution, even if this kind of thing happens over and over again. If you want to argue for the outright ban of guns, that's not ever going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members T. Alan Smith Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 I'm assuming this is gonna turn into a gun debate eventually, so let me just say now... how can you guys keep tolerating this? How long until your sons or daughters are next? Don't you feel compelled to finally do something significant? Or is it just okay in American culture for a few people to get murdered every once and a while? I guess the fact that I don't believe my rights should be defined by the actions of a few morons makes me vote Republican more often than Dem. This doesn't directly answer your question, but gives some insight into our psyche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassman1956 Posted February 15, 2008 Author Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 So sad. I finished my BS-Physics there in '96. 100 years ago, when outside of big cities, most homes had arms, but went to church whether they wanted to or not, this didn't go on. Even growning up in a small city in the 60's as I did, everyone's dad had a gun someplace, and you didn't dare touch it. We've taken away both the guns and the religion to a major degree. Only a small percentage seems to have either these days. And crime is far worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members catphish Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 RIP my fellow huskies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sludgebass69 Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 This really hits close to home. So sad. So sad.+1 Several of my son's good friends go there, fortunately it doesn't appear any of them were involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SA Rios Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 This really hits close to home. So sad. So sad. +1. My cousin went to school there and I was there several times in the mid 90's when he was there. We also have a gig out there on April 19th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members NeonVomit Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 I don't know if this is real. But if so, talk about irony... Sucks. Why does this keep happening? And I really don't think everyone carrying firearms on a university campus is anything remotely like a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gspointer Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 where did you find that pic? I doubt that was made in america. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members T. Alan Smith Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 100 years ago, when outside of big cities, most homes had arms, but went to church whether they wanted to or not, this didn't go on. Even growning up in a small city in the 60's as I did, everyone's dad had a gun someplace, and you didn't dare touch it.We've taken away both the guns and the religion to a major degree. Only a small percentage seems to have either these days. And crime is far worse. Sure seems that way. Interesting observation. As a Christian, I have my views on the matter. But I was raised with a pair of shotguns lovingly displayed over the fireplace...ready to grab at a moments notice...and I didn't DARE touch 'em when I got back from church. ...and I had both parents at home as well....blood parents...one male/one female. Not this whacked out crap we have today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members NeonVomit Posted February 15, 2008 Members Share Posted February 15, 2008 where did you find that pic? I doubt that was made in america. I found it on /b/. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted February 15, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 15, 2008 Why does this keep happening? We typically ignore mental health issues and refuse to take action to help the mentally unstable before they hurt someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Brother Mango Posted February 16, 2008 Members Share Posted February 16, 2008 We typically ignore mental health issues and refuse to take action to help the mentally unstable before they hurt someone. You are so very right. A personal anecdote: A friend was in a rotten marriage, and they had 2 kids: 3 & 5 yrs old. She started going to a therapist and got put on meds. She was working with the therapist on her mental issues, and building the strength & strategies for either dealing with the marriage or getting out of it. Conversely, her parents insisted that crazy people go to psychiatrists and get medicine. They insisted that she needed to turn her problems over to Jesus. Her family is super tight-knit and the opinions of her parents & siblings sometimes carried more weight than they ought to. So, she flip-flopped back & forth between Jesus and the psychiatrist; realizing the Dr & meds were of some help, but she was this embarassment to the family. I got a call one Monday saying that she'd had a heartattack @ 36yrs old. When I went to the hospital I could tell that she was through. She didn't want to get out of that bed. What? Go back to the disgusting marriage and parents who are embarassed by a daughter who sought a psychiatrist's help? She died the following Saturday. I never had a chance to mourn her death. At the funeral I was sickened and pissed off by the folks who were standing there at her casket & offering platitudes about "she's gone on to a better place" and "God's greater plan." I got the {censored} outta there, caught a cab and went back to work. Two weeks prior to the heart attack, I'd called her father and gave warning that his daughter was on a path that didn't lead to anything pleasant. He was definitely concerned. And he expressed confusion. But Jesus was the solution. After her death, do we console ourselves by saying, "at least she didn't go & shoot up innocent people in a mall"? Her kids lost their mother and are in the custody of their mentally abusive father who's 280lbs of otherwise worthless meat. At this point, mental issues take on another layer of complexity: First, mental illness isn't visible like a limp or an eye patch. So, it's easy to wave off mental illness as laziness, lost focus, a lame excuse for not taking charge of one's own life, etc. Second, I do seriously believe her husband killed her. He didn't smother her with a pillow or poison her. Misery and his own mental illness were his weapons. He miseried her to death and had the unwitting support of her family as they gave her some more Jesus talk and sent her back to her husband for more misery--until she's ingested a lethal dose of it. Ah! But we aren't dealing with poison or a knife. It's mental illness & mental torture. I don't know if anyone has ever been tried for murder and 'misery' is held up as the murder weapon. We can't see misery; it's not a bloody knife or a bashed skull. Are we to focus on guns? Would it be ok to take away guns, then these "sicko {censored}wads" like the shooters in VA and NIU might have gone and quietly hanged themselves? Well ... that won't help save us from the mothers who drown their kids in a bathtub. We're doing better in how we acknowledge mental illness. Example: some jobs/benefit plans no longer limit the # of mental health visits that a person can make. But we've got a long long way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jugghaid Posted February 16, 2008 Members Share Posted February 16, 2008 We're doing better in how we acknowledge mental illness. Example: some jobs/benefit plans no longer limit the # of mental health visits that a person can make. But we've got a long long way to go. Sorry about your friend. That's horrible. And I agree. we do not address mental health in this country as well as we should. We're making progress, but we're certainly not there yet. We just write scrips and send people on their way. We have a pill for everything. Sometimes a lot more than that is needed. But I honestly don't think people like this are mentally ill in the sense you and I think of it. I think some people are just bad, evil people that want to cause death and destruction and leave a trail of blood and despair behind them. It's narcisism at it's worst. Much like the guy who keys the mercedes in the parking lot because the "rich prick" doesn't deserve $100,000 car, these morons feel the same way about human life. If I can't be happy, then no one will be happy. if I'm checking out, I'm taking as many of you {censored}ers with me as possible. It's a complete lack of respect for other people, nothing more. While I do believe that anyone who would do something like this, well, their elevator doesn't go all the way to the top. But I really don't think it's mental illness as much as ego and selfishness and an inflated sense of self-importance. I really think that's the reason we see such a lack of respect for human life in our society in general. Gang members are a good example. They aren't mentally ill in the clinical sense. They're just rotten mother{censored}ers. They place no value on your life, your family, your property, etc. They feel they have the right to take those things any time they please. The care more about "respect" than they do about another human being. It's truly pathetic. Fix that and you will fix an awful lot of the problems of violence in our society. Problem is, these traits are learned at a pretty young age. And most of these people either come from homes where the parents were absent (and make the Gang their family) or their parents were ambivalent and preferred to give junior $100 to go to the mall than actually spend some time with him and teach him how to be a good human being. Then you end up with Columbine and many other school shootings. The problems are intertwined. The only difference seems to be that we, as a society, care more about the dead kids at a high school or college than we do about the dead kids in the inner city. [/rant] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted February 16, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 16, 2008 But I honestly don't think people like this are mentally ill in the sense you and I think of it. I think some people are just bad, evil people that want to cause death and destruction and leave a trail of blood and despair behind them. I couldn't disagree more. I've never met a single person like this, including gang members and various criminals I've met in and out of the prison system. Mental illness doesn't create the gang problems and associated violence, but I don't believe it is caused by "evil" either. I have a cousin that has spent the last decade plus studying gang activity. She's gotten a PhD from her hands on work and has gained valuable insights into the sociology of gang activity. It's a completely different subject, but what I hear from her in relating the thought process of gang members sounds EXTREMELY similar to the rantings of several of the pro gun shoot 'em up type guys on this board. Ego, paranoia, distrust of the social structures in place, etc., but, like I said, that's a whole different subject. In the case at hand, the shooter came off his medication, bought some guns and murdered a crowd. It seems that few people in his life were aware of his mental health issues. Not surprising, this is typical, whether hidden by the ill or ignored by their family/friends. If people were aware and cared, someone would have known he was off his medication, had him in to meet with his doctor and dealt with the real issues. Instead this is taboo. We are more comfortable mourning death than dealing with ill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gspointer Posted February 16, 2008 Members Share Posted February 16, 2008 It's a completely different subject, but what I hear from her in relating the thought process of gang members sounds EXTREMELY similar to the rantings of several of the pro gun shoot 'em up type guys on this board. Ego, paranoia, distrust of the social structures in place, etc., but, like I said, that's a whole different subject. A little curious if you are referring to members of the Bass forum when you are comparing "pro gun shoot 'em up type guys" and if there is a better definition of this type person. I am pro-gun, and may or may not meet your definition of "shoot 'em up", but have never before been compared to a sociopath, although I have had the misfortune of knowing one. Interestingly, he was not pro-gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bassman1956 Posted February 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted February 16, 2008 I know of a kid, then maybe 14 or 15, got pissed at his parents, set their house on fire at night. All dead but him. I know of a young man, 19 or so at the time, was so overburdened by his controlling abusive father, used to idolize his year-older sister because she had the guts to move out of town. Although he couldn't do that, because his dad's threats of what would happen if he left kept him locked in terror. He stabbed his father to death, in front of his mother, when his dad went abusive one afternoon. I know of a guy, then about 30, beat his casual girl friend to death one night, no apparent reason. He wasn't even sure why. Guns weren't used in any of those deaths. Yet murders were committed, and the "why's" are rather debatable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted February 16, 2008 Moderators Share Posted February 16, 2008 Guns weren't used in any of those deaths. Yet murders were committed, and the "why's" are rather debatable. In situations like these guns clearly aren't the problem or the solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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