What is it with people copying music?

[Blackwatch]

They don't always get away with it though.....

 

http://www.dontbuycds.org/payola.htm

[roabre999]

I personally dont "share" music. i support the bands I listen to. If I like a band I buy their Cd. I will search up bands on ares or whoever and find songs I like then I go and purchase an album.

 

My kids are the same. I would have thougth they would have reams of downloaded songs. but almost every week I was driving them to the Cd store so they could buy Cd's. I asked them why, when it was possible to download the songs. They said when you burn a CD it gets scratched, wrecked, when they buy it they look after it, get the liner notes etc. They both have Ipods and rip CD's to their ipods but still buy Cd's.

[BATCAT]

Originally posted by shredfit I'm sure you can just get the record done for less...(I've heard plenty of them) However, I was refering to something that could really hold up to major label release... in quality, look, and sound.

 

I'm getting a little off the subject, but I really have to weigh in on this because I feel what your saying is inaccurate. You do not need a $5000 budget to make a great "professional" CD. (That word always makes me cringe)

 

Let use assume your first album will have 10-12 songs on it... Let's then assume that you band is super tight and all tracking/mixing can be done on $5,000-6,000 budget. Then, your group will need art work and photo's(your girlfriend with her new digital camera doesn't count) and you find someone to take photo's and design the CD art for a mere $800... Now you send your mix's to a mastering house for final touches(you want your selling product to be of high quality) and this is another $1,500. So now, it's time to get the product replicated, another $1,200(for 1000 copies).

 

There are excellent producers who record bands for peanuts... if you are connected and savvy you can find them, and to do so is worth the effort. I have also been in the position of spending 5 grand on a "name" guy who did such a poor job on the record it had to be remixed in it's entirety. (and even partially re-tracked)

 

There is a GREAT small studio in my city that has 24-track 2" tape... ...an amazing old 60's desk that sounds great, a good pro tools setup, great tracking room. You can get three days (lockout) there for $600.

 

Also, I'm sorry, but the concept that you need to pay someone a grand to do your album art, lest it appear amateur, is rubbish. Anyone who is decent at graphic design and good with the appropriate programs can make "professional quality." CD art (ugh, that term agian) Sometimes even someone in the band has the skill... actually I've seen some beautiful, inspired CD art done by the band. The machines that print the jackets don't know if you're signed to Sony or if you sold your car to make the record...

 

But... I will agree with you on mastering, thought I think you can probably get good results closer to $1000. Don't be cheap here, and go with a good, reputable place. And 1200 is reasonable for duplication.

 

You can do the whole thing, and do it well, for much less...

[Lee Knight]

 

Originally posted by Marlin in Minn "Well, I just don't see how one little copy will hurt them" Grrrr!!!! Does anyone else run into this mindset?

 

 

Does anyone else run into this mindset?????? Uh, yeah. I'm the "audio guy" for a large-ish corporation. You wouldn't believe the requests I get to "make a quick copy of the Black Eyes Peas CD". I used to explain my moral dilema to deaf ears. Now I just tell them I don't have 2 drives or some other crap.

[BlueStrat]

 

Originally posted by worthyjoe I have mixed emotions on this and here's how I break it down. As a band, I think you should be totally cool with people buying your CD, getting excited about your CD, and then burning copies for friends. I think in the big picture, obtaining a new "fan" is more valuable than the price of 1 CD. That fan would not have otherwise bought your CD or even known of you. Now they may buy them in the future and buy a ticket to your show - and bring friends. They may also burn it for friends of theirs.... and so on. I agree that people shouldn't be focused on getting music for free.. that's not cool. But I think it's a good thing for people to get excited about music and want to share it for free. So while you might not get every dime for your copyrighted material, when you gain fans, that always = $$ in the long run. Getting your music heard and accepted should be the only thing artists care about. They should lighten up and focus on making good music. The money will come.

 

 

I'm a little thick, I confess, but I'm not seeing how people getting my music for free benefits me. What good does it do to draw a larger crowd if it's not paying me more money? If 15 people have my CD that's been burned off of one that someone paid for, and they show up at a show, that doesn't translate into more sales money for me. I get paid a contracted amount, regardless of how many people show up. I do, however, depend on CD sales to defray expenses, since out of my pay I'm paying 4 other musicians a minimum, agent's commission, gas, truck maintenance, equipment maintenance, promo, etc etc. So, if 15 people who have my CD already come to a show, they're putting money in the promoter's pocket, but probably not mine, since they won't be buyng a CD they already (illegally) own.

 

Or am I missing something here?

 

BTW, I have heard from national acts that this scenario I described applies to them, as well. John Mayall, John Hammond, Lucky Peterson, all have complained about declining sales, even as their crowds get bigger, and chalk it up to piracy.

[shredfit]

Originally posted by Actionsquid I'm getting a little off the subject, but I really have to weigh in on this because I feel what your saying is inaccurate. You do not need a $5000 budget to make a great "professional" CD. (That word always makes me cringe) Let use assume your first album will have 10-12 songs on it... Let's then assume that you band is super tight and all tracking/mixing can be done on $5,000-6,000 budget. Then, your group will need art work and photo's(your girlfriend with her new digital camera doesn't count) and you find someone to take photo's and design the CD art for a mere $800... Now you send your mix's to a mastering house for final touches(you want your selling product to be of high quality) and this is another $1,500. So now, it's time to get the product replicated, another $1,200(for 1000 copies). There are excellent producers who record bands for peanuts... if you are connected and savvy you can find them, and to do so is worth the effort. I have also been in the position of spending 5 grand on a "name" guy who did such a poor job on the record it had to be remixed in it's entirety. (and even partially re-tracked) There is a GREAT small studio in my city that has 24-track 2" tape... ...an amazing old 60's desk that sounds great, a good pro tools setup, great tracking room. You can get three days (lockout) there for $600. Also, I'm sorry, but the concept that you need to pay someone a grand to do your album art, lest it appear amateur, is rubbish. Anyone who is decent at graphic design and good with the appropriate programs can make "professional quality." CD art (ugh, that term agian) Sometimes even someone in the band has the skill... actually I've seen some beautiful, inspired CD art done by the band. The machines that print the jackets don't know if you're signed to Sony or if you sold your car to make the record... But... I will agree with you on mastering, thought I think you can probably get good results closer to $1000. Don't be cheap here, and go with a good, reputable place. And 1200 is reasonable for duplication. You can do the whole thing, and do it well, for much less...

 

Firstly, I said that you could find ways to do it cheaper... but when doing so something usually suffers... quality being first... then the rush to record and of course rush to mix... Hell, recording 24 track 2" for 10-12 songs the tape alone would run you close to $1,000 at 30" per sec.... (unless the "producer" will just throw that in for his $600 fee).

 

I think the time to make a reasonably well recorded product and mix should be about 2 1/2 to 3 weeks. This of course, is pretty much flying though the stuff... the band should be very well rehearsed... and it is reasonable to mix say, a song a day... with maybe a couple stem mixes to pick from... I personally, can hear when a band does the 3 day blitz for $600... which sounds like a demo to me... nothing is really that polished.

 

Perhaps someone in the band could do art work to save some $$$. Could they do it as good as someone that does it for a living? Perhaps.... but is the band members extra time NOT worth $$$ too?

 

Example: I remember reading that Jerry Cantrell recorded and mixed his solo "Degradation Trip" CD... in about 2 weeks or just under 2 weeks... and to me is sounds like @ss

 

 

I'm refering to something with even better quality than Jerry's release.

[BATCAT]

Hell, recording 24 track 2" for 10-12 songs the tape alone would run you close to $1,000 at 30" per sec.... (unless the "producer" will just throw that in for his $600 fee).

 

Agreed, tape is expensive and getting worse... the studio in question has several "rental reels" because of this problem. Also, a lot of bands make backups of everything on a hard drive and then wipe and re-use the same tapes.

 

I think the time to make a reasonably well recorded product and mix should be about 2 1/2 to 3 weeks. This of course, is pretty much flying though the stuff... the band should be very well rehearsed... and it is reasonable to mix say, a song a day... with maybe a couple stem mixes to pick from... I personally, can hear when a band does the 3 day blitz for $600... which sounds like a demo to me... nothing is really that polished.

 

Well, I wasn't necessarily suggesting three days for a full-length record. I don't agree, however, that you can't make a great record in a short amount of time... actually I believe it's quite possible to ruin a record with too much time.

 

Could they do it as good as someone that does it for a living? Perhaps....

 

Often they can. If you are in a DIY situation you need to be creative, thrifty, and versitaile. A grand goes a LONG way if you're smart and hiring some "design guy" is not a good move unless your band does not know someone with the appropriate skills. And I know very few that don't. It's not that hard... many majors put out albums with ridiculous album art so it's not like the competition is so fearsome.

 

We're probably just coming from very different worlds here... I love Tape Op and a love awesome studios that make amazing sounding records through craftiness and thrift. I DEFINITELY don't believe a "sellable product" has to be pro-tooled, double-tracked, and otherwise produced to death.

 

Great records thatsell have, are, and will be made for very little.

[Beachbum]

Originally posted by BlueStrat I'm a little thick, I confess, but I'm not seeing how people getting my music for free benefits me. What good does it do to draw a larger crowd if it's not paying me more money? If 15 people have my CD that's been burned off of one that someone paid for, and they show up at a show, that doesn't translate into more sales money for me. I get paid a contracted amount, regardless of how many people show up. I do, however, depend on CD sales to defray expenses, since out of my pay I'm paying 4 other musicians a minimum, agent's commission, gas, truck maintenance, equipment maintenance, promo, etc etc. So, if 15 people who have my CD already come to a show, they're putting money in the promoter's pocket, but probably not mine, since they won't be buyng a CD they already (illegally) own. Or am I missing something here?

 

I agree, and I don't think you're missing something. Musicians MUST have or make money to continue long term. They might go awhile without income, but not for long. CD sales are an important income source.

 

The phrase, "Getting your music heard and accepted should be the only thing artists care about. They should lighten up and focus on making good music. The money will come.", from WorthyJoe's post is HIGHLY arguable, and quite possibly ludicrous to some viewers. A free show now and then? Maybe. Give away a few CD's at times? Okay. Sooner or later show & CD sales make or break the bank.

 

Musicians only interested in having their music heard should perform free concerts in the park as often as possible, and then go back to their room at Mom & Dad's, because they sure as hell can't be paying rent anywhere. All of the musicians I ever heard of have to fund their performances in some fashion or they go broke (unless they are independently wealthy).

 

I'm known as the 'new idea' guy and I'm quite interested in this 'the money will come' scenario, but I remain skeptical as I believe you've gotta work for the money.

 

Just my opinion, not worth much.

[BlueStrat]

Originally posted by Beachbum I agree, and I don't think you're missing something. Musicians MUST have or make money to continue long term. They might go awhile without income, but not for long. CD sales are an important income source. The phrase, " Getting your music heard and accepted should be the only thing artists care about. They should lighten up and focus on making good music. The money will come. ", from WorthyJoe's post is HIGHLY arguable, and quite possibly ludicrous to some viewers. A free show now and then? Maybe. Give away a few CD's at times? Okay. Sooner or later show & CD sales make or break the bank. Musicians only interested in having their music heard should perform free concerts in the park as often as possible, and then go back to their room at Mom & Dad's, because they sure as hell can't be paying rent anywhere. All of the musicians I ever heard of have to fund their performances in some fashion or they go broke (unless they are independently wealthy). I'm known as the 'new idea' guy and I'm quite interested in this 'the money will come' scenario, but I remain skeptical as I believe you've gotta work for the money. Just my opinion, not worth much.

 

Hey, at least we found some common ground! These is hope in the world...

[JacieFB]

 

Originally posted by BlueStrat I'm a little thick, I confess, but I'm not seeing how people getting my music for free benefits me. What good does it do to draw a larger crowd if it's not paying me more money? If 15 people have my CD that's been burned off of one that someone paid for, and they show up at a show, that doesn't translate into more sales money for me. I get paid a contracted amount, regardless of how many people show up. I do, however, depend on CD sales to defray expenses, since out of my pay I'm paying 4 other musicians a minimum, agent's commission, gas, truck maintenance, equipment maintenance, promo, etc etc. So, if 15 people who have my CD already come to a show, they're putting money in the promoter's pocket, but probably not mine, since they won't be buyng a CD they already (illegally) own. Or am I missing something here? BTW, I have heard from national acts that this scenario I described applies to them, as well. John Mayall, John Hammond, Lucky Peterson, all have complained about declining sales, even as their crowds get bigger, and chalk it up to piracy.

 

 

All of what you say is true, for a musician in the position you're in or have been in. It's a little different for the DIY "punk"/"Indie" band. First off, in the Indie world, lo-fi is becoming more and more the standard. Personally, that goes against my grain, but I can't argue and still sell music.

 

The other thing is that ticket sales typically translate directly into my band making more money. Almost all of our shows are a situation where we split the door/ticket sales with the sound engineer, promoter, and the other bands. On tour, it's usually weighted towards the touring band. To make more money than this, we have to push T-shirts, hats, etc. And we also have to keep churning out product...more music. If they've heard the last CD, then hopefully we can sell them the new CD that they haven't heard yet. If they got the first CD for free and it brings them to a show, then I'm okay with it at this point.

[BlueStrat]

Originally posted by JacieFB All of what you say is true, for a musician in the position you're in or have been in. It's a little different for the DIY "punk"/"Indie" band. First off, in the Indie world, lo-fi is becoming more and more the standard. Personally, that goes against my grain, but I can't argue and still sell music. The other thing is that ticket sales typically translate directly into my band making more money. Almost all of our shows are a situation where we split the door/ticket sales with the sound engineer, promoter, and the other bands. On tour, it's usually weighted towards the touring band. To make more money than this, we have to push T-shirts, hats, etc. And we also have to keep churning out product...more music. If they've heard the last CD, then hopefully we can sell them the new CD that they haven't heard yet. If they got the first CD for free and it brings them to a show, then I'm okay with it at this point.

I see what you're saying. Unfortunately for me, the buying (or in this case "burning") public doesn't see the difference. And anyway, in the long run it's going to hurt you, too, as soon as you reach a point where ticket sales don't affect your pay level because you're working for a guarantee, and you need every dime you can get to be on the road and still maintain yourband expenses AND your everyday living expenses at home.

 

You haven't lived until you've been handed a CDR of your music with a photocopied CD liner and asked to autograph it. This has happened to me twice.

[JacieFB]

 

Originally posted by BlueStrat I see what you're saying. Unfortunately for me, the buying (or in this case "burning") public doesn't see the difference. And anyway, in the long run it's going to hurt you, too, as soon as yopu rach a point where ticket sales don't ffect your pay level and you need every dime you can get to be on the road. You haven't lived until you've been handed a CDR of your music with a photocopied CD liner and asked to autograph it. This has happened to me twice.

 

 

 

 

 

ewwww...not good What did you do?

 

 

You're right...long term, the burning/copying is a bad thing.

[BlueStrat]

 

Originally posted by JacieFB ewwww...not good What did you do? You're right...long term, the burning/copying is a bad thing.

 

 

The first time, I was so shocked and it was in a receiving line after a festival gig, I just signed it. The second time was in a bar, and I said that I had not given permission for my work to be illegally copied, and I wouldn't sign it. It's weird.

[Beachbum]

Originally posted by BlueStrat Hey, at least we found some common ground! These is hope in the world...

 

We've got a lot of common ground, or more realistically: I'd like think I have some common ground with you. Look at the little finger on your left hand. You've got more musical talent, experience, and wisdom in that one little finger than I have in all ten of mine, and more of those factors than 90% of the other people here as well. You don't need to boast of it, you've got it, you've lived it.

 

When I first got here and watched you berate me and others, because we can't even dream to be at your level yet, and therefore we must ask questions to try and learn, but when we ask the questions we get smart-ass replies, I did what's natural, I smart-assed back.

 

Anybody can be a smart-ass, I've proved that. But what you've done, and what you've achieved, and the level you've reached musically, you don't need to lower yourself to the smart-ass level. I'm surprised that you do, it amuses me at times.

 

Pity us fools who try to travel the road you've traveled before us. Pity us, and perhaps provide the roadmap to make our journey more enjoyable.

 

That's brutal honesty. The same kind of honest effort I put into my music. I'll appreciate any help you can provide, or I can just keep bringing you back down to my level with smart-ass comments. But you really are better than that. Just so you know.

 

Rock on.

[BlueStrat]

Look at the little finger on your left hand. You've got more musical talent, experience, and wisdom in that one little finger than I have in all ten of mine, and more of those factors than 90% of the other people here as well.

 

 

I doubt it, but I'm flattered that you think so.

 

When I first got here and watched you berate me and others, because we can't even dream to be at your level yet, and therefore we must ask questions to try and learn, but when we ask the questions we get smart-ass replies, I did what's natural, I smart-assed back.

 

I don't believe I berate anyone unless they're being a dick. I will, however, bluntly and unequivocally state my opinion about their ideas. I distinguish what someone thinks about something from who they are as a person. If my bluntness is taken as a personal attack, I don't know what to tell you. It isn't.

 

you don't need to lower yourself to the smart-ass level. I'm surprised that you do, it amuses me at times.

 

I've been one my entire life. At 51, it isn't likely to change now.

 

Pity us fools who try to travel the road you've traveled before us. Pity us, and perhaps provide the roadmap to make our journey more enjoyable.

 

Pity doesn't help anyone. As far as providing a "roadmap to make our journey more enjoyable", that's what I'm trying to do, at least to show one way that I have followed. Part of that means I try to shoot down ideas I think are dumb. If someone doesn't agree with me, that's cool. It doesn't mean my experience is "last century". There are some principles in this business, like any other business, which are timeless. I learned them the hard way. Sorry if the delivery is too straightforward for some folks to swallow.

 

That's brutal honesty. The same kind of honest effort I put into my music. I'll appreciate any help you can provide, or I can just keep bringing you back down to my level with smart-ass comments. But you really are better than that. Just so you know.

 

Fair enough. I'll call 'em as I see 'em, and I'll respect your right to do the same.

[Marlin in Minn]

I posted this just because I was aggravated about some folks who liked the music that I was listening to, but so far are too cheap to actually purchase the albums. I was just typing to vent, I didn't really expect any replies.

 

And you all have turned it into a very good discussion, which has given me some good perspectives on how all y'all feel about this. I think I understand both sides of the issue after reading the replies: Making money for your music is a great thing...and sometimes giving it away can promote your music and ultimately can result in a greater audience base.

 

You all are the experts, and I haven't played for money in many years.

 

Let me tell you what tripped my trigger to make the original post.

 

Lee Flier, I'm going to pick on you for a minute...I hope you don't mind.

 

I guy I work with is an musician who gigs regularly in 2 different bands, and he also does the sound for any band that wants to pay for his services. And he doesn't do any of this for free. One time in a casual conversation with him, I said something to the effect that the other musicians in our company must like having a sound guy so readily available (We've got a bunch of musicians working for our company), and he stated as long as they've got the cash...I'm available.

 

And then I got a long lecture about how expensive it is to do this type of work, bands should be payed...blah, blah, blah...you can fill in the rest of his monologue.

 

Thursday he walks into my office and I've got What the...? playing on my little clock/radio/cd player and he says that sounds really good, who is that? So we go over to his office, he's got a decent little stereo, and I go through some of the songs and explain what I know about the band.

 

That's when he started on the "just make me a copy" deal. That really aggravated me, because you can bet he wouldn't do anything for free.

 

Applause is a wonderful thing, but Lee, Lyle, and Spyder aren't going to hear it all the way down there in Atlanta. But selling a few more CD's might help make ends meet so they can cut another album.

 

If this was in your local area and it would encourage people to go see you play, then yes, maybe just getting the music out there serves a purpose. But, we're a long ways away from Atlanta and I really doubt that people would make the trip down there from Minneapolis to see all 4 of the Beatles reunited. I'm exaggerating a bit here, but you get the idea.

 

I think if you like it you should buy it. Heck, it's only 12 bucks for some good music.

 

That's all I was ranting about.

[Preacher Will]

I'm gonna get on my high horse here for a minute then shut up.

 

Whenever you take what belongs to someone else without their prior permission, it is theft. It doesn't matter whether it is in their ultimate best interests or not, it is still theft.

 

If an artist, for promotional purposes, says: "Here are three songs that are available for free distribution," then permission has been granted and you can give it to anybody.

 

If an artist provides a free copy of music to an individual as a gift or for promotional purposes, then that person has free right to use but not to share.

 

If an artist sells their product, the user needs to pay for it.

 

When you don't have permission from the artist to use their product, you're stealing.

 

It is not an issue of end result (whether or not fewer or more CD's are sold) it is a matter of what is right and what is wrong. Why do we constantly try to justify doing what is wrong?????

[Beachbum]

Good questions, good comments, good concerns.

 

Maybe people share & copy music simply because they can?

 

Maybe we have too many laws that aren't enforced.

 

Some view sharing & copying music in the same light as speeding on the interstate highway - everybody does it, nobody gets in trouble, why not do it? (Once in a great while someone will be prosecuted in each case, but you see their point.)

 

FACT: the music CD business is in DEEP trouble. Some sources indicate an end to store bought CD's within 3 years; with all music purchases and production being on-line at that time.

 

FACT: the music industry MUST recognize this trend, face this trend, and deal with this trend, as the change is underway. Very similar situation to digital photograpy - the film & processing industry is about 5% of what it used to be and it happened VERY quickly.

 

Good food for thought - how to maintain profits in an ever changing music industry. It'll be interesting and it'll be fun. It's a new age.

[roabre999]

a buck a song is too much considering they have zero production costs, no liners liner notes cd jacket etc. A Cd with 12 songs is still $12.00 If songs were $0.25 a song I would never buy a cd again.

 

Music companies are their worst enemy. Why pay $16 - $23 for a Cd when that same $20 will buy you a DVD with a full movie, extra features, possibly a video. CDs just dont have much value anymore.

 

With all the copying going on, instead of making billions and billions and billions of dollars, music companies are now only making billions and billions of dollars.

[Marlin in Minn]

Originally posted by Beachbum Good questions, good comments, good concerns. Maybe people share & copy music simply because they can? Maybe we have too many laws that aren't enforced. Some view sharing & copying music in the same light as speeding on the interstate highway - everybody does it, nobody gets in trouble, why not do it? (Once in a great while someone will be prosecuted in each case, but you see their point.) FACT: the music CD business is in DEEP trouble. Some sources indicate an end to store bought CD's within 3 years; with all music purchases and production being on-line at that time. FACT: the music industry MUST recognize this trend, face this trend, and deal with this trend, as the change is underway. Very similar situation to digital photograpy - the film & processing industry is about 5% of what it used to be and it happened VERY quickly. Good food for thought - how to maintain profits in an ever changing music industry. It'll be interesting and it'll be fun. It's a new age.

 

I'm sure your right, Beachbum.

 

One of the things I like about buying CD's is you get the insert with a few pictures and notes about the band. It's not as good as the old full size vinyl records, where the pictures were big, and the lyrics were in a font size big enough to read without a magnifying glass, sometimes there'd even be a poster or something folded up inside.

 

Downloading the music off the net just seems so impersonal to me, I want to hold the album in my hand and look at the pictures while I listen. And no, I don't do that when I'm driving..

[Beachbum]

Originally posted by Marlin in Minn I'm sure your right, Beachbum. One of the things I like about buying CD's is you get the insert with a few pictures and notes about the band. It's not as good as the old full size vinyl records, where the pictures were big, and the lyrics were in a font size big enough to read without a magnifying glass, sometimes there'd even be a poster or something folded up inside. Downloading the music off the net just seems so impersonal to me, I want to hold the album in my hand and look at the pictures while I listen. And no, I don't do that when I'm driving..

 

Man, you sure hit the nail on the head with that post.

 

I used to buy albums, and especially double albums, just for the art. I sure miss that part of music.

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by Marlin in Minn If this was in your local area and it would encourage people to go see you play, then yes, maybe just getting the music out there serves a purpose. But, we're a long ways away from Atlanta and I really doubt that people would make the trip down there from Minneapolis to see all 4 of the Beatles reunited. I'm exaggerating a bit here, but you get the idea.

 

Well hey, why don't you go ahead and burn that guy a CD, and tell him that if we ever get up to Minnesota for a gig we'll expect him to run sound for us for free.

 

But seriously, that's just hypocritical. And yeah people like that piss me off. I don't put everybody who downloads stuff or burns CD's in that category, though, that's all I was saying. I think THB and Professor Tom's posts pretty well summed up my attitude - some people use downloads or burned copies as a stepping stone to deciding if they want to buy a CD, and will eventually buy it - others think they're just entitled to free music.

 

And yeah, I prefer having all the cool artwork and everything on an "official" release too.

[gogo]

 

Originally posted by shredfit However, having 10 people trade their music to another 10 each... will lead to 100 people hearing it... then if those 100 do the same thing you have 1,000... if those 1,000 do the same thing you have 10,000 if those 10,000 people each trade with 10 then you have 100,000 people that have heard your music... and so on.... Having all these potential listeners will only help the band build a following and get industry interest... with the potential to make coin ever increasing.

 

 

I don't understand this. Thousands of my recordings are swapped for free. Will some executive give me a contract & cash, since many people may have heard my music but didn't pay for it, and I'm happy giving it away?

 

 

Originally posted by P.A.T. (live) performance will be more important than record sales...

 

 

Yes, if one can't make money recording, whoever wants to make music for a living has to maximize gigs, cover charges & ticket prices. Right?

 

[Marlin in Minn]

Originally posted by Lee Flier Well hey, why don't you go ahead and burn that guy a CD, and tell him that if we ever get up to Minnesota for a gig we'll expect him to run sound for us for free.

 

LOL, there you go! I may just tell him that to see his reaction.

 

If you all do come up here, make sure you come in the summer time. I think that's supposed to happen sometime between Aug 2nd and Aug 10th this year.

[Beachbum]

"I don't understand this. Thousands of my recordings are swapped for free. Will some executive give me a contract & cash, since many people may have heard my music but didn't pay for it, and I'm happy giving it away?"

 

Possibly.

 

If a band or person creates a kick ass album that everyone wants to hear, downloads, and listens to, some execs will take a chance giving a contrat & cash to that band or person in anticipation that their next album will be kick-ass too. But the next album for be for sale and not available for free swapping.

 

Unknown bands love the idea of 10,000 people listening to their songs for free, they're unknown.

 

Known bands hate it because their songs are sellable.