Changing with the times.

[Outkaster]

I play in a band that seriously wants to revamp it's sound. I have a no problem with that. Problem is that the music they want to play will adhere to a younger audience. We as a band are not young anymore. Our girl singers are in their 20's and I am late thirties myself and we are the youngest members. The rest of the band is mid forties and fifties. Even though we sound good I just do not think we can compete with that crowd. I see top 40 bands do that and it looks stupid, at least to me. Then I get the reaction "oh you are being negative" or "Hey Quincy Jones stays with the times" argument from the other members. For me the older music is better, to play, to perform and to listen too. I cannot see people in their 20's coming to see us.

 

Maybe it is just me but al ot of stuff out there now does not move me. I try to stay with the latest trends just to know what is going on out there but I feel bands and musicianship is just a dying commodity. I know you cannot be selfish in a band but how much do you sacrafice yourself for it?????

[Tedster]

I would have to say...who are the backup bands for some of these "hotter" touring acts...singers, y'know? I bet you get any 19 year old diva who's touring nationally, and see who's in the band that's backing her up, and you won't find too many 19 year olds.

 

The point is...know thine audience. If your audience is the 35-55 year old once-divorced-single-on-the-prowl-again type, then stay with music they like. If you want a younger audience, if the gal who's singing is 20, that's certainly not old by any stretch of the imagination.

[SpacedCowboy]

OutK, I'm not gonna post one of those "hell no, don't sacrifice your integrity, live and die by doing what YOU want and to hell with anyone who says different! It's all about ART, man, audiences are sheep anyway!"

 

Dude, even MY band, the kings of "we'll sink or swim on our own terms" are learning some of the more commercial stuff for this weekend just so we can do the gig with our heads intact. (That said, we're still keeping our originals in the sets, though. )

 

All I'm going to say is, if you OR the band are not comfortable playing the (for lack of a better term) more "modern" stuff, then it won't matter anyway if it attracts a younger audience. If all of you in 3 months time will be looking down at your set lists and rolling your eyes and groaning, then you're gonna have problems in the long run.

 

I don't know how you're gonna convince the other guys in the band of this, since they're seeing things in terms of "wider demographic, more gigs, more money" right now. But it's something I'd seriously discuss with them before you go down that path.

 

My worthless two cents? If you're gonna do more up-to-date, "appeals to the teens and tweens" stuff, do it because you want to, not because you HAVE to. I made the mistake of trying to do that stuff with my old band because I thought if we don't do this, we won't be competitive and the bands that ARE doing it will eat us alive.

 

I did it for about 6 months before I finally had enough, quit the band and took a job in North Carolina. It was THAT bad.

[Prog]

Put a big mirror in your practice room and watch yourselves playing the latest from Fiddy Cent.

 

Or video tape the performance and post it on Myspace. Your feedback will be telling.

[Outkaster]

Originally posted by SpacedCowboy OutK, I'm not gonna post one of those "hell no, don't sacrifice your integrity, live and die by doing what YOU want and to hell with anyone who says different! It's all about ART, man, audiences are sheep anyway!" Dude, even MY band, the kings of "we'll sink or swim on our own terms" are learning some of the more commercial stuff for this weekend just so we can do the gig with our heads intact. (That said, we're still keeping our originals in the sets, though. ) All I'm going to say is, if you OR the band are not comfortable playing the (for lack of a better term) more "modern" stuff, then it won't matter anyway if it attracts a younger audience. If all of you in 3 months time will be looking down at your set lists and rolling your eyes and groaning, then you're gonna have problems in the long run. I don't know how you're gonna convince the other guys in the band of this, since they're seeing things in terms of "wider demographic, more gigs, more money" right now. But it's something I'd seriously discuss with them before you go down that path. My worthless two cents? If you're gonna do more up-to-date, "appeals to the teens and tweens" stuff, do it because you want to, not because you HAVE to. I made the mistake of trying to do that stuff with my old band because I thought if we don't do this, we won't be competitive and the bands that ARE doing it will eat us alive. I did it for about 6 months before I finally had enough, quit the band and took a job in North Carolina. It was THAT bad.

 

Yeah I do not know. Guess I am sort of afraid that if I quit I will not have anything left. They kind of need me more than I need them in a way. It is not to be mean or anything but that is just how I feel. I guess I will freelance a bit more to see what is out there.

[JacieFB]

The thing about trends that younger people like is that once you hear it, it's too late. By the time you've re-vamped your sound, the sound has already changed. It's like software updates. I encourage finding things you like and blending it with brand new things. My opinion is blending things is what will go somewhere. Perhaps take elements of the style you're trying to "re-vamp" to and blend it with something else.

 

Bottom line, play what makes you happy and speaks to your soul, or you won't want to do it anymore. Unless there is a big fat paycheck involved. Which there rarely is.

[fastplant]

One thing I've noticed is that it's not how old you are, it's how old you look. If you guys look younger then by all means do the newer stuff. But if you look like my grandfather, then maybe you should stick to the older stuff.

[Brian Krashpad]

 

Originally posted by fastplant One thing I've noticed is that it's not how old you are, it's how old you look.

 

 

Hair is a big thing to some people I think.

 

If you're gray, you "look old." They make chemicals for that.

 

If you don't have any hair, you can just shave your head or wear it cropped really really short.

 

BK

[fastplant]

 

Originally posted by Brian Krashpad Hair is a big thing to some people I think. If you're gray, you "look old." They make chemicals for that. If you don't have any hair, you can just shave your head or wear it cropped really really short. BK

 

 

And keep in shape. There's plenty of awesome rockers around in their 50's that could pass for someone in their 30's because they take care of themselves, if you're grey, bald and/or out of shape and you're unwilling to change that, then older music is your best bet.

[Brian Krashpad]

Originally posted by fastplant And keep in shape. There's plenty of awesome rockers around in their 50's that could pass for someone in their 30's because they take care of themselves, if you're grey, bald and/or out of shape and you're unwilling to change that, then older music is your best bet.

 

I'm continually amazed that young kids and even those who aren't kids but are still much younger than I will play with me.

 

My bassist just turned 21, and the outgoing rhythm guitarist in my band is about 22. The drummer is in his early 30s I think, and a new guy auditioning to replace him is in his late 20's I'd guess.

 

So, surrounding yourself with younger people doesn't hurt either.

 

 

BK

[doubleR]

Originally posted by fastplant And keep in shape. There's plenty of awesome rockers around in their 50's that could pass for someone in their 30's because they take care of themselves, if you're grey, bald and/or out of shape and you're unwilling to change that, then older music is your best bet.

 

Not to brag or anything, but I'll be 49 in March, and I think I look pretty decent for my age. I've been working out three times a week for over 20 years, and I also try and eat right.

 

About five years ago, when my hair was starting to go grey, I went into the barbershop and told them to take their clippers and buzz off my below-the-shoulders hair. In my opinion, nothing looks worse than aging rockers (think David Crosby) with long grey ponytails, or even worse, long grey ponytails with no hair on top.

 

 

[zookie]

What's motivating this revamping? Are you trying to get booked at 20-something clubs and finding it difficult?

 

I ask because I'm older (40) and have long played music that doesn't lend itself to dance clubs. I've found there's a market for just about everything out there. There are other people hitting middle age who do enjoy listening to music that resonates with them, whatever the genre.

 

I do make tweaks and adjustments to our setlist and stage presence but mostly based on audience input. I keep a mental note of every request and if a pattern develops, we'll learn those songs. Our demographic is well over 30, so we tend to play earlier shows after hearing how tough it is for some people to be out past midnight, etc.

 

I guess all I'm saying is, if it ain't broke don't fix it.

[Jimi Ray Halen]

Originally posted by Outkaster I play in a band that seriously wants to revamp it's sound. I have a no problem with that. Problem is that the music they want to play will adhere to a younger audience. We as a band are not young anymore. Our girl singers are in their 20's and I am late thirties myself and we are the youngest members. The rest of the band is mid forties and fifties. Even though we sound good I just do not think we can compete with that crowd. I see top 40 bands do that and it looks stupid, at least to me. Then I get the reaction "oh you are being negative" or "Hey Quincy Jones stays with the times" argument from the other members. For me the older music is better, to play, to perform and to listen too. I cannot see people in their 20's coming to see us. Maybe it is just me but al ot of stuff out there now does not move me. I try to stay with the latest trends just to know what is going on out there but I feel bands and musicianship is just a dying commodity. I know you cannot be selfish in a band but how much do you sacrafice yourself for it?????

 

Ideally it's best to have enough material to play to a crowd. They don't have to come see you or stay. So play what they like. Older crowd? Play more classic stuff. College kids? More new stuff. Some songs cross over and are popular with both.

My criteria for songs are:

1. Is it a big hit? Does it get played a lot on the radio?

2. Is it danceable?

3. Is it real popular with women?

4. Is it a song that a band member really wants to do (and can do well) that fits any of the above criteria? As long as 75% of the songs fit into at least one of these categories then do it.

 

I like a lot of the new stuff (i'm 48) so I have no problem playing Foo Fighters (not easy), Audioslave, Green Day, Velvet Revolver, etc.

 

Hell, at one point in my life I would have rather had my ass kicked than play a dance song like Play That Funky Music White Boy. Now? {censored}, that song gets the girls dancing as soon as you start the opening riff. Like magic. Now I love it. Do I listen to it at home? No way.

 

Is that selling out? Is watching happy women dance right in front of you selling out?

If it is then call me a sell out.

 

I've been called much worse.

 

As far as the age thing goes, as long as you play the songs well with some enthusiasm, the audiences are very forgiving about age, looks, etc. Ask yourself this - if you went to see a band and they had a great female lead singer who really knew how to hold a crowd, but she wasn't all that great looking - would you leave the club?

[Hamer Player]

Originally posted by Outkaster I play in a band that seriously wants to revamp it's sound. I have a no problem with that. Problem is that the music they want to play will adhere to a younger audience. We as a band are not young anymore. Our girl singers are in their 20's and I am late thirties myself and we are the youngest members. The rest of the band is mid forties and fifties. Even though we sound good I just do not think we can compete with that crowd. I see top 40 bands do that and it looks stupid, at least to me. Then I get the reaction "oh you are being negative" or "Hey Quincy Jones stays with the times" argument from the other members. For me the older music is better, to play, to perform and to listen too. I cannot see people in their 20's coming to see us. Maybe it is just me but al ot of stuff out there now does not move me. I try to stay with the latest trends just to know what is going on out there but I feel bands and musicianship is just a dying commodity. I know you cannot be selfish in a band but how much do you sacrafice yourself for it?????

 

I don't change with the times at all. I live in 1978 through 1988. If you're existing outside that box, I don't acknowledge you!

[JacieFB]

Originally posted by Hamer Player I don't change with the times at all. I live in 1978 through 1988. If you're existing outside that box, I don't acknowledge you!

 

I'm actually reverting back to different times by trying to channel 1978-1984 Sting/Police...Yeah, I might have a problem.

[Outkaster]

 

Originally posted by zookie What's motivating this revamping? Are you trying to get booked at 20-something clubs and finding it difficult? I ask because I'm older (40) and have long played music that doesn't lend itself to dance clubs. I've found there's a market for just about everything out there. There are other people hitting middle age who do enjoy listening to music that resonates with them, whatever the genre. I do make tweaks and adjustments to our setlist and stage presence but mostly based on audience input. I keep a mental note of every request and if a pattern develops, we'll learn those songs. Our demographic is well over 30, so we tend to play earlier shows after hearing how tough it is for some people to be out past midnight, etc. I guess all I'm saying is, if it ain't broke don't fix it.

 

 

No not at all. We are not playing top forty, it is cultural music with a very hard crowd to deal with but these guys want to be hip and go where the music is.

 

Like I said it is not a bad idea and they want to do some basic sequencing on stage. I guess sometimes being a musician seems like an antiquated thing.

[Scheming Demon]

My golden rule for the last 10 years or so, is am I having fun or will I have fun playing this music. If the answer is no than I would rather be alone in my basement playing music I love.

 

Therefore I only join bands playing music that I can devote 100% enthusiasm for.

 

I've spent way too many years compromising and playing music I really didn't like just to be in a band and play out.

 

Some people can enjoy playing almost anything and others have very narrow parameters of what moves them.

 

If you're not enjoying what you're doing than what is the point? Unless you're making enough money to make it worth your while. In that case it might as well be a job because it is.

[Scafeets]

My cover band was dealing with the same issue last Spring. We're all 40 and 50-somethings, except our lead singer is 33, in great shape, single and the designated chick magnet.

 

We added a few newer tunes over the summer and revamped a few others. For instance: Ataris version of Boys of Summer instead of the original. (I know - that's not all that new; but comparatively speaking)...

 

Well, the stuff went over with the older crowd, plus the 20-somethings like it a lot. One of the places we play regularly is an upscale biker bar, and the youngest people in the place are the bartenders and waitresses. When they started jumping to the music and acting enthusiastically (and telling the owner we're the best band he books) we KNOW adding the newer tunes was a smart move.

 

It was painful to listen to all the new crap on the radio, and to check out everythng on the charts. But - go back and look up what the hits were in your favorite era: Chances are 90% of the hits really sucked then, too. So, we're finding some good, modern tunes that we can play without looking or sounding ridiculous.

 

We're not about to become a punk, metal or hip-hop act, but there's no reason a good cover band can't find a half-dozen recent hits and put them in their setlist.

[Brian Krashpad]

Originally posted by Hamer Player I don't change with the times at all. I live in 1978 through 1988. If you're existing outside that box, I don't acknowledge you!

 

Haha, in 2001, we finagled our way onto a local "best bands" list in the independent university newspaper, which described me thusly:

 

For him, the history of popular music consists solely of the twenty-month span between the Ramones' debut and the Sex Pistols' demise. You know, where it should be.*

 

Slight hyperbole there.

 

 

BK

 

* full text:

http://www.alligator.org/edit/detours/issues/01-fall/010830/bands21.html

[Outkaster]

Thanks everyone. Out girl singer may be quiting so that will be a load off us. She lost her job and always has issues. She is not at practice more than she is there. This week was better I appreciate your help. Not sure how things will pan out hopefully for the best?

[SpacedCowboy]

Originally posted by Outkaster Thanks everyone. Out girl singer may be quiting so that will be a load off us. She lost her job and always has issues. She is not at practice more than she is there. This week was better I appreciate your help. Not sure how things will pan out hopefully for the best?

 

A chic singer with issues? Holy crap, somebody call Wolf Blitzer!!!

 

Just kidding, man. I've kinda been where you are now and hope everything works out for the best. Best of luck, man! Let us know if things turn around for the positive or the negative.

 

Oh, and any chic singers that I may have offended with the above post, two things:

 

1. I'm a singer myself.

 

2. I was just kidding. Don't send me your hate mail. Really. Don't.

[axe2 2001]

My band had a loyal following for 20 some years. We played the music of our time and enjoyed many years of doing what we wanted. We never did a song because it was popular but because it fit us and we liked it. About 5 years ago, our bass player left the band and we got a new guy. Actually a better musician. We figured since he was learning our stuff it would be a good oppertunity to update our list with more current material. BAD MOVE. Not that we changed format but I found we were learning songs for a certian age group that would never be at our shows. We lost alot of momentum and alot of our crowd seemed to not really care for our new material. We went from doing Judas priest, Ted nugent, Kiss and aerosmith to Stuff like the gin Blossoms and Tonic and for god sake , Blink 182 came up as a suggestion! (I had to stomp that) . It's all Rock and Roll to me and I do like some of ythe newer stuff but I think our crowd and me felt it was sort of selling out. So much to the point that my drummer and I started a side project doing what we do best and it feels way better. Bottom line, Be who you are and things will work out better, in my opinion.