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Getting tough on illegal immigrants?


Emprov

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"We have you surrounded. Come out with your hands up....and we'll give you permission to work here!".

 

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BELLINGHAM, Washington (CNN) -- After 11 years of living illegally in the United States, it was not until Gerardo Arreola Gonzalez was nearly deported that he finally received permission to work here....."

 

Ok, the dude has a family here that's legal and everything, but... :facepalm:

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I don't agree with illegally entering the US, but there comes a point you know where you kind of have to say "OK".

 

 

I don't know if I agree with that. I understand your poin, but where do you draw that line? And why? I's a law.

 

Would it be the same as saying, well you know, he's been cheating on his taxes for 11 years now, so I guess it's okay at this point? Or if someone has been importing cocaine into the US for 20 years, it's alolowable because it's been going on for x period of time? Or downloading child porn for years, so we will just look past it now?

 

I can't really sign off on that line of thinking.

 

Conversely I could also say that there comes a point where you get the paperwork done to be here legally as well. I mean, 11 years and he never got this done?

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I don't think those analogies are remotely applicable to this particular story or my point. That whole "with that line of thought" argument that has been going around here lately makes it really easy to take a point and make it illogical.

 

There is a difference between your analogy and my point, a big one, you know it and I know it. I understand the illegality of Immigrants but this guy has a family here in the US. His whole life is here. His kids don't know anything else and uprooting them from the only thing they know and moving them to Mexico isn't the right thing to do.

 

I'm not claiming to have a solution and I'm not attempting to draw any lines, I'm just saying that what happened here is what I believe should have happened.

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I'm still in support of open borders and registering all immigrants. I mean, why not do the raid, get everyone working illegally into the system, then hound 'em until they're paying taxes (or just let the IRS deal with 'em. Stupid IRS).

 

 

Conversely I could also say that there comes a point where you get the paperwork done to be here legally as well. I mean, 11 years and he never got this done?

 

 

This is a great point.

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Conversely I could also say that there comes a point where you get the paperwork done to be here legally as well. I mean, 11 years and he never got this done?

 

Hey, it's been a BUSY 11 years, mang! Willsellout, obviously our friend Juggs never raised a kid. :mad:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:D

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I don't think those analogies are remotely applicable to this particular story or my point. That whole "with that line of thought" argument that has been going around here lately makes it really easy to take a point and make it illogical.


There is a difference between your analogy and my point, a big one, you know it and I know it. I understand the illegality of Immigrants but this guy has a family here in the US. His whole life is here. His kids don't know anything else and uprooting them from the only thing they know and moving them to Mexico isn't the right thing to do.


I'm not claiming to have a solution and I'm not attempting to draw any lines, I'm just saying that what happened here is what I believe should have happened.

 

 

Then he and his family should now have to make the hard decision. Do we go with him? Or do we say bye-bye and stay here in the U.S. ?

 

His kids don't have to be up-rooted. It would be absolutely wrong to MAKE them leave. It's his decision and his family's, not the responsibility of the government to make it an easy one.

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Hey, it's been a BUSY 11 years, mang! Willsellout, obviously our friend Juggs never raised a kid.
:mad:


:D

 

Honestly I agree with him. But the guy probably went a few years and said "Why should I risk getting deported by letting them know I'm here". The whole immigration thing is a {censored}ty situation with no obvious solution.

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Then he and his family should now have to make the hard decision. Do we go with him? Or do we say bye-bye and stay here in the U.S. ?


His kids don't have to be up-rooted. It would be absolutely wrong to MAKE them leave. It's his decision and his family's, not the responsibility of the government to make it an easy one.

 

 

You are entitled to think what you want but if I put myself in his position it's a heartbreaking thought to be separated from my family. Or to get to Mexico and not be able to provide for them. I'm a sympathizer to a point. I can't see how people are all of a sudden against what made this country so great. We are all immigrants. These people are no different than your family when they came over.

 

In this case I think what happened was what should have happened. I'm glad the people that are making the decisions don't share your view in this case.

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I don't think those analogies are remotely applicable to this particular story or my point. That whole "with that line of thought" argument that has been going around here lately makes it really easy to take a point and make it illogical.


There is a difference between your analogy and my point, a big one, you know it and I know it. I understand the illegality of Immigrants but this guy has a family here in the US. His whole life is here. His kids don't know anything else and uprooting them from the only thing they know and moving them to Mexico isn't the right thing to do.


I'm not claiming to have a solution and I'm not attempting to draw any lines, I'm just saying that what happened here is what I believe should have happened.

 

 

Well, they are all analogous in the vein of committing a "victimless" crime (if there really is such a thing).

 

Do I think we need a much better solution to the problem? Yup, I do. But just because someone has been committing a crime for many years is no reason to let them continue to do so, even if letting them do so benefits others that have committed no crime. Make sense/

 

However, I also feel that family is important, and while I think HE should have taken care of this years ago, I can't say I really disagree with giving him the opportunity to do it right at this point. If he's been a good hard-working law-abiding family man for all these years, then I don't have a problem giving him a chance to make this right.

 

That doesn't mean I think this should be common practce though.

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Well, they are all analogous in the vein of committing a "victimless" crime (if there really is such a thing).


Do I think we need a much better solution to the problem? Yup, I do. But just because someone has been committing a crime for many years is no reason to let them continue to do so, even if letting them do so benefits others that have committed no crime. Make sense/


However, I also feel that family is important, and while I think HE should have taken care of this years ago, I can't say I really disagree with giving him the opportunity to do it right at this point. If he's been a good hard-working law-abiding family man for all these years, then I don't have a problem giving him a chance to make this right.


That doesn't mean I think this should be common practce though.

 

 

I agree on pretty much everything.

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You are entitled to think what you want but if I put myself in his position it's a heartbreaking thought to be separated from my family. Or to get to Mexico and not be able to provide for them. I'm a sympathizer to a point. I can't see how people are all of a sudden against what made this country so great. We are all immigrants. These people are no different than your family when they came over.


In this case I think what happened was what should have happened. I'm glad the people that are making the decisions don't share your view in this case.

 

 

Actually, not triue. When my family came here around the turn of the century, they came here legally. They did it the right way. Immigration IS what makes tihs country great and what it was built on. However, I don't think it's too much to ask to do it the right way, like my ancestors and the ancestors of millions and millions of people in this country did.

 

I'n not anti-immigration at all. I'm anti-illegal immigration.

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Actually, not triue. When my family came here around the turn of the century, they came here legally. They did it the right way. Immigration IS what makes tihs country great and what it was built on. However, I don't think it's too much to ask to do it the right way, like my ancestors and the ancestors of millions and millions of people in this country did.


I'n not anti-immigration at all. I'm anti-illegal immigration.

 

 

And I'd be willing to bet that if your family tried to immigrate today it would be a completely different experience. Immigration is backlogged, underfunded, and overloaded. One of the reasons is that there is no clear direction or guidance. Without a direction we are spinning our wheels.

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I can't see how people are all of a sudden against what made this country so great. We are all immigrants. These people are no different than your family when they came over.

 

 

Who's against what made this country great?

 

But, these people are different from my family, bro. My family's been here legally. My family's been paying fudging taxes!

...and my family speaks fluent English. Sorry, but where I come from, clear communication is that important. Communication errors cost. BIG time.

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BTW, are companies not held responsible for employing illegals? Seems that would be the best income-tax solution... Company payroll handles checks, right? Joe Mexico gets a check right? Wait... Cash under the table! How do they cook those books?

 

I say don't raid and arrest the people. Slap a huge fine the company that employs the illegal immigrants! If companies are forced to make an effort to check their employees' Visa status or pay huge consequences, I figure there'd be a lot fewer job openings for illegal immigrants.

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You are entitled to think what you want but if I put myself in his position it's a heartbreaking thought to be separated from my family. Or to get to Mexico and not be able to provide for them. I'm a sympathizer to a point. I can't see how people are all of a sudden against what made this country so great. We are all immigrants. These people are no different than your family when they came over.


In this case I think what happened was what should have happened. I'm glad the people that are making the decisions don't share your view in this case.

 

 

My family didn't come over illegally. I put myself in the position of the guy that's been waiting for years to immigrate to the U.S. legally and can't. My heart breaks for him.

I am all in favor of planned immigration. It's silly to try to compare allowing floods of immigrants into a wide open, relatively empty land of 100 years ago to the population/opportunity situation of today. It just makes no sense.

You apparently can only see this one isolated case. My heart would lead me to the same conclusion that yours has....for one case. My head tells me that there are probably thousands of cases just like it though and it sets a precedent that is blatantly unfair to the thousands around the world waiting to immigrate legally.

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BTW, are companies not held responsible for employing illegals? Seems that would be the best income-tax solution... Company payroll handles checks, right? Joe Mexico gets a check right? Wait... Cash under the table! How do they cook those books?


I say don't raid and arrest the people. Slap a huge fine the company that employs the illegal immigrants! If companies are forced to make an effort to check their employees' Visa status or pay huge consequences, I figure there'd be a lot fewer job openings for illegal immigrants.

 

 

Good point.

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Who's against what made this country great?

 

 

People that think we need to kick all the illegals out. Honestly it's not only not feasible, but it goes against what we stand for. I am not going to say just give everyone a pass, but I'm certainly not going to take a broad stroke at it and say "get all them aliens out of my country".

 

 

But, these people are different from my family, bro. My family's been here legally. My family's been paying fudging taxes!

 

 

Understood, but your family at some point faced the same decision that these people did. Also many of them pay taxes just like you and me.

 

 

...and my family speaks fluent English. Sorry, but where I come from, clear communication is that important. Communication errors cost. BIG time.

 

 

Many of them speak fluent english as well. I think you are getting caught up in what you think an Immigrant is rather than what they are actually like. There are of course people who don't speak a lick of english, but there are a lot that do. Trust me I grew up in California. If there is anyone that knows about illegals it's Californian's:D

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It's sad to see a family broken up but that's the risk they take. Breaking the law is breaking the law. If I rob a bank and get away with it for a few years, nobody says, "whatever, we'll let it go". All I want is the existing immigration laws vigorously enforced. If you're illegal, get out. If you've made some kind of family, now is the time to make a chioce.

 

And to set the record straight, they are not illegal immigrants, they are illegal ALIENS.

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