Members Mr.Mow Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Over the hoildays I may get the local cabinet maker to whip me up a speaker box (he charges like $20 for a bare pine cabinet!). I'm thinking (as kindness recommended) a 6" and a 12" in the one cab.. or maybe a more traditional 2X10? I know nothing of cab design.. Its going to be used with my Marshall 18w head and I'm guessing needs to be sealed. Low volume usage.. Anyone give me some basic cabinet dimensions? I'd like to avoid if possible any need for porting and such, I'd really like to stick to a good basic box! cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaulyWally Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Over the hoildays I may get the local cabinet maker to whip me up a speaker box (he charges like $20 for a bare pine cabinet!). See if he'll do it in a hardwood plywood like birch. It'll be a much better build quality. I'm thinking (as kindness recommended) a 6" and a 12" in the one cab.. or maybe a more traditional 2X10? I would love a 12" + 6". But I'm not a huge of a fan of 2x10's. They're OK, and they have their place. But IMHO, a 12" + 6" sounds how cab manufacturers try to describe their 2x10's. If I were you, I would try out different cabs in the store and see what charactaristics you tend to gravitate towards. Then pick your speaker sizes based on that. I know nothing of cab design.. Its going to be used with my Marshall 18w head and I'm guessing needs to be sealed. Low volume usage.. It does not need to be sealed. In fact, when you build a sealed cab, the final cab size is generally built around the driver specifications for the best frequency response... i.e. you do not have much say in the final volume size of the cab (if you are looking for an optimal frequency response from the cab). Anyone give me some basic cabinet dimensions? I'd like to avoid if possible any need for porting and such, I'd really like to stick to a good basic box! There are none. The only suggestion I would make, is to make sure the width is at least 20". That will ensure that you can fit standard 19" rack equipment on top without it hanging over the edges. The depth... I dunno... I'd say a minimum of 17" for deeper rack equipment. One final word... a properly designed sealed cab will give you the most flat frequency response at the risk of losing a little volume. Of course, you could play with the size if you wanted to "EQ" the cab a little bit. But then you might as well go with a ported design and get a few more dB out of it. Remember though, many cab manufactures build the cab size with specific tonal charactaristics in mind. And they calculate the size using the electrical and mechanical properties of the speakers they're using. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nAmzrTakin Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Look at about 25x25x18 for a 15" speaker. That seems about average for a sealed cab. For a 2x10 I'd go somewhere around the 18x25x18 maybe 20x25x18 area A 112 you could probably go 20x20x18 Being a sealed cab you could go as little as 15' depth but you'd get better air movement out of a deeper cab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 The process is far more complicated than that. If you are actually going to go as far as building a cabinet in a 12 + 6 configuration (I'd go 15 + 6) you will want to build it with the drivers as part of the design. I recently helped 82Daion find cabinet plans for a 15 + 6 that he recently completed. You should check out his threads and talk to him to see if that is something you are up for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaulyWally Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 The process is far more complicated than that. If you are actually going to go as far as building a cabinet in a 12 + 6 configuration (I'd go 15 + 6) you will want to build it with the drivers as part of the design. I recently helped 82Daion find cabinet plans for a 15 + 6 that he recently completed. You should check out his threads and talk to him to see if that is something you are up for. Ah... you reminded me of something else. The more driver sizes you throw in, the more complicated the actual build is going to be (or could be). If you're going with 2x10 or 2x12... there isn't much fanciness you have to put into the design/build. But with a 12" and a 6" (for example), you will achieve much better and more accurate results by designing each speaker with its own baffle space/porting/etc. Essentially, you are building two completely individual speaker cabinets (one for each driver), and combining them into a single "box". If that makes sense... I guess you don't necessarily HAVE to... but if you don't, you'll be losing a lot of the charactaristics that would make a 12" + 6" sound the way it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 Absolutely. If you aren't building a separate enclosure for the mid driver, you are limited in your selection of drivers (closed/sealed back). You don't want mismatched drivers operating in the same enclosure. Ick! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr.Mow Posted December 17, 2008 Author Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Maaaaan... you guys take all the fun out of it! So does this mean you basically build a box with correct volume for a 1X12 and a smaller box suitable for a 1X6 which the 6" lives in attached to the main baffle? How bout I just make a damn open back cab then?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaulyWally Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Maaaaan... you guys take all the fun out of it! So does this mean you basically build a box with correct volume for a 1X12 and a smaller box suitable for a 1X6 which the 6" lives in attached to the main baffle? That's about it. How bout I just make a damn open back cab then?! That's not a problem. And the guitard forum is two doors to the left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 So does this mean you basically build a box with correct volume for a 1X12 and a smaller box suitable for a 1X6 which the 6" lives in attached to the main baffle? Exactly. 2 liters is usually a great size for a mid driver enclosure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr.Mow Posted December 17, 2008 Author Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 When have you known me to be fun. Exactly. 2 liters is usually a great size for a mid driver enclosure. Well, that's not so hard then.. box within a box.. is there a standard volume for a 12" then? I mean, if 2lt is for a 6, is it as simple as 4 for a 12? (plus an extra 2 to account for the space lost to the 6") Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Emprov Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Well, that's not so hard then.. box within a box.. is there a standard volume for a 12" then? I mean, if 2lt is for a 6, is it as simple as 4 for a 12? (plus an extra 2 to account for the space lost to the 6")Which flavor of 12 are we talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr.Mow Posted December 17, 2008 Author Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Which flavor of 12 are we talking about? I haven't thought that far ahead yet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 In the US we use a lot of Eminence speakers. Overseas it is often more economical to use other drivers. Eminence's best 12" driver for these types of applications is the Deltalite II 2512. Soon they will be releasing the Kappalite 3012. That driver is going to be worth waiting for (at least over here it is). However, since it isn't out yet I'll use the 2512 as an example; it wants between 1.5 and 2.5 cubic feet for itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nAmzrTakin Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Day-Um Kindness, You are a bass ninja (master of all forms of combat) You know a {censored}in bunch about stuff that I'd never even considered untill now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 Day-Um Kindness, You are a bass ninja (master of all forms of combat)You know a {censored}in bunch about stuff that I'd never even considered untill now. I enjoy learning about bass related topics and I try to share info where I can, but there are plenty of contributors to this forum that know more than I do on a number of bass related topics. I'm starting to feel like Kambei Shimada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nAmzrTakin Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Kambei Shimada? I'm sure that would be funny if I knew who that was/is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 Kambei Shimada? I'm sure that would be funny if I knew who that was/is Time for some film history young one. But it wasn't funny. It was as serious a post as I've made in a long while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gonzobassman Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 My guitarist made his own tube amp. Impressed the hell out of me! Did a slant front single twelve with a fiftey watt tube head. Did all the woodwork,electrical work,covered it in a tweed,it's really a sharp,and killer sounding amp. Wonder if he would delve into about 300 watts of all tube bass amp,and two twelves. Last all tube head I had was a mid seventies Marshall. Only 100 watts,but still too loud for gigging anything small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 Wonder if he would delve into about 300 watts of all tube bass amp,and two twelves. The required transformers for these projects can be cost prohibitive. You can get Fender and Marshall spec. transformers fairly cheap, but the transformers for an SVT, for example, can cost $700 on their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaulyWally Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Well, that's not so hard then.. box within a box.. is there a standard volume for a 12" then? I mean, if 2lt is for a 6, is it as simple as 4 for a 12? (plus an extra 2 to account for the space lost to the 6") In addition to what Kindness mentioned, I just want to reiterate that cab volume is entirely dependent on numerous factors. Firstly, Kindness mentioned that the 2512 "wants" between 1.5 and 2.5 ft3. Keep in mind that's a 60% increase in size. And as such, can drastically change the final sound. Secondly, an "optimally sized" sealed cab will often have a different final volume than an "optimally sized" ported cab [using the same driver]. And porting diameter and length can also change the final sound using the same cab volume. Also, "optimally sized" is a term I'm using explicitly. In a sealed cab, it would mean the box would give you the flattest frequency response. In a ported cab, it generally means it would give you the lowest possible frequency response. In reality, you can make a cab whatever size you want. And you can acheive really good results even if it's not "optimally sized". But it's all based on the specifications of the driver... and all drivers are different. There is no "standard size" for 12's... (or 15's... or whatever). So if you don't take the driver's specifications into account, it'll be a crap-shoot and you may end up with a cab that doesn't sound very good. So, you can calculate cab design/volume for best frequency response, lowest frequency response, a specific resonant frequency, or even use it to correct any flaws in the frequency curve of the driver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members james on bass Posted December 17, 2008 Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 The cab I built (designed by Burdizzos) is a monster. Loaded with a single Eminence Kappalite 3015LF. I can give you the specs if this size cab is something that interests you. I'd like to build another, slightly smaller dimensions and load it with a 3015. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr.Mow Posted December 17, 2008 Author Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 The cab I built (designed by Burdizzos) is a monster. Loaded with a single Eminence Kappalite 3015LF. I can give you the specs if this size cab is something that interests you. I'd like to build another, slightly smaller dimensions and load it with a 3015. Thanks man, but a 15 may be too big for what I need.. Having said that I guess a single 15 is going to be around the same sized cabinet as a 12 and a 6 isn't it (I'm keeping floor space in mind as its purely for home use, not much space). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr.Mow Posted December 17, 2008 Author Members Share Posted December 17, 2008 Thanks everyone for their input, its become very apparent to me that bass cab design is a whole lot more complex than guitar cab design (ie box with a speaker in it!).. I could never figure out why bass cabs were so much more expensive than comparable guitar cabs.. I'm starting to see why now.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Kindness Posted December 17, 2008 Moderators Share Posted December 17, 2008 Thanks everyone for their input, its become very apparent to me that bass cab design is a whole lot more complex than guitar cab design (ie box with a speaker in it!).. I could never figure out why bass cabs were so much more expensive than comparable guitar cabs.. I'm starting to see why now.. This is why the driver is the most important aspect of open back guitar cabinet design and is just part of the equation with bass cabinet design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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