Members Badside Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 It is finally taking off! I've been writing and recording song demos for the last few weeks, but I'm afraid! Right now we are a very successful coverband that gigs regularly and the idea is to start a parallel project to play our own stuff. What I'm afraid of is: other members losing interest if it doesn't kick off quick enough. See, this original stuff is pretty much my stuff since I write 95% of the music and lyrics, which somehow makes them my band, but I don't see it that way. To me, the way everyone play their part, their performance, their stage persona, all contributes to a whole that his much greater than the "sum of the songs". The thing is, I don't care doing a gig on a Tuesday night with no pay if it means playing our stuff to new people. I don't care putting all the money I get from the cover gigs into recording the album. But do they? If they only accept high profile or paying gigs, it will never work. That's why we quit the original thing 5 years ago: it's much easier to get gigs and money playing covers.I could always find another drummer and another bassist, people who wouldn't be too involved in other projects and would truly believe in my stuff, would be open to playing low-profile non paying gigs, who would poor their heart in soul into recording an album that may never sell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarmook Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 You need to make doubly sure that everyone in the band is on-board. It sounds like a very dangerous situation to use a cover band to fund an originals band, especially if 'they' see the originals thing as 'your band'... If they don't have some sense of ownership of the original band, they're not gonna want to fund it, and right now, you're making it sound like they don't have ownership, because they think it's 'yours'... Be very careful - you might end up with NO bands... A compromise postition might be that the originals band doesn't get paid, that any money the band makes playing originals goes to the 'band fund', and if YOU want to contribute on the side to that fund to put the album project together, the money you use is counted separately... (and reimbursed separately from sales, not performances...) again, you gotta give them a reason to play your songs with you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members vanlatte Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 Originally posted by Hardtailed It is finally taking off! I've been writing and recording song demos for the last few weeks, but I'm afraid! Right now we are a very successful coverband that gigs regularly and the idea is to start a parallel project to play our own stuff. What I'm afraid of is: other members losing interest if it doesn't kick off quick enough. Only you can answer that, with the input of the rest of the band. Have you guys discussed this and do they know you are concerned about their commitment level if it doesnt "take off"? Speaking of that, it might be a good idea to define what "taking off" really means so everyone has the same expectations. Originally posted by Hardtailed The thing is, I don't care doing a gig on a Tuesday night with no pay if it means playing our stuff to new people. I don't care putting all the money I get from the cover gigs into recording the album. But do they? See above... Make sure you guys are all on the same page here. Originally posted by Hardtailed Anyway, the current line-up WORKS, we have a chemistry on stage that is hard to beat. This is why I've done the cover thing for so long: playing with these guys is so much fun, it doesn't feel like we're a cover band. It's like what we play doesn't matter, give us a stage and a crowd, it's all that matters to us. You have a nice head start, a lot of bands transition into this. Hopefully some of them here will chime in... Originally posted by Hardtailed Anyway, sorry for the long post, but basically I need tips on how to get an original project off the ground while keeping everyone motivated. Do you think we can make it, or am I just screwed? Any tips for "jumpstarting" a band without spending 3 years in the basement? (Beside the obvious: write good songs!) I really don't feel like auditioning new musicians. At least the singer is in all the way! You guys really need to define "making it". It can mean different things to different people, and first and foremost you should check with the people in the band and find out what they think making it really means. For some it is the satisfaction of playing their own music, regardless of income. For others it is a regional tour, or selling CDs, becoming the #1 draw in the country...or...it could be a number of things, really. A lot of band problems can be avoided by having a clear mission statement from the get go. Without that there is the chance that everyone is expecting something different and that only leads to bad things. Either way, good luck with this! There are plenty of vets. here that I am sure will have some great input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 Since you're the main songwriter, you may have to find new guys to play in that band, and have them work for you. You may even find it more desireable in the long run. I tried it with my old band. a cover band made up of fair to competent players, some were even pretty good, but their vision was for a party band where they could work their day jobs all week, go to rehearsal once a week to drink beer, learn a song or two, drink beer, fix some things in the older stuff, drink beer, and drink beer. On the weekends, the gigs were to play for their friends and drink beer and make a few bucks. I introduced some originals, and we did them, but as soon as I started talking about making a CD and travelling, seeing how far we could take it, I started getting resistance. They had what they wanted, and they weren't about to have me rock the boat. I did one CD with them, got us into some festivals, got us some national press, a website, etc etc and when I proposed a second CD and getting an agency to handle the booking, the heels dug in and I got vetoed. So, I quit and started my own band (I tried doing both, but it just wasn't viable since there was no weeknight work around here to speak of). So I basically hired guys to work for me, and it worked well for about 4 years, until I got tired of traveling and having to fight harder for less money in a shrinking market and just went out as a single for awhile. If you can do it with the same group of guys, that's great. Some guys can. But I would urge you sit down with your band and ask them to do some serious soul searching about what would they do if you got an opportunity to go for all the marbles with no guarantees. Make sure they understand that it will likelymean Because what I found is thast as long as it was discussion over beer, they were all for it, but when it came time to actually make the commitment to jump off the boat into the water, they wouln't or couldn't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Badside Posted February 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 RE: GuitarmookWell that's the thing, I don't want it to be "my" band. Although I write the base material, the finished songs are the results of everyone's individual style. When I record demos with the singer and compare them with the tracks I did, it's definitely not the same song anymore. I do feel like I'm walking on thin ice and I'd love to find a compromise between playing "my" songs and not playing originals at all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Badside Posted February 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 Originally posted by BlueStrat ... what I found is thast as long as it was discussion over beer, they were all for it, but when it came time to actually make the commitment to jump off the boat into the water, they wouln't or couldn't do it. Well that's pretty much on the spot! So far, most of our "meetings" have been at a bar between sound check and show time! I guess it's time for a serious meeting. If I can't get enough commitment, I'll have to do the album with just the singer so we can change musicians at will and retain our band name and material and not have to start from scratch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members THX1138 Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 My two cents here.... Van and BS made some very good points. Smart fellas, those two. Definately gotta be on the same page all the way around. I'm talkin musical direction, gig expectations, goals... everything. If you're talkin about being the main force, but you still invite open input, then to you personally I'd say - check your ego at the door.... cause its not always going to go according to your plans. If you feel strongly enough about the rest of the guys, then you're gonna have to be willing to compromise in some areas. However, if your vision is "your" vision and won't be allowed to be driven askew (and there's nothing wrong with this way either) then it might be best to go the hired guns route. Its either a democracy or a dictatorship, and it needs to be firmly outlined from the start. On the gigs - If you want to go all original and toss the covers aside, be prepared to share the bill with four other bands per night, and expect enough pay to split an order of fries after the show. Sorry, but thats pretty much the way it goes. My best advice is to institute a plan whereby you ease the originals into your set, but at the same time, direct your cover selection into a more defined niche. In some time, you can change your identity. Not that I wrote the "how-to" book on this subject, but we've enjoyed moderate success by splitting our show about 50/50 originals to covers - more or less either way depending on the venue. But the key for us has been to present whatever covers we do as a full on rock band regardless. We play Dr Feelgood and Devil Went Down to Georgia with the same rock attitude. Basically, we want to build a fan base who knows what to expect from us. Oh yeah... and having good original material doesn't hurt either. A good song sells itself. You just have to put as many ears on it as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Badside Posted February 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 THX: thanks for the comments. I don't really feel like it's "my way or the highway", actually I want to stay away from that. I'm writing most of the material mostly out of "necessity" so to speak, but I really want this to be a group effort. I thought, if I bring in the base material, we can then work out the songs as a group, although I have this tendency to put out demos that are almost over produced, there's not much space left for change. I do it mostly because I feel the demo is a way for me to "sell" my songs to the other guys so I want it to be the best as possible (I spend 10-20 hours per song, not including the actual songwriting, which happens mostly in my head). Perhaps I should change this approach a bit, I guess it kinda "paint them in a corner". A co-worker mentionned my demos sound better than some "real" albums!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cherri Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 I wrote then deleted this long bumbling reply which essentially said: My best advice is to institute a plan whereby you ease the originals into your set, but at the same time, direct your cover selection into a more defined niche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 Originally posted by Hardtailed Anyway, the current line-up WORKS, we have a chemistry on stage that is hard to beat. This is why I've done the cover thing for so long: playing with these guys is so much fun, it doesn't feel like we're a cover band. It's like what we play doesn't matter, give us a stage and a crowd, it's all that matters to us. And that's a big deal. My band is like that too, although we started from the opposite approach: we've always considered ourselves an "original band" and formed as one, but we sometimes do cover gigs - for variety and because the pay is better. We have fun no matter what we do, but we're also always very clear about what the goal of each type of gig is. That's the key thing as others have mentioned. As far as using your "cover gigs" to promote your originals, that rarely ever works. I can probably count on one hand the number of our CD's we've sold at cover gigs, even though we tend to sneak a few originals into our cover shows and the crowds like them. Like you say, they aren't there to hear your originals in those situations, they mostly just want to hear stuff that's familar to them and they can dance to. It kind of sucks that things have become so narrowly formatted, but that's the way it is. BUT, we do often use the pay we get from cover gigs to fund expenses having to do with the original band, cool promotional ideas and things like that. Which works great... but it presumes that everyone is on board with being an original band. So, like a lot of guys here are saying, you definitely have to make sure everybody's on the same page about this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted February 2, 2006 Members Share Posted February 2, 2006 Originally posted by Hardtailed ... I have this tendency to put out demos that are almost over produced, there's not much space left for change. I do it mostly because I feel the demo is a way for me to "sell" my songs to the other guys so I want it to be the best as possible (I spend 10-20 hours per song, not including the actual songwriting, which happens mostly in my head). Perhaps I should change this approach a bit, I guess it kinda "paint them in a corner". Very astute observation! Yeah, definitely I would change that. Just give them a rough demo or even just show up and play them the song, and let them come up with their own parts. It makes a huge difference not only to the outcome of the song, but everybody's attitude. It will also give you an idea how good they are at coming up with original parts for your songs. Some musicians are good at that, others have a tough time making the transition from just having to be in a cover band and learn someone else's parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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