Modern Country Fans---explain Blake Shelton to me?

[TIMKEYS]

 

Well I dunno, Tim..I might cut David some slack if his corporate/wedding band doesn't cover "Your Cheating Heart".

 

 

 

No guts no glory ,,, we play this one at weddins. I am not kidding.

 

[video=youtube;3J8PU9h-78A]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3J8PU9h-78A&feature=related

[BlueStrat]

 

Nobody is going to make any money sounding like Hank Williams these days.

 

Well, I suppose "make any money" is subjective, but two hours spent listening to Outlaw Country on Siruis will present you with several current young guys who sound an awful lot like Hank, complete with standup bass and slack key Hawaiian guitar. They might not be getting rich, but there is still a pretty good market for it,and a few of the guys doing it are touring bigger clubs and festivals. It's not Nashville, for sure.

[Vito Corleone]

 

I get a kick out of the guys who profess to hate modern country ,, but try to cover their ass by saying they love old school,, but wouldnt be caught dead playing it.

 

 

wouldn't be caught dead playing what? Old school country? Who said that?

[BlueStrat]

I dunno,maybe it's just me, but I'd 100 times rather listen to this than anything on country radio today.

 

[video=youtube;VRMNeoaosQw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRMNeoaosQw

[TIMKEYS]

 

wouldn't be caught dead playing what? Old school country? Who said that?

 

 

When was the last time your band played any old country or outlaw country for that matter. You lecture all the time on here how old music is a dead end street:idea:

[Electric Catfish]

Hard to say what Chet's take on it was. MAYBE he was just producing the chese for the cash and doing it so he could finance the 'real' stuff? MAYBE he loved the cheese and let some of the raw stuff slip in even though he couldn't stand it because they weren't good enough "players" in his view? I've certainly seen plenty of musicians on BOTH end of that spectrum in my time. I have no idea on which end Chet really lived. Do you?

 

This post didn't register to me before, but the stuff Chet produced for Willie and Waylon wasn't the "outlaw" material they're mostly famous for. He produced and marketed them in the same way as the rest; it was after shedding the Chet-style that they became what we know them for. Waylon produced most of his "outlaw" era material himself, with the Waylors in the studio with him (which CA insisted wouldn't work.) Nobody's first image of Waylon or Willie that comes to mind is the clean cut, nudie suited 60's image that CA was responsible for, and everyone here knows that to be true, except for some whose chronology is off, and others who simply can't handle being wrong.

[Vito Corleone]

 

This post didn't register to me before, but the stuff Chet produced for Willie and Waylon wasn't the "outlaw" material they're mostly famous for. He produced and marketed them in the same way as the rest; it was after shedding the Chet-style that they became what we know them for. Waylon produced most of his "outlaw" era material himself, with the Waylors in the studio with him (which CA insisted wouldn't work.) Nobody's first image of Waylon or Willie that comes to mind is the clean cut, nudie suited 60's image that CA was responsible for, and everyone here knows that to be true, except for some whose chronology is off, and others who simply can't handle being wrong.

 

 

Yes. I enjoyed your insightful posts on that era of the country music scene. I wasn't aware of all the details of the history.

[BlueStrat]

 

This post didn't register to me before, but the stuff Chet produced for Willie and Waylon wasn't the "outlaw" material they're mostly famous for. He produced and marketed them in the same way as the rest; it was after shedding the Chet-style that they became what we know them for. Waylon produced most of his "outlaw" era material himself, with the Waylors in the studio with him (which CA insisted wouldn't work.) Nobody's first image of Waylon or Willie that comes to mind is the clean cut, nudie suited 60's image that CA was responsible for, and everyone here knows that to be true, except for some whose chronology is off, and others who simply can't handle being wrong.

 

 

All of that may be true, but none of that was my point. The point is, Chet got those guys their star power. That is an undeniable fact. That they rejected the product that Chet turned them into is a reality, but the fact remains, had they started out doing their outlaw bit they likely wouldn't have gotten past square one. They became outlaw stars precisely because they were already Nashville stars first who rejected it. Of course that's big news- it would be like Dave Matthews or Lady Gaga rejecting their commercial success and deciding to perform roots music. The timing was right and it allworked out great.

 

But the fact is that Willie, Waylon etc did live TV appearances with Chet after that and that they never said a disparaging word about him personally that I could find says a lot.

 

The main point I was rebutting was the idea that the Outlaws hated Chet and what he stood for. They may have not cared for the production, but he did not become the pariah to the outlaw movement that so many seem to think. As far as I can tell, they still respected him and showed him the love.

[TIMKEYS]

Didnt willie start out as pretty much just a songwriter?

[Vito Corleone]

When was the last time your band played any old country or outlaw country for that matter. You lecture all the time on here how old music is a dead end street:idea:

 

Once again, you don't know what the {censored} you're talking about, Tim. I grew up liking old school country and played it a lot in a duo I was in a few years back because we could. In the band I'm in now? No, obviously there aren't a lot of old school country songs that are going to work unless "Folsom Prison Blues" counts. But Hank and Merle? Not so much. So saying I love old school country is neither "covering my ass" nor has anything to do with whether my band plays it or not. It's not that I wouldn't "be caught dead playing it". It's that it doesn't work for the type of gigs my band does. There's a big difference.

 

Once people here start figuring that sort of {censored} out, they might actually make some money instead of just bitching about how they don't so much of the time

[TIMKEYS]

Once again, you don't know what the {censored} you're talking about, Tim. I grew up liking old school country and played it a lot in a duo I was in a few years back because we could. In the band I'm in now? No, obviously there aren't a lot of old school country songs that are going to work unless "Folsom Prison Blues" counts. But Hank and Merle? Not so much. So saying I love old school country is neither "covering my ass" nor has anything to do with whether my band plays it or not. It's not that I wouldn't "be caught dead playing it". It's that it doesn't work for the type of gigs my band does. There's a big difference. Once people here start figuring that sort of {censored} out, they might actually make some money instead of just bitching about how they don't so much of the time

 

 

There you go again. Why dont you just buy a mud flap and sew it to your belt.

[BlueStrat]

 

Didnt willie start out as pretty much just a songwriter?

 

 

 

Yes, in the late 50s-early 60s.

 

 

Once people here start figuring that sort of {censored} out, they might actually make some money instead of just bitching about how they don't so much of the time

 

 

 

Maybe some of us would rather play music we love first and then try to sell it. It's a tougher road, but one I'd much rather take than playing music that would make me want to blow my own head off.

[Vito Corleone]

 

There you go again. Why dont you just buy a mud flap and sew it to your belt.

 

 

Don't be such a wad. You don't have a clue what I would or would not "be caught dead" playing.

 

If you haven't learned anything else from what I've posted over these years, you should have learned that I'm not one who cares so much about how much I love a song and am not afraid to be "caught" playing anything. It's others here who get all caught up in having to have a "personal connection" to a song or who worry about being embarrassed to being playing something should one of their old friends walk in.

 

I'm a professional performer. I like to get on stage and perform for people and get paid for it. Music is the medium. If I wasn't interested in performing and only the music, I'd stay home. It's not that complicated. I don't know why I have to keep explaining myself to you over and over.

[Vito Corleone]

 

Maybe some of us would rather play music we love first and then try to sell it. It's a tougher road,

 

 

Actually, I don't see it as tougher. Playing only music "I love" is the easiest thing in the world to do. Playing stuff you maybe don't have that "personal connection" with and performing as if you do---that's work and takes experience and professionalism to do well. In my experience, a lot of the reason players DON'T do that is because they don't really want to work. They just want to get up on stage and "do what they love" and expect to get paid well for it.

 

That's great for the few that can, I suppose. But most people don't have that natural ability to connect with audiences in such a manner that they can do only whatever they love and draw audiences large enough to make it a truely worthwhile venture.

 

I'm lucky, I suppose, in that I am more drawn to performing and pleasing audiences than I am to connecting-with-music, so I can put the former first and just use the music as the vehicle to help me do that. As long as the crowd is happy, I am. So it's a win/win for me.

 

It saddens me that so many others are unhappy with their place in the present environment. It seems to me it would be a lot easier if such people could just let loose and enjoy what there is. Whether that's playing for 5 people or 500 or playing old country or Katy Perry or playing covers or originals.

 

Sorry if it sounds like I'm getting up on a soapbox (again) but frankly I'm growing a bit weary of hearing both so many complaints and so many snide (and not so snide) comments about what is 'wrong' with how I choose to perform my music.

 

IIRC, I'M not one who is usually complaining about much. I don't recall too many posts where I've bitched about how much the music business sucks, how bad the gigs are, or that I hate the music I "have" to play. Yet if I so much as make a comment about how I don't have a "wouldn't be caught dead" attitude about music, I get a "some of us just play what we love!" thrown back in my face?

 

Really? Look, I'm sorry if some of you can't find happiness and fullfillment doing what you're doing, but that means you gotta put down what others do in the process? Why? Have I ever put down what you do, Pat? I don't think so. I have all the respect in the world for the music you play and the reasons you choose to play it. That's all cool with me. And if your motivations are different than mine, then I respect that. Have I ever indicated that I don't?

 

If it seems like I harp on making money a lot---that's ONLY because half the threads in this forum seem to revolve around people bitching about making more money and ---if making more money is what anyone wants to do...then yeah. I can probably help sme people with that because I know how to do it. You (general 'you') may not LIKE what I suggest and that's fine. Take it or leave it. But don't bitch about not making enough money and then put down the suggestions from people who actually know something about it.

[Electric Catfish]

 

All of that may be true, but none of that was my point. The point is, Chet got those guys their star power. That is an undeniable fact. That they rejected the product that Chet turned them into is a reality, but the fact remains, had they started out doing their outlaw bit they likely wouldn't have gotten past square one. They became outlaw stars precisely because they were already Nashville stars first who rejected it. Of course that's big news- it would be like Dave Matthews or Lady Gaga rejecting their commercial success and deciding to perform roots music. The timing was right and it allworked out great. But the fact is that Willie, Waylon etc did live TV appearances with Chet after that and that they never said a disparaging word about him personally that I could find says a lot. The main point I was rebutting was the idea that the Outlaws hated Chet and what he stood for. They may have not cared for the production, but he did not become the pariah to the outlaw movement that so many seem to think. As far as I can tell, they still respected him and showed him the love.

 

 

I've never heard (let alone suggested) that Waylon or Willie had any personal animosity toward Atkins. His formula had very marginal success for them, though. Had either of them continued in the vein they were in in the 60's, they probably wouldn't have any "star power" to speak of today. That is, of course, speculative, but most folks these days don't even know what either of them looked like without a beard. Regardless of commercial concerns, the quality of the music improved drastically when they lost the schlock and sheen.

[BlueStrat]

 

Actually, I don't see it as tougher. Playing only music "I love" is the easiest thing in the world to do. Playing stuff you maybe don't have that "personal connection" with and performing as if you do---that's work and takes experience and professionalism to do well. In my experience, a lot of the reason players DON'T do that is because they don't really want to work. They just want to get up on stage and "do what they love" and expect to get paid well for it.

 

 

Your point is well taken. And actually, I was only kidding you and was making a reference back to an old thread we discussed ages ago; I forgot to put the winkie face on it. Though I don't expect to get paid well for it, because nothing around here "pays well" anymore. I just talked to a guy last weekend during one of my breaks, a fellow player, who has played a place for three years twice a month and once a week during the summer, a big resort, and they just asked if he'd take a pay cut-not because the bar is doing any worse, they actually are doing better- but because the rest of the resort is hurting and they're cutting expenses across the board.

 

 

I'm lucky, I suppose, in that I am more drawn to performing and pleasing audiences than I am to connecting-with-music, so I can put the former first and just use the music as the vehicle to help me do that. As long as the crowd is happy, I am. So it's a win/win for me.

 

 

You are lucky indeed, as I have told you before. I maintain that people play for two main reasons (most people are a combination of the two, but rend to one side or the other): either the music is the object and the band is the means, or the band is the object and the music is the means. Both are legit, and we need both.

 

 

It saddens me that so many others are unhappy with their place in the present environment. It seems to me it would be a lot easier if such people could just let loose and enjoy what there is. Whether that's playing for 5 people or 500 or playing old country or Katy Perry or playing covers or originals.

I hear ya, but to be truthful I have NEVER been happy with things the way they are. I always strive to get better, play better, work at opening new venues, play stuff most people don't get to hear a live band or solo play, and push boundaries musically. It's a hard road. Yes, playing what I love is easy. But playing it and selling it are two very different tings, and selling it is really, really hard. I could throw in the towel on what I love and just go play the hits, but I would hate it. I know, because I have done it several times just to work. But at this point in my life? If I hate it, what's the point? I can go work a day job I hate and make 5 times the money I make playing music. Or, I could play music I hate and still make the same amount of money I make doing what I want, it's just that I might get a few more bookings. It's not even a decision for me. As much as I bitch about the state of the business, I won't compromise my values with music.

 

 

Sorry if it sounds like I'm getting up on a soapbox (again) but frankly I'm growing a bit weary of hearing both so many complaints and so many snide (and not so snide) comments about what is 'wrong' with how I choose to perform my music.

 

 

That knife cuts both ways. You have a habit of implying, whether you are aware of it or not, that people who don't play the hits and give the audience what they want aren't "getting it." I find that patronizing and condescending. And yes, I will respond snidely when I see it.

 

 

IIRC, I'M not one who is usually complaining about much.

OOOoookaaayyy...

 

 

I don't recall too many posts where I've bitched about how much the music business sucks, how bad the gigs are, or that I hate the music I "have" to play. Yet if I so much as make a comment about how I don't have a "wouldn't be caught dead" attitude about music, I get a "some of us just play what we love!" thrown back in my face?

 

 

See my comment above.

 

 

Have I ever put down what you do, Pat? I don't think so.

Not directly, no. You tend to do it in a backhanded way. "Once people here start figuring that sort of {censored} out, they might actually make some money instead of just bitching about how they don't so much of the time" for example. Maybe yo can help me ''figure it out", O great one.

 

 

If it seems like I harp on making money a lot---that's ONLY because half the threads in this forum seem to revolve around people bitching about making more money and ---if making more money is what anyone wants to do...then yeah. I can probably help sme people with that because I know how to do it. You (general 'you') may not LIKE what I suggest and that's fine. Take it or leave it. But don't bitch about not making enough money and then put down the suggestions from people who actually know something about it.

 

 

Maybe because the suggestions being made are irrelevant to some markets,and I get tired of being told by folks here that what works in their market will work everywhere, when it's simply not true. I tire of the implications that it isn't working here because it's never been tried. It has been tried, over and over, but the realities are what they are. I just wish people in better markets could grasp that fact and stop airily insinuating that those of us living in those markets are clueless dolts who don't know what we're doing, that if we just understood that all you have to do is X,Y or Z, why, you'd be a top tier band playing A list clubs, etc etc. when there are no A list clubs, no upper echelon of cover bands, no one paying cover, etc. We're trying to squeeze blood out of turnips here.

 

I'm just going to stop posting on this site. Nothing I can contribute will help anyone. I live is a cultural desert and economically depressed on top of it. I'll leave you guys in the decent markets to talk about it, because I can't relate to your market and it's obvious you and a few other guys here can't relate to ours.

[BlueStrat]

 

I've never heard (let alone suggested) that Waylon or Willie had any personal animosity toward Atkins. His formula had very marginal success for them, though. Had either of them continued in the vein they were in in the 60's, they probably wouldn't have any "star power" to speak of today. That is, of course, speculative, but most folks these days don't even know what either of them looked like without a beard. Regardless of commercial concerns, the quality of the music improved drastically when they lost the schlock and sheen.

 

 

That suggestion didn't come from you, but it was definitely made.

[TIMKEYS]

 

Don't be such a wad. You don't have a clue what I would or would not "be caught dead" playing. If you haven't learned anything else from what I've posted over these years, you should have learned that I'm not one who cares so much about how much I love a song and am not afraid to be "caught" playing anything. It's others here who get all caught up in having to have a "personal connection" to a song or who worry about being embarrassed to being playing something should one of their old friends walk in. I'm a professional performer. I like to get on stage and perform for people and get paid for it. Music is the medium. If I wasn't interested in performing and only the music, I'd stay home. It's not that complicated. I don't know why I have to keep explaining myself to you over and over.

 

 

Dave ,, i think you need to go back and review the last week or two worth of posts you made on here. Its full of foul language and name calling and verbal abuse. Whats with you these days? I am serious , you have been a real jerk in a good deal of your posts. I will still stick to the theory that most people who hate modern country try to hide behind the idea that, oh yea i just love the old stuff. I know that when I was 17 riding around as a helper on a service truck in the summer and playing in teen bands ,, I hated old country. It was called modern country then though lol. I had to listen to that {censored} 8 hours a day. Today at 60 i am playing it 4 and 5 days a week. BTW you were 7 years old when most of that stuff was on the radio. Its funny that all you guys all try to hide your hate for modern country all in the same little corner you back yourselfs into.

[BlueStrat]

 

I will still stick to the theory that most people who hate modern country try to hide behind the idea that, oh yea i just love the old stuff.

 

 

I actually do love the old stuff and hate the new stuff. No one can ever tell me that "Red Solo Cup" or "It's 5 O'Clock Somewhere" will ever rise to the level of songs like "He Stopped Loving Her Today" or "I Fall To Pieces".

[Vito Corleone]

That knife cuts both ways. You have a habit of implying, whether you are aware of it or not, that people who don't play the hits and give the audience what they want aren't "getting it." I find that patronizing and condescending. And yes, I will respond snidely when I see it. Not directly, no. You tend to do it in a backhanded way. "Once people here start figuring that sort of {censored} out, they might actually make some money instead of just bitching about how they don't so much of the time" for example. Maybe yo can help me ''figure it out", O great one.

 

Fair enough, but my "bitching" in this regard is just a frustration in getting tired of hearing the same old complaints over and over. I'm not bitching about MY life or business or music, as so many others tend to do here.

 

Here's the conversation I'm generally tired of having:

 

Poster #1: How can I make more money playing music?

 

Poster #2: Well, try doing A, B and C. That's worked for me.

 

Poster #1: But I don't want to do any of that {censored}. That's a "sell out" in my view. I just want to play what I want the way I want to play it.

 

Poster #2: That's cool, but then be prepared to be making the same money you're making now for pretty much the rest of your musical existance.

 

Poster #1: But why This (usually some big-name original music) Artist is REALLY successful and he just does it "his way"?

 

Poster #2: Well, then obviously YOU don't have what HE has going for him. And unless you DO, you gotta go back to A, B & C if you wanna make some cash.

 

We go around and around with these discussions. They get nowhere, but none of this stuff is really rocket science. If you only want to play "from your heart" and are satisfied with whatever-results-that-brings---then GREAT. Go for it. BE HAPPY. But if they are really so damned happy then why are people asking for 'more' and asking for suggestions on how to get "more" out of what they do? And why are they so quick to ridicule what those suggestions might be or the people who deliver them?

 

I get tired of the dance and tired of the complaints. The music biz ain't what it was 30 years ago. News flash: nothing else is either. Make your way in the new paradigm or get out of the business but bitching isn't going to change anything.

 

 

Maybe because the suggestions being made are irrelevant to some markets,and I get tired of being told by folks here that what works in their market will work everywhere, when it's simply not true. I tire of the implications that it isn't working here because it's never been tried. It has been tried, over and over, but the realities are what they are. I just wish people in better markets could grasp that fact and stop airily insinuating that those of us living in those markets are clueless dolts who don't know what we're doing, that if we just understood that all you have to do is X,Y or Z, why, you'd be a top tier band playing A list clubs, etc etc. when there are no A list clubs, no upper echelon of cover bands, no one paying cover, etc. We're trying to squeeze blood out of turnips here.

 

Hey. You don't have to tell me that. There ARE no clubs to speak of in Lake Tahoe. There's a couple of guys who make a living doing the solo thing at restaurants and like one tour-boat steady gig that the same band has tied up for decades, and that's about IT. Even the casinos up here don't really hire bands much any more. The ONLY reason my band has found any success at all is because we're willing to travel and compete in markets that DO have work. Grant's stories seem to revolve around creating your own "A list" venues out of nothing at all. Which probably not everyone can do, but hopefully many can learn SOMETHING from his stories about his business model. And as I'm sure those who live in bigger markets will tell you, it's no easier in those places either. Because there's simply more bands and more "A list" bands to compete with.

 

It's ALL work, regardless of how you go about it. Nobody just hands anybody money in this world. You have to work for it in one way or another. If it was just as simple as "drop that Stevie Ray Vaughan tune and learn some Gaga" then that might be something to talk about. But it's not. It's not about songlist. It's about what you do with it. (Which I think is a sentence I've only repeated 8,000 times here.) There's no shortcuts. And anything I ever offer is ONLY offered as a suggestion that hopefully somebody can take SOMETHING from and apply as needed. And if not....ignore it and that's fine too.

 

I'm just going to stop posting on this site. Nothing I can contribute will help anyone. I live is a cultural desert and economically depressed on top of it. I'll leave you guys in the decent markets to talk about it, because I can't relate to your market and it's obvious you and a few other guys here can't relate to ours.

 

Oh c'mon, Pat. What's this about?

[sbrett]

 

I actually do love the old stuff and hate the new stuff. No one can ever tell me that "Red Solo Cup" or "It's 5 O'Clock Somewhere" will ever rise to the level of songs like "He Stopped Loving Her Today" or "I Fall To Pieces".

 

 

But you're not comparing old stuff to new stuff, you're comparing mediocre songs (at best) to excellent songs.

[TIMKEYS]

 

I actually do love the old stuff and hate the new stuff. No one can ever tell me that "Red Solo Cup" or "It's 5 O'Clock Somewhere" will ever rise to the level of songs like "He Stopped Loving Her Today" or "I Fall To Pieces".

 

 

The difference pat is you actually play the old stuff I would guess. I know we would never do red solo cup. We will play "It's 5 O'Clock Somewhere" typically by request. we do toes by request. We are not anti modern country , but we slant the shows more toward texas music and red dirt type stuff. I think the thing that makes the band I play in popular is because it was started by a solo performer who has a massive song list. Our thing is introducing tourists to music most of them have never heard before. They just keep comming back and its not long before they are singing along. The biggest buzz is when they sing along to the original stuff.

[Vito Corleone]

 

Dave ,, i think you need to go back and review the last week or two worth of posts you made on here. Its full of foul language and name calling and verbal abuse. Whats with you these days? I am serious , you have been a real jerk in a good deal of your posts.

 

 

I've only been a jerk to you, I think. And that's pretty much only been when, as here, you've been a jerk first. I don't need YOU to tell me what kind of music I like and don't like or what I "wouldn't be caught dead" playing or not. I really don't.

 

 

BTW you were 7 years old when most of that stuff was on the radio. Its funny that all you guys all try to hide your hate for modern country all in the same little corner you back yourselfs into.

 

 

Yeah, I was pretty little when most of it was 'new'. A lot of it was already old then. I heard it primarily because that's what my dad listened to. My dad was a farmer and cattle rancher. I was raised on a farm. He'd come home on play his copy of "Hank Williams' Greatest Hits" almost every night. We watched "Hee Haw" regularly. I'd be a thrilled little kid when I got to ride in his pickup with him and "help" him with his work and he had the country music station blaring on his radio. That was my childhood. That old stuff is embedded in my DNA at this point. And yeah, a lot of it I DIDN'T like when I was a little kid but it's years later that you realize that stuff you grew up with is meaningful to you. That's how life usually works.

 

So yeah, if I get nasty and tell you to {censored} off when you try to tell me that I'm somehow lying when I say I like the old stuff, then yeah. That's because I MEAN it in your case.

[TIMKEYS]

 

I've only been a jerk to you, I think . And that's pretty much only been when, as here, you've been a jerk first. I don't need YOU to tell me what kind of music I like and don't like or what I "wouldn't be caught dead" playing or not. I really don't. Yeah, I was pretty little when most of it was 'new'. A lot of it was already old then. I heard it primarily because that's what my dad listened to. My dad was a farmer and cattle rancher. I was raised on a farm. He'd come home on play his copy of "Hank Williams' Greatest Hits" almost every night. We watched "Hee Haw" regularly. I'd be a thrilled little kid when I got to ride in his pickup with him and "help" him with his work and he had the country music station blaring on his radio. That was my childhood. That old stuff is embedded in my DNA at this point. And yeah, a lot of it I DIDN'T like when I was a little kid but it's years later that you realize that stuff you grew up with is meaningful to you. That's how life usually works. So yeah, if I get nasty and tell you to {censored} off when you try to tell me that I'm somehow lying when I say I like the old stuff, then yeah. That's because I MEAN it in your case.

 

 

Dave ,, go back and real all the post you have made... you were doing that with other posters. You are acting like a dick on here and i do think the mods should give you a little time out.

[Vito Corleone]

 

Dave ,, go back and real all the post you have made... you were doing that with other posters. You are acting like a dick on here and i do think the mods should give you a little time out.

 

 

What other posters have I done that with?