Sending CD's to record labels?

[DonaldDemon]

Is it worth the time to send local record labels demo/self-produced CD's?

 

My original band has been working on our first full album and have about 7 songs done but unmixed due to $$$ issues (surprised?). By the time it's done we will have about 11 songs total. I was thinking about sending some CD's to record lables in the area just to see if we get any interest.

 

The album wasn't made with the intention to become rock stars but more as something to sell on our own, promote, give to friends, and most importantly; for us! I was thinking that if we could find an indie label to help us put the album out properly and professionally that would be much easier and cheaper if they were interested enough. Of course, if a bigger label was interested that would be great as well, but I just don't think sending them a random CD will get us anywhere. They probably get a flood of them and it wouldn't even make it to the A&R's secretary desk, which is why we are setting our standards a bit lower and realisticaly.

 

I am in the NJ area and there seems to be alot of labels between here, Philly, and NYC so finding them will not be a problem. My questions are:

 

1.) IS it worth the time and effort? Do they even listen to them or will it most likely get tossed in a pile or worse, the trash?

 

2.) What should we send them musically? Do we send the whole album when its completed? Do we send them something like a demo with a few songs or maybe clips of songs?

 

3.) What sort of packaging should they be sent in? Would it be unprofessional to send a CD-R with just our name in marker and songs listed? Should we go the whole 9 yards and get the CD's packaged as if they were ready to be sold?

 

4.) Any extras to send along with it like press kits, photos, articles, show flyers, etc.?

 

I would really appreciate any help and with this because I am not sure how to go about it? Thanks!

[Ovation]

I wouldn't recommend sending the record label any CD's.

 

I believe they would end up in the trash (in the trash even faster if they are CD-R's)

 

I would recommend going to the label in person and trying to get an appointment to talk about your music.

 

(I owned a bar once and we didn't have nearly enough time to listen to all of the CD's that got sent in, I can't imahine what it's like for a recod label, probably 100 times more.)

 

Just my 2 cents.

[DonaldDemon]

 

Originally posted by Ovation I wouldn't recommend sending the record label any CD's. I believe they would end up in the trash (in the trash even faster if they are CD-R's) I would recommend going to the label in person and trying to get an appointment to talk about your music. (I owned a bar once and we didn't have nearly enough time to listen to all of the CD's that got sent in, I can't imahine what it's like for a recod label, probably 100 times more.) Just my 2 cents.

 

 

Well if they don't have time to listen to a five minute song why would they schedule an appointment with me to go on about my band that they never heard of? Wouldn't that be wasting their time even more because they then have to enterain me while I try to convince them they should support us? I don't mean to bash your suggestion, just make some sense out of it.

[JacieFB]

I would recommend sending to every label that will accept unsolicited demos that is somewhat close to your genre. It's a bit like playing the lottery, but most of the ones that promise "to listen to every cd" they get on their web sites will usually do that. Expect to hear back from about 5% or less of who you actually send to. Within that 5%, you'll likely get some good suggestions as to what the label is really looking for and what to do to make yourself more marketable with respect to any label.

Don't waste your time sending to places that will not accept unsolicited demos. They will throw your cd in the trash just to spite you.

[BlueStrat]

 

Originally posted by DonaldDemon Well if they don't have time to listen to a five minute song why would they schedule an appointment with me to go on about my band that they never heard of? Wouldn't that be wasting their time even more because they then have to enterain me while I try to convince them they should support us? I don't mean to bash your suggestion, just make some sense out of it.

 

 

Well, if were working for a record company, I would be more inclined to listen to something if someone actually bothered to approach me in person rather than just send me another one of thousands of CDs a year the company doesn't really need.

Because there are no shortages of bands, it really is up to you to make the effort.

 

Having said that, there is only so much an indie label can do for you, depending on which one you go with. The one I did (college road records) only paid for the CD (recording, mixing and off-site mastering) and nothing more. I paid them back out of proceeds from the CD. They also got me some advertising, but minimally so.

 

It all depends on what you want them to do for you. If you're already making your own CDs, there is no reason you can't get a distributor yourself. Quite frankly, most record companies don't take you on unless you can demonstrate that you don't really need them in the first place. Unless you're planning on trying to get signed by a major; that's a whole differnt deal.

 

I'd say call some indies and make an appointment to talk with someone. If they're interested, they'll tell you what to do next.

 

Best of luck to you.

[DonaldDemon]

 

Originally posted by JacieFB I would recommend sending to every label that will accept unsolicited demos that is somewhat close to your genre. It's a bit like playing the lottery, but most of the ones that promise "to listen to every cd" they get on their web sites will usually do that. Expect to hear back from about 5% or less of who you actually send to. Within that 5%, you'll likely get some good suggestions as to what the label is really looking for and what to do to make yourself more marketable with respect to any label. Don't waste your time sending to places that will not accept unsolicited demos. They will throw your cd in the trash just to spite you.

 

 

Sounds reasonable. I guess this is something they will list on their websites?

[DonaldDemon]

 

Originally posted by BlueStrat Well, if were working for a record company, I would be more inclined to listen to something if someone actually bothered to approach me in person rather than just send me another one of thousands of CDs a year the company doesn't really need. Because there are no shortages of bands, it really is up to you to make the effort. Having said that, there is only so much an indie label can do for you, depending on which one you go with. The one I did (college road records) only paid for the CD (recording, mixing and off-site mastering) and nothing more. I paid them back out of proceeds from the CD. They also got me some advertising, but minimally so. It all depends on what you want them to do for you. If you're already making your own CDs, there is no reason you can't get a distributor yourself. Quite frankly, most record companies don't take you on unless you can demonstrate that you don't really need them in the first place. Unless you're planning on trying to get signed by a major; that's a whole differnt deal. I'd say call some indies and make an appointment to talk with someone. If they're interested, they'll tell you what to do next. Best of luck to you.

 

 

Good Points there.

Actually that's what we are trying to do; find somebody to pay for the recording, mastering, and advertising. Even if that means paying back out of album sales proceeds, its still better than the cd taking FOREVER becaue noone has the money to put up front.

 

We probably could do the whole thing ourselves but it is taking way too long and costing too much not having the experience to do things correctly the first time.

[Psychotronic]

I used to work for a label as well as artist management and I'll tell you this, since you may not have been told this before:

 

Do NOT send unsolicited material to a record label, it WILL end up in the trash!

 

First, let's define what I mean by "unsolicited". That means, anything not brought to a label by either a management company or an entertainment lawyer.

 

Second, there is a good reason (from the label's perspective) as to why it gets dumped without a listen. There have been too many "artists" that have tried to sue labels because they sent something in and a few years later they hear their song (or a reasonable facsimile thereof) on the radio. A legitimate argument? Perhaps, perhaps not. The solution? NO more unsolicited material.

 

Finally, what can you do? Well, play out. A lot. Gain a fan base. Play everwhere and anywhere. For free, if necessary. If you're that good, they'll find you. Sounds reasonable? I didn't think so. You can try to network at the places industry types hang out at after work. Where is that? Dunno anymore, you'll need to figure that out for yourself. Attend industry conventions (SxSW, etc.), that's always a good place to start.

 

Good luck, treat it like a business, and be smart.

[BlueStrat]

 

Originally posted by DonaldDemon Good Points there. Actually that's what we are trying to do; find somebody to pay for the recording, mastering, and advertising. Even if that means paying back out of album sales proceeds, its still better than the cd taking FOREVER becaue noone has the money to put up front. We probably could do the whole thing ourselves but it is taking way too long and costing too much not having the experience to do things correctly the first time.

 

 

 

In that case, I'd at least rough out 4 or 5 songs and take them with you when you meet with the label guys. Make sure you tell them they're only rough mixes. They'll be able to tell if you have it going on or not. I'd also be prepared to answer questions they may have: what do you want to accomplish, how far are you willing to go, what do you expect them to do for you, and what can you do for them. You must know the answers to at least those questions before you go in to meet with them. If they suspect you haven't thought about them and can't answer them, the interview very well may be over.

 

Being that you aren't asking a lot of them, I would think you have a pretty good chance of finding someone who will front you the recording.

[MrKnobs]

Our record label, "13th House Records" gets about ten unsolicited submissions per week. I have no idea how the people are finding me, and you wouldn't believe some of the stuff in the cover letters and emails I get.

 

They all absolutely reek of desperation mixed with hope.

 

I always respond, I feel bad for them. "We are pleased to receive your material but be advised 13th House Records is currently a one artist label (owned by the artist). We'll be happy to keep your material on file should that arrangement change. We regret that we cannot return unsolicited material unless an addressed return envelope with correct postage was included. Best of luck to you guys with all your musical endeavors."

 

Terry D.

[LiveMusic]

To the original poster... not being a smart alec at all, trying to help you...

 

I'd say that if you are asking these questions, which are good questions, you should spend a month or two reading. Read some books on the music biz, read forums and websites, just read. Then you'll have a good feel and know what to ask. Many questions you posed will be answered by your reading.

 

In other words, by your asking these questions, I don't think you're ready. You're about to throw good money after bad.

 

Good luck!

[Badside]

 

Originally posted by DonaldDemon 2.) What should we send them musically? Do we send the whole album when its completed? Do we send them something like a demo with a few songs or maybe clips of songs? 3.) What sort of packaging should they be sent in? Would it be unprofessional to send a CD-R with just our name in marker and songs listed? Should we go the whole 9 yards and get the CD's packaged as if they were ready to be sold?

 

 

I'll let the other ones answer anything related to why and when you should send demos, but I think I can add something here:

 

2: An album and a demo are 2 completely different things. An album is meant to be listened from beginning to end by people who dig your music. A demo is a short and direct way to convince people your music is good. Normally 3 songs is enough, it allows to show off the different aspects of your music (if you choose them carefully) and not bore them with the more "artistic" numbers. Also, you might want to edit out any long intros so people can get hooked ASAP, remember, they don't know you, they have no clue the song really kicks in after 3 minutes.

 

3- in 2006, a CD-R with marker on it screams UNPROFESSIONAL. You can get stick-on labels for next to nothing, so there's no excuse. I just bought an Epson printer for next to nothing (99$CDN) that print directly on CDs, the results are amazing.

[DonaldDemon]

Originally posted by Psychotronic I used to work for a label as well as artist management and I'll tell you this, since you may not have been told this before: Do NOT send unsolicited material to a record label, it WILL end up in the trash! First, let's define what I mean by "unsolicited". That means, anything not brought to a label by either a management company or an entertainment lawyer. Second, there is a good reason (from the label's perspective) as to why it gets dumped without a listen. There have been too many "artists" that have tried to sue labels because they sent something in and a few years later they hear their song (or a reasonable facsimile thereof) on the radio. A legitimate argument? Perhaps, perhaps not. The solution? NO more unsolicited material. Finally, what can you do? Well, play out. A lot. Gain a fan base. Play everwhere and anywhere. For free, if necessary. If you're that good, they'll find you. Sounds reasonable? I didn't think so. You can try to network at the places industry types hang out at after work. Where is that? Dunno anymore, you'll need to figure that out for yourself. Attend industry conventions (SxSW, etc.), that's always a good place to start. Good luck, treat it like a business, and be smart.

 

If the label specifies that they accept unsolicated demos tham I guess it should not be a problem? We already do all those things you mentioned like playing out, networking, etc. Maybe I would be wasting my time, but I figured a few select companies might be worth the $4 postage to send them a CD.

[DonaldDemon]

 

Originally posted by LiveMusic To the original poster... not being a smart alec at all, trying to help you... I'd say that if you are asking these questions, which are good questions, you should spend a month or two reading. Read some books on the music biz, read forums and websites, just read. Then you'll have a good feel and know what to ask. Many questions you posed will be answered by your reading. In other words, by your asking these questions, I don't think you're ready. You're about to throw good money after bad. Good luck!

 

 

I have spent a fair amount of time reading books and internet sites but I would rather hear from common musicians who have gone through these experiences in the past.

 

It's not a problem of not being ready its just getting a feel of what to expect basically. At the age of 28 and being together with my current band for almost 3 years, we better damn well be ready! If not, then I may as well just scrap the album. I'm just weighing my options once the album is completed.

[LiveMusic]

I don't know of any bands making it by sending out demo's. Maybe they exist but I don't know of any. Everything I have read, it basically boils down to... build a huge following, they (labels) will come.

 

However, the industry is undergoing a paradigm shift. What is that you want? A big label deal and no control or do your own thing and total control? Or something in between? Anyway, the rules are being reinvented. Who knows where it will end up but you might figure out a way to make it by being creative. I mean locally and regionally, less likely, nationally.

 

I am one guy, at this time, a solo and sometimes a duo act. Songwriter dude but do some cover shows, as well. I have a lot of drive. I have often wondered... if one could find three other guys who all want it really bad and are willing to work their ass off... if you could do a lot of good by sheer work ethic. I don't mean work on creating music. I mean that once you got a good tight band, you work your ass off promoting. Four guys sure beats one guy out there flailing away.

 

I'm talking about phone calls, personal visits, whatever promotion entails. Or four guys building four street teams instead of one guy doing one. Etc.

 

Of course, finding four guys who would do such a thing is very unlikely.

[DonaldDemon]

 

Originally posted by LiveMusic What is that you want? A big label deal and no control or do your own thing and total control? Or something in between? Anyway, the rules are being reinvented. Who knows where it will end up but you might figure out a way to make it by being creative. I mean locally and regionally, less likely, nationally.

 

 

As I stated, we are not looking to the majors to give us a deal and tell us what kind of music to make. We have been and will continue to do things our way. I am thinking in terms of getting some promotional support for our album. Something to make up for the fact that we have full time jobs and no time to spend on marketing and distribution.

 

 

 

I'm talking about phone calls, personal visits, whatever promotion entails. Or four guys building four street teams instead of one guy doing one. Etc. Of course, finding four guys who would do such a thing is very unlikely.

 

 

Exactly, we are a three piece band but promotionally we are a one-piece:mad: .

[Psychotronic]

 

Originally posted by DonaldDemon If the label specifies that they accept unsolicated demos tham I guess it should not be a problem? We already do all those things you mentioned like playing out, networking, etc. Maybe I would be wasting my time, but I figured a few select companies might be worth the $4 postage to send them a CD.

 

 

If they accept them, great, but be careful -- I suspect some of them will attempt to take ownership of your material once you submit, so be sure to read any fine print!

[DonaldDemon]

 

Originally posted by Psychotronic If they accept them, great, but be careful -- I suspect some of them will attempt to take ownership of your material once you submit, so be sure to read any fine print!

 

 

True, I guess now would be a good time copyright our songs:D

 

I was once told by a studio engineer to NEVER copyright anything because of the great publicity you would get out of a lawsuit. It would actually make it look like your songs were worth stealing! I don't know if I agree but he did have an interesting point.

[Guitarella]

Originally posted by Psychotronic Finally, what can you do? Well, play out. A lot. Gain a fan base. Play everwhere and anywhere. For free, if necessary. If you're that good, they'll find you. Sounds reasonable? I didn't think so. You can try to network at the places industry types hang out at after work. Where is that? Dunno anymore, you'll need to figure that out for yourself. Attend industry conventions (SxSW, etc.), that's always a good place to start.

 

 

Hard to believe that you actually have to do "hard work" to make it and get a lucky break!

 

It's true. The musicians I know that have "made it" did it by building a following and creating their own buzz. You've gotta be able to draw a crowd, and if you have a following, industry people will be interested. Once you can do that, you get with a reputable booking agency or management company. (No, your friend Bob does not count as an "agent" and your girlfriend does not count as a "manager," even if they got business cards made at Kinko's.)

 

After that, it's all about networking. If you go to conventions and hang out in the right places, eventually you will meet a guy who knows a guy who can send an A&R rep to your show. Even still, many bands are seen by dozens of A&R guys before they ever get signed.

 

Keep plugging away at building a following. Many successful bands have made careers out of building their own empire instead of waiting for a big record company to snatch them up.

 

 

 

Edited to add: "Go to college first!"

[DonaldDemon]

Originally posted by Guitarella Hard to believe that you actually have to do "hard work" to make it and get a lucky break! It's true. The musicians I know that have "made it" did it by building a following and creating their own buzz. You've gotta be able to draw a crowd, and if you have a following, industry people will be interested. Once you can do that, you get with a reputable booking agency or management company. (No, your friend Bob does not count as an "agent" and your girlfriend does not count as a "manager," even if they got business cards made at Kinko's.) After that, it's all about networking. If you go to conventions and hang out in the right places, eventually you will meet a guy who knows a guy who can send an A&R rep to your show. Even still, many bands are seen by dozens of A&R guys before they ever get signed. Keep plugging away at building a following. Many successful bands have made careers out of building their own empire instead of waiting for a big record company to snatch them up. Edited to add: "Go to college first!"

 

The professional manager is good advice. A friend of our bassists was pushing to do it for us and I rejected the idea. Not only is he a friend with no real experience but he is 4'11" or something and couldn't grab someones attention if jumped up and down. I figure a good manager has presence to be noticed.

 

Edit to add: I went to college first! The music is my back-up plan but my full time job is a joke and I just don't fit in this 9 to 5 gig!

[BlueStrat]

Originally posted by DonaldDemon True, I guess now would be a good time copyright our songs:D I was once told by a studio engineer to NEVER copyright anything because of the great publicity you would get out of a lawsuit. It would actually make it look like your songs were worth stealing! I don't know if I agree but he did have an interesting point.

 

That's why you don't a) let lawyers record your band, and b) take legal advice from engineers!

[DonaldDemon]

[Guitarella]

 

Originally posted by DonaldDemon The professional manager is good advice. A friend of our bassists was pushing to do it for us and I rejected the idea. Not only is he a friend with no real experience but he is 4'11" or something and couldn't grab someones attention if jumped up and down. I figure a good manager has presence to be noticed. Edit to add: I went to college first! The music is my back-up plan but my full time job is a joke and I just don't fit in this 9 to 5 gig!

 

 

Not only that, but music festivals and good venues are usually used to working with the same agencies and managers over and over. They don't usually sit around and say, "which bands should we book?" They more often call the agency and say, "we need these nights filled -- who do you got?" It's easier for everyone when they're used to dealing with the same people and the same contracts all the time.

 

Ever notice how when bands come to your town, the same bands usually play in the same venues? Find out which clubs and which agencies are the cornerstones of the circuit you want to break into. Get to know people in THAT circuit specifically, instead of the music scene in general.

[cybersecretary]

 

At the age of 28 and being together with my current band for almost 3 years, we better damn well be ready! If not, then I may as well just scrap the album.

 

 

don't scrap it, do the record, try a bit longer. you will look back on it in 15 years and say wow, "I Got Better "

 

play for life no mater whether you make it or not.

a true artist will do their art whether they are recognized or not... they have to do it to express themselves... to live

 

i am working on a second round.. took a break kind of to raise a kid and work but it was always there i am 40 now just can't stop playing and living the dream.

 

can you say adiction?

obsessed?

 

i can tell you that in the 80's we got real close to getting bigger and better gigs.. 2,000 people was the max... with my husbsands all guy band. i helped with $$$ for rehearsals and recording, i did the photos and ran around with posters in the middle of the night for |"The Cat Club"did a record, got a manager, big buz.. nyc philly..offered a 50-50 publishing deal (what ever that means) turned it down because the suits wanted them to ax the drummer... bla bla bla...

stories like tis are a dime a dozen... great foder for stories, films...

 

so now i am 40 husband died of 'AIDS, and just finished my own "Album"

it is not a demo ...14 songs..

it is Indie in it's true form..

i did it all my self, art in photochop, labels, mac, ableton live5 gibson fender tele...

 

if i can't make it with a story like that then.. hey .. it's a f uped world..the U.S.

 

Europe subidized artists!

 

what am i to do with it?

take it to the 1/2 dozen local stores, hope they sell make 30.00 or 40.00 bucks from each.. CD baby? give aways,

i accomplished something and i think it is good. that is what counts.

 

.... till i get on with my next project.

 

 

lets backk up a bit..

6 years ago i co produced a compilation cd with other womens cuts on it and 3 of mine. used 2 studios.. inexpensive/friend discount. pressed and printed at Oasis..

i did the art..photoshop gods!

 

i took it to the local stores. made the invoices, played low playing crappy taverns and free benifits .... few big

i sAID, I LOVE TO PLAY AND WILL DO IT FOR FREE IF ASKED.

 

well now i need to get paid.

i would love to at least support my self with music.

i live on less than $19,00.00 a year at my crappy jobs..(up from 14 grand a few years ago but now that i don't want to work anymore except at my art i am sure to be strugglin unless i keep at it and treat it like a biz.)

i went to college..

if you play 3 nights a week for 100$ well thats the poverty level...

i am used to that!

 

if you do what you love.....

 

 

 

I am one guy, at this time, a solo and sometimes a duo act. Songwriter dude but do some cover shows, as well. I have a lot of drive. I have often wondered... if one could find three other guys who all want it really bad and are willing to work their ass off.

 

 

well i did it all by myself,

worked hard, everyday on the computer, no sleep no food...

going to SXSW again and try to meet people..

 

hey ya never know..

 

what i do want to know is...... who do i need to blow...

 

 

Make Art Not War

peace

[gtrbass]

Nowadays, a "demo" is just about unheard of. There are tons and tons of bands. The costs of making a halfway decent sounding CD are within reach of most musicians. If you send a label an unsolicited demo, it will be relegated to the trash bin - unopened.

 

Here's the standard drill. Take your recordings, master them, and press up 1000 units with Discmakers or somebody. Go get an account with CD Baby, and get some in local record stores on consignment. Also sell them at shows. That's about as good a distro as you will get, unless you have tremendous financial backing (that you can prove) Put up a band website, and the myspace page. (I'm sure this is nothing you haven't heard before.) If you do all that and are getting some attention locally, then you can approach some indie labels and they might take you seriously enough to listen to it.

 

Everybody says the majors don't do development anymore. That's true. Even indies are careful because they can't afford financial losses. Labels don't bother to listen to things because they "might" be great without some credibility or a story behind it. Just because so and so produced it, or so and so mixed it isn't the kind of cred I mean. If so and so is your manager, or so and so is your attorney AND they have had a financially beneficial relationship with mr. record guy in the past, then he will evaluate it. It's been screened by someone he sort of trusts not to bring him BS.

 

If you think labels are impressed by something that's good, think again. They are only impressed by things they think they can sell without expending too many resources. That's especially true for indies. When you believe in music, it's because you connect with it emotionally. Most label people started out that way, but are so immersed in the business that they have a very different view even if they are unconscious or in denial of it. They "believe" in music when they see a financial value in it for them. That's the way of the world.

 

Step one is to develop yourself.

Step two is to develop a relationship with those who can take you to the next level.

Step three is the next level after that and so on.

It's a slippery slope all the way and you basically have to do it in order because the mountain is full of other climbers.

 

There are no real shortcuts.