Tip jar question

[TIMKEYS]

My rules: If it's a restaurant, whether acoustic or with my band, there's a tip jar. If I'm doing an acoustic set solo or duo in a club, gallery or private party, there's a tip jar. If I'm sitting down to play, there's a tip jar. If it's a dance club with my band, there's no tip jar. Unless management wants to put it out. Then I'm fine with any avenue of collecting more money.

Welcome back pat ,, like a moth to a flame,,, pat has returned

[Consume]

 

Lol...actually it's a chair...yea this biker bar is full of "personality".

 

 

Why do they ALL look like that? LOL

Every Biker bar I have ever played, has had an outdoor stage area that looks almost exactly like that....except most of the ones I've played have been covered so you don't have to play in the rain.

[Consume]

Love free money...but we're a 80's hard rock cover band, I guess I feel like it clashes with the "attitude" of what we're doing on stage. Maybe that's a dumb thought, I don't know, we're new . This was actually our first public gig.

Screw that - take the money. Figure that it exists so that when a club screws you over, that makes up the difference.

[Consume]

 

My Brothers, Several years ago, I had a guitar sub put out a tip jar at a private function. Total take was $120 and he didn't share it because it was "his tip jar!" Well I fired the prick on the spot and let everyone know what he did. Bad news travels fast, and he still can't get on any regular work because of his bad attitude. Great player, though, but a real dick to work with!

 

 

Hey, did you have your own tip jar set up? If not, why not?

What bad attitude? Because he didn't want to share his tips? You should have just set your own tip jar up after that and forbid him to set one up.

[pickinatit]

Well lets see if I can explain it... We cater to the 18-35 demographic exclusively. We only play places that cater to this demo. The place that we played on the night in question is making a concerted effort to cater to this demo. The owner specifically stated that she doesn't want bands that "play stuff like Mustang Sally". We do very few songs that came out before 1980: 1. Play that funky music - Probably going to be cut from our regular rotation soon 2 and 3. A medley of Proud Mary and Shout - Definitely a keeper. Meagan absolutely nails Proud Mary, we generally close our second set with these two songs into.... 4. Sweet Caroline - Done with a very punk rock vibe 5. Iko Iko - which is mashed up with Blister In The Sun 6. Brown Eyed Girl - One verse mashed up with I Like Cold Beverages and Can I Getta 7. Sweet Home Alabama - One verse mashed up with It Takes Two and Jump Around Other than that, we play all more current stuff, and EVERYTHING we're adding now is a mashup. So far we have about 20 in place and my goal is to double that by years end. So even if I was going to add an older tune, I'm probably going to mash it up with something more current. Or if I'm going to do a country song (ex. Chicken Fried) I'm going to mash it up with something NOT country (ex. Gin and Juice) BTW we did that - it's awesome. As I stated earlier, we are not a variety band. We are purposely painting ourselves into a corner as a very niche band. Some people love us and follow us to every show. Others don't like us at all. Very few people don't have an opinion about us.

 

 

I get what you're saying...I really do, but...nobody is talking about permanently changing your set list or anything. Just ONE SONG to make 15 customers happy. Sorry, but I still don't get the logic unless you are saying that the owner of the place wants you to help purposely drive the "older folks" out of the bar. In that case I would say that you are probably accomplishing that mission.

[kmart]

Sorry, but I still don't get the logic unless you are saying that the owner of the place wants you to help purposely drive the "older folks" out of the bar.

 

Seems pretty clear to me that he is saying exactly that.

 

Or more precisely, drive out the 'folks of a certain demographic that USUALLY means 'of a certain age', but definitely means 'of a certain musical mindset' (i.e., ones who think no good music was released after 1987).

 

 

IMO, if a band is playing music of a general vibe/type/genre (For example: upbeat MODERN dance/party music), and someone in the venue (or several someones, but still the vast minority of the crowd) shouts out or requests a song/music that is CLEARLY well outside that particular style (For example, FreeBird, or any other classic rock, etc.), and the band ignores/refuses that request, the problem isn't the band; the problem is the thick-headed-verging on ignorant and/or rude patron (s).

It's not THAT difficult to figure out what general kind of music a band is playing, and to understand if your potential request is likely to fall into something they'd be likely to play or not. The patron who yells out a song that is obviously out of that realm isn't doing the band OR themselves any favors.

[TIMKEYS]

Seems pretty clear to me that he is saying exactly that. Or more precisely, drive out the 'folks of a certain demographic that USUALLY means 'of a certain age', but definitely means 'of a certain musical mindset' (i.e., ones who think no good music was released after 1987). IMO, if a band is playing music of a general vibe/type/genre (For example: upbeat MODERN dance/party music), and someone in the venue (or several someones, but still the vast minority of the crowd) shouts out or requests a song/music that is CLEARLY well outside that particular style (For example, FreeBird, or any other classic rock, etc.), and the band ignores/refuses that request, the problem isn't the band; the problem is the thick-headed-verging on ignorant and/or rude patron (s). It's not THAT difficult to figure out what general kind of music a band is playing, and to understand if your potential request is likely to fall into something they'd be likely to play or not. The patron who yells out a song that is obviously out of that realm isn't doing the band OR themselves any favors.

 

 

I can see where a club might want to go for a young demogrhapic , but when you try to change the spots so to speak on a bar you do take a chance. Sometimes the me too mentality turns out to really bite you in the ass. Every band has personality and genre they target , but if the band is capable of doing a request that may be a little off the path to entertain a table of 15 I dont see the harm in doing it. I know in our home dig , those 15 people can be 250 to 300 bucks in ring to the owners on average. In some clubs it might be only 100 to 150

[pickinatit]

Seems pretty clear to me that he is saying exactly that. Or more precisely, drive out the 'folks of a certain demographic that USUALLY means 'of a certain age', but definitely means 'of a certain musical mindset' (i.e., ones who think no good music was released after 1987). IMO, if a band is playing music of a general vibe/type/genre (For example: upbeat MODERN dance/party music), and someone in the venue (or several someones, but still the vast minority of the crowd) shouts out or requests a song/music that is CLEARLY well outside that particular style (For example, FreeBird, or any other classic rock, etc.), and the band ignores/refuses that request, the problem isn't the band; the problem is the thick-headed-verging on ignorant and/or rude patron (s). It's not THAT difficult to figure out what general kind of music a band is playing, and to understand if your potential request is likely to fall into something they'd be likely to play or not. The patron who yells out a song that is obviously out of that realm isn't doing the band OR themselves any favors .

 

 

Yeah, but we're talking about a band that has

 

Play that funky music, A medley of Proud Mary and Shout - Definitely a keeper. Sweet Caroline,

Iko Iko - mashed up with Blister In The Sun, Brown Eyed Girl, Sweet Home Alabama mashed up with It Takes Two and Jump Around

 

I don't think the patrons in question need to be "thick headed, rude or ignorant to think that they might possibly play another tune from the 70's or whatever.

[kmart]

Yeah, but we're talking about a band that has Play that funky music, A medley of Proud Mary and Shout - Definitely a keeper. Sweet Caroline, Iko Iko - mashed up with Blister In The Sun, Brown Eyed Girl, Sweet Home Alabama mashed up with It Takes Two and Jump Around I don't think the patrons in question need to be "thick headed, rude or ignorant to think that they might possibly play another tune from the 70's or whatever.

 

 

You think the patrons didn't HAVE to be that.

 

However, given this description:

 

... we're playing to about 100 people - 85 in the 20-30 demographic which we cater to and 15 or so older people in cowboy hats. Well one cowboy had dude puts a dollar down on the stage with a napkin with a bunch of songs we don't do written on it and yelled out "Play something for the older people". At first I ignored him... well the dick got mad and yelled "Play what I requested, I gave you a dollar!".

 

...and what TrickyBoy has described about the venue and owner's wishes...I can't think of any other explanation, personally speaking.

 

If the guy plopped down a Benjamin, or even a $20 bill, that's one thing, and would probably have given the band reason to consider.

 

Some stubborn old goat who's obviously too inebriated or dense to recognize the surroundings he's in, the majority of the people in attendance, the bulk of the music being played, etc., and who thinks he's doing a big thing by tipping the band a WHOLE DOLLAR to play something HE wants to hear?

 

Pfft.

 

He can keep his dollar and just continue walking past the stage, out the door, get into his rusted out Chevy pickup and turn on the 8-track player for what he wants.

[pickinatit]

You think the patrons didn't HAVE to be that. However, given this description: ...and what TrickyBoy has described about the venue and owner's wishes...I can't think of any other explanation , personally speaking. If the guy plopped down a Benjamin, or even a $20 bill, that's one thing, and would probably have given the band reason to consider. Some stubborn old goat who's obviously too inebriated or dense to recognize the surroundings he's in, the majority of the people in attendance, the bulk of the music being played, etc., and who thinks he's doing a big thing by tipping the band a WHOLE DOLLAR to play something HE wants to hear? Pfft. He can keep his dollar and just continue walking past the stage, out the door, get into his rusted out Chevy pickup and turn on the 8-track player for what he wants.

 

 

And 99% of what you're saying here is valid to a degree but is almost all totally irrelevant to the point that I am making. Regardless of the demographic of the crowd, how much he tipped, what the owner's wishes are etc....Just in light of what THE BAND THEMSELVES ARE PLAYING, it is perfectly reasonable to expect that the band might play another old song seeing as how they already have more than a handful on their set list. Even though he looks around and sees that the crowd is 99% under 30 doesn't matter if he's already heard the band play a bunch of old songs. If anything I would say that the band has misled him into thinking that they didn't mind playing older songs and brought this on themselves.

Now not playing it because he's not tipping enough or whatever, yeah, I get that. But stubborn, dense or willfully ignorant? When the band is already playing old songs??? That's nonsense.

[kmart]

Now not playing it because he's not tipping enough or whatever, yeah, I get that. But stubborn, dense or willfully ignorant? When the band is already playing old songs??? That's nonsense.

 

 

I think you and I have far different takes on how many 'old' songs the band is playing vs. how many "not old" (i.e., current)'

 

If the band WAS playing the volume of 'old songs' you seem to make them out to be doing, the dolt in the cowboy hat wouldn't have shouted out 'play something for the older people', now would he?

[TrickyBoy]

I get what you're saying...I really do, but...nobody is talking about permanently changing your set list or anything. Just ONE SONG to make 15 customers happy. Sorry, but I still don't get the logic unless you are saying that the owner of the place wants you to help purposely drive the "older folks" out of the bar. In that case I would say that you are probably accomplishing that mission.

 

 

You're kinda missing he point of my initial story, which was this:

 

I wasn't angry that dude wanted us to play another older song. Had we had something handy to play for him we might have. BUT, once he got the attitude of "I gave you a dollar, so I'm ENTITLED to hear what I want to hear", I took exception.

[TIMKEYS]

You're kinda missing he point of my initial story, which was this: I wasn't angry that dude wanted us to play another older song. Had we had something handy to play for him we might have. BUT, once he got the attitude of "I gave you a dollar, so I'm ENTITLED to hear what I want to hear", I took exception.

 

 

You are entertainers. It would be a whole lot easier just to talk to the guy for 30 seconds and figure out somthing that the band could play to give him some attention and make him happy. He gave you a buck , you give him 30 seconds of attention.. play the song, get your buck make your 120 and hour extra . first off you were going to play a song anyway. He and 14 other people are happy.. and the score for you guys as a band is 100 to zero, not 85 to 15. You can want a certain crowd , but you have to entertain what walks through the door. they all drink and they all eat. you cant be a party band unless you are willing to party with them all.

[wardjames]

You can want a certain crowd , but you have to entertain what walks through the door. they all drink and they all eat. you cant be a party band unless you are willing to party with them all.

 

 

Disagree Tim. You create what walks through the door to a large extent. It's not smart for a band to alienate 90% of their audience by playing a request by one guy who doesn't represent what the desired crowd wants.

 

Furthermore, I don't think the issue here is the age of the requestor, it's the attitude. When we have a person rudely call out for something, we're not going to play it...out of self respect if nothing else. I get the impression that's what's going on here.

 

I'm down to play any request, but it has to add to the show as a whole.

[GCDEF]

 

Disagree Tim. You create what walks through the door to a large extent. It's not smart for a band to alienate 90% of their audience by playing a request by one guy who doesn't represent what the desired crowd wants. Furthermore, I don't think the issue here is the age of the requestor, it's the attitude. When we have a person rudely call out for something, we're not going to play it...out of self respect if nothing else. I get the impression that's what's going on here. I'm down to play any request, but it has to add to the show as a whole.

 

 

I agree with this. We'll turn down requests even if we all know the song if it's not something that's in line with what we would normally play. Some bands want to be human juke boxes and some want to have an image and a sound. I guess it depends which you want to be.

[TIMKEYS]

Disagree Tim. You create what walks through the door to a large extent . It's not smart for a band to alienate 90% of their audience by playing a request by one guy who doesn't represent what the desired crowd wants. Furthermore, I don't think the issue here is the age of the requestor, it's the attitude. When we have a person rudely call out for something, we're not going to play it...out of self respect if nothing else. I get the impression that's what's going on here. I'm down to play any request, but it has to add to the show as a whole.

 

 

from what I read ,, the guy put a buck in the tip jar and handed them a request written on some paper. then got totally ingored ,, then the guy got vocal because of it. I honestly dont think you are going to piss off 85 percent of a young crowd by playing one song. this deal was handled poorly. No shame in that ,, but you sure as hell dont want to ever lose it and give a guy a dressing down over the mike when he is with a party of 14 other people. When people give tips they want a little attention .. give it to them,, come up with a song that the band knows that will work and play the damb thing. Entertainers handle these situations all the time in bars. And they do it a little slicker than tricky did. My feeling is next time try to work it in a more gracefull way is all.

[GCDEF]

 

from what I read ,, the guy put a buck in the tip jar and handed them a request written on some paper. then got totally ingored ,, then the guy got vocal because of it. I honestly dont think you are going to piss off 85 percent of a young crowd by playing one song. this deal was handled poorly. No shame in that ,, but you sure as hell dont want to ever lose it and give a guy a dressing down over the mike when he is with a party of 14 other people. When people give tips they want a little attention .. give it to them,, come up with a song that the band knows that will work and play the damb thing. Entertainers handle these situations all the time in bars. And they do it a little slicker than tricky did. My feeling is next time try to work it in a more gracefull way is all.

 

 

A single dollar doesn't buy a whole lot of attention. That would maybe merit a "thank you" over the mic, maybe.

[TIMKEYS]

A single dollar doesn't buy a whole lot of attention. That would maybe merit a "thank you" over the mic, maybe.

 

 

no it doesnt ,,,, even if you give them a whole 60 seconds... its still 60 bucks and hour extra. Its pretty easy to forget why you are up there on the band stand. You are entertainers. Knowing how to handle people , situations and keep them all happy is part of the job. The more you do that job the better you get at it. My point was try harder next time. There was a better way.

 

That would maybe merit a "thank you" over the mic, maybe.

 

If this is the way you feel about a guy giving you a tip... you got a ways to go on this entertainer thing.

[TrickyBoy]

 

from what I read ,, the guy put a buck in the tip jar and handed them a request written on some paper. then got totally ingored ,, then the guy got vocal because of it. I honestly dont think you are going to piss off 85 percent of a young crowd by playing one song. this deal was handled poorly. No shame in that ,, but you sure as hell dont want to ever lose it and give a guy a dressing down over the mike when he is with a party of 14 other people. When people give tips they want a little attention .. give it to them,, come up with a song that the band knows that will work and play the damb thing. Entertainers handle these situations all the time in bars. And they do it a little slicker than tricky did. My feeling is next time try to work it in a more gracefull way is all.

 

 

We don't have a tip jar. We don't solicit tips. He, all by himself, decided to throw a dollar onstage with a napkin with some songs scribbled on it then then got mad when when didn't play the tunes...

 

I'd agree that if I solicited tips then I would have handled it in a very different way.

[pickinatit]

I think you and I have far different takes on how many 'old' songs the band is playing vs. how many "not old" (i.e., current)' If the band WAS playing the volume of 'old songs' you seem to make them out to be doing, the dolt in the cowboy hat wouldn't have shouted out 'play something for the older people', now would he?

The OP put up how many older songs they were playing. I didn't pull that list out of the air.
And if a bigger tip makes a difference than this isn't really about principal or band direction or the club owner's wishes, is it? It's about the size of the tip and a drunk guy's attitude. Wow, a drunk guy with an attitude ? Imagine that? Of course, I guess the best way to handle that is by proving that you can be as rude and ignorant as he is even when you're sober.

Anyway, The OP has confirmed the fact that my suspicions are correct. He
posted:
" wasn't angry that dude wanted us to play another older song. Had we had something handy to play for him we might have. BUT, once he got the attitude of "I gave you a dollar, so I'm ENTITLED to hear what I want to hear", I took exception.

[TIMKEYS]

We don't have a tip jar. We don't solicit tips. He, all by himself, decided to throw a dollar onstage with a napkin with some songs scribbled on it then then got mad when when didn't play the tunes... I'd agree that if I solicited tips then I would have handled it in a very different way.

 

 

You should have handled that a different way in my opinion .. anytime you box yourself into having to go smart ass on a customer from the stage ,, you are losing control of the situation. there were better ways to handle it. NO big deal,,, just use a little more imagination next time is all. As for the tip jar ,,, thats a band decision. Lots of tip jars end up with a good deal of money in them at gigs for bands at bars.

[kmart]

Clearly...
1) Some folks in this thread feel that BECAUSE you're on stage, you're equivalent to no more than an organ grinder's monkey, and your job is to DANCE MONKEY, DANCE!!! when told to by any chump who asks...

2) And some folks feel that because they are on stage, THEY'RE the show, and while they may give a nod and/or attention to someone in the audience who's out of their element, it's still THE FOLKS ON STAGE who make the call on doing so or not. Yes, the band is there to entertain the crowd, but there is such a thing as an audience member crossing the line; once they do, too bad for them.

[Dessalines]

Love free money...but we're a 80's hard rock cover band, I guess I feel like it clashes with the "attitude" of what we're doing on stage. Maybe that's a dumb thought, I don't know, we're new . This was actually our first public gig.

Right the first time, it's a dumb thought. Money should alway trump attitude. Afterall, attitude won't buy strings or whatever.

[TIMKEYS]

Clearly... 1) Some folks in this thread feel that BECAUSE you're on stage, you're equivalent to no more than an organ grinder's monkey, and your job is to DANCE MONKEY, DANCE!!! when told to by any chump who asks... 2) And some folks feel that because they are on stage, THEY'RE the show, and while they may give a nod and/or attention to someone in the audience who's out of their element, it's still THE FOLKS ON STAGE who make the call on doing so or not. Yes, the band is there to entertain the crowd, but there is such a thing as an audience member crossing the line; once they do, too bad for them.

 

 

 

I figure that I am there to help show people a good time and make them feel good about being there. ya gotta be a good host, when you are dealing with the public.

[ChordGirl]

Clearly... 1) Some folks in this thread feel that BECAUSE you're on stage, you're equivalent to no more than an organ grinder's monkey, and your job is to DANCE MONKEY, DANCE!!! when told to by any chump who asks... 2) And some folks feel that because they are on stage, THEY'RE the show, and while they may give a nod and/or attention to someone in the audience who's out of their element, it's still THE FOLKS ON STAGE who make the call on doing so or not. Yes, the band is there to entertain the crowd, but there is such a thing as an audience member crossing the line; once they do, too bad for them.