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If you enjoy planning rigs, be my guest.


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Currently have:

 

-open back 2x12: (vintage 30's)

-Peavey Classic 50/50 power amp

-Rocktron Hush rack unit

-Vox Tonelab SE

-A handful of pedals...muff, eq, and a bunch of others

 

My ultimate rig will:

 

-Have a wide range of tones/fx easily obtainable via midi pre-sets. Preferably different flavors of amp tones.

-Be able to apply fx to all or part of the signal.

-Be able to apply fx to the delay/reverb only and not the original signal (ie modulated reverb)

-Possibly be stereo, dual mono (different cabs) or bi-amp'd (w/crossover)

-Be able to integrate with pedals (fuzz, whammy,comp, uni-vibe etc) mainly before the pre-amp. All able to use pre-sets.

-Be dead quiet and reliable.

-Maybe be able to trigger samples (not always guitar related) via footswitch and feed them to FOH (not the guitar amp).

-Able to use midi to control parameters via expression pedal.

-Be simple to use when playing. (programming doesn't bother me as much, just gotta learn the gear).

-Sound awesome.

 

Tall order I know, I thought it would be cool to see what kinda stuff you guys could come up with.

Ignore half of it if you want as it will be a work in progress for a loooong time. I will have to build it up piece by piece, possibly upgrading parts as the whole rig quality warrants it (of course I would like to get the best from the beginning, but it aint always possible.)

 

I'm pretty much after the functionality of a multi fx/modeller, but better sounding and without the limitations (fx placement, inability to change certain components etc).

 

 

Go!

 

 

Or tell me where I'm going wrong, I'm new to rack stuff. :thu:

 

Cheers guys.

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I'll have to think long and hard about some of your requirements there, but it seems to me that your differing requirements and routing needs mean you'll need a rackmount sampler (you can pick up old E-MU or AKAI models pretty cheap) for triggering, and a Sound Sculpture Switchblade GL for your routing and mixing needs. And / or an Axe-FX. I'll revisit this when I'm more awake!

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The sampler is not as big of a deal as the rest of it, but it would be nice to run it off of preset changes or what ever.

 

Could also do the same for vocal FX but that's just getting silly...or is it? I've seen to many shows (and big shows at that) where the sound guy has messed up the vocal fx.

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To be honest, I'd rather leave sample triggering to someone else in the band, ideally off something big and obvious like a Roland SPD-S, as hitting the wrong footswitch at the wrong moment could be rather embarrasing! Alternatively running them from a computer running something like Ableton Live would work well. I've never worked with musicians who are that into trying technology like that, though, although I'm well up for it. Ironically, in my current band, our keyboardist is probably the least interested in modern technology!

 

I know exactly what you mean about planning ahead building a rig. I had a 12U rack based rig with a couple of heads that worked great, but wasn't very modular and thus was a pain in the butt to deal with. So I've stripped it out and built a couple of rigs with more flexibility... one's mostly pedalboard based, with 2 heads, 2 2x12 cabs and a 2U rack (just a GSP1101 and a Marshall 8008 power amp), while the other is my work in progress.

 

Because of the modular system, at the moment I'm doing a musical (We Will Rock You) so I've got my 2U rack, one head, and one Rocktron All Access with a couple of expression pedals, and that covers everything I need for the show, with my 2x12 cabs. But then I've got a gig coming up mid-March that I need my big rig for, which will be a pedalboard with just a wah pedal, my 2 All Access boards and three expression pedals, the two heads, the 2U rack along with a 12U rack with pedals, anoter GSP1101, my RG-16 and a G-Major in it, and four cabs. This rack is the work in progress... I know I'll be adding a RJM Effect Gizmo to it, and a bigger line mixer, but it's deciding which pedals to use, and whether to add any more rack gear, that's the fun bit :)

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Yeah, but I work in a high school that's big on performing arts so I've got plenty of local contacts. There's not much work around if you're wanting paying for it, but if you're prepared to volunteer it's not that hard to find. Try contacting the local Amateur Dramatic societies and stuff.

 

BTW, ran sound for a (wedding) gig at Keele Hall a week ago. Not a fan of the place at all, electrics were crap and the staff weren't terribly helpful, plus it was up a flight of stairs... not fun with subwoofers. Plus that's about the worst laid out university campus I've ever visited IMO. Small world though!

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To be honest, I'd rather leave sample triggering to someone else in the band, ideally off something big and obvious like a Roland SPD-S, as hitting the wrong footswitch at the wrong moment could be rather embarrasing! Alternatively running them from a computer running something like Ableton Live would work well. I've never worked with musicians who are that into trying technology like that, though, although I'm well up for it. Ironically, in my current band, our keyboardist is probably the least interested in modern technology!


I know exactly what you mean about planning ahead building a rig. I had a 12U rack based rig with a couple of heads that worked great, but wasn't very modular and thus was a pain in the butt to deal with. So I've stripped it out and built a couple of rigs with more flexibility... one's mostly pedalboard based, with 2 heads, 2 2x12 cabs and a 2U rack (just a GSP1101 and a Marshall 8008 power amp), while the other is my work in progress.


Because of the modular system, at the moment I'm doing a musical (We Will Rock You) so I've got my 2U rack, one head, and one Rocktron All Access with a couple of expression pedals, and that covers everything I need for the show, with my 2x12 cabs. But then I've got a gig coming up mid-March that I need my big rig for, which will be a pedalboard with just a wah pedal, my 2 All Access boards and three expression pedals, the two heads, the 2U rack along with a 12U rack with pedals, anoter GSP1101, my RG-16 and a G-Major in it, and four cabs. This rack is the work in progress... I know I'll be adding a RJM Effect Gizmo to it, and a bigger line mixer, but it's deciding which pedals to use, and whether to add any more rack gear, that's the fun bit
:)

 

Good point about the sampling stuff, just an idea. Maybe ableton or something would be the best way to go.

 

Rig pics and explaination please?

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Currently have:


-open back 2x12: (vintage 30's)

-Peavey Classic 50/50 power amp

-Rocktron Hush rack unit

-Vox Tonelab SE

-A handful of pedals...muff, eq, and a bunch of others


My ultimate rig will:


-Have a wide range of tones/fx easily obtainable via midi pre-sets. Preferably different flavors of amp tones.

-Be able to apply fx to all or part of the signal.

-Be able to apply fx to the delay/reverb only and not the original signal (ie modulated reverb)

-Possibly be stereo, dual mono (different cabs) or bi-amp'd (w/crossover)

-Be able to integrate with pedals (fuzz, whammy,comp, uni-vibe etc) mainly before the pre-amp. All able to use pre-sets.

-Be dead quiet and reliable.

-Maybe be able to trigger samples (not always guitar related) via footswitch and feed them to FOH (not the guitar amp).

-Able to use midi to control parameters via expression pedal.

-Be simple to use when playing. (programming doesn't bother me as much, just gotta learn the gear).

-Sound awesome.


Tall order I know, I thought it would be cool to see what kinda stuff you guys could come up with.

Ignore half of it if you want as it will be a work in progress for a loooong time. I will have to build it up piece by piece, possibly upgrading parts as the whole rig quality warrants it (of course I would like to get the best from the beginning, but it aint always possible.)


I'm pretty much after the functionality of a multi fx/modeller, but better sounding and without the limitations (fx placement, inability to change certain components etc).



Go!



Or tell me where I'm going wrong, I'm new to rack stuff.
:thu:

Cheers guys.

 

{censored} that's complicated!! :eek:

 

 

 

I'll try sinking my teeth into it.

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Off the top of my head, you could do something like Zachman's rig.

 

Basically, his rig is Guitar->pedals->amp->load/lineout->rack effects->stereo poweramp->speakers

 

He uses MIDI to change different pedals, amps, and the effects.

 

He has doubled up the effects so he can run different combos of things, e.g. modulated reverb, or just modulation, or reverbed chorus etc. He does this by having two mixes, where Mix 1 feeds Mix 2, ie Mix 2 is effected by everything preceeding it. If he doesn't want Mix 2, he just switches it out. Or no effects, switches both out and goes to the stereo poweramp.

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Off the top of my head, you could do something like Zachman's rig.


Basically, his rig is Guitar->pedals->amp->load/lineout->rack effects->stereo poweramp->speakers


He uses MIDI to change different pedals, amps, and the effects.


He has doubled up the effects so he can run different combos of things, e.g. modulated reverb, or just modulation, or reverbed chorus etc. He does this by having two mixes, where Mix 1 feeds Mix 2, ie Mix 2 is effected by everything preceeding it. If he doesn't want Mix 2, he just switches it out. Or no effects, switches both out and goes to the stereo poweramp.

 

hmmm, I never quite got exactly the way it worked.

 

I might have to get 2 multi fx, one for the whole signal (ie the 1st thing after the preamp) and one to effect the delays/verbs. Then run a separate delay rack and the 2nd multi fx in parallel (no dry signal coming from the delay, delay feeding the multi fx). Some how do the same for the verb, problem being that if I use delay and verb at the same time, it could be a problem with the parallel chain (ie only reverb on delays and not on the dry sound or visa versa). I guess I could have a reverb rack in a 2nd parallel loop also feeding the input of the 2nd multi fx and use the 1st multi fx for verb if I want to use delay at the same time.

 

I get the feeling I'm over complicating things. :facepalm:

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Good point about the sampling stuff, just an idea. Maybe ableton or something would be the best way to go.


Rig pics and explaination please?

 

As said, it's a little in flux at the moment (and not much of it is at home) but it used to look like this:

 

rackfront.jpg

 

With a Peavey JSX head, Peavey XXX head, two Laney GS412LA cabs and two Laney GS212IE cabs. I don't keep my IEM system in my rack anymore, and the Marshall 8008 power amp and one of the GSP1101 units are in a separate rack case... missing from the picture is a TC G Major, and still to come is a RJM Effect Gizmo and a better line mixer (there is a little Rolls mixer on the second pedal shelf on top of an Axess GRX4).

 

My non-MIDI pedalboard (pic to follow) currently has my modded Burkey Flatliner Pro power supply, the two modded DS1s, the Acoustic Simulator pedal, a Bad Horsie wah, Little Alligator volume, a Korg tuner pedal, the footswitches for the two amps, a Radial Headbone VT, a Suhr ISO Line-Out box, the GRX4 and a Rocktron MIDI Xchange pedal on it. Basically, the guitar runs into the wah, then to the GRX4 loop 4 (with the Korg tuner in it) for a mute switch, then to loops 1-3 (Acoustic Sim and the two DS-1's in the loops), then it goes to the Little Alligator and out via a Pedalsnake to the GSP1101 in the 2U rack. From the send it goes back down the Pedalsnake to the Headbone, which switches between the two heads, then from the speaker level out to the Suhr ISO box. The speaker thru goes to the dry cab(s) (depends on the size of the gig), the line out goes back up the Pedalsnake to the return of the GSP1101, then into the Marshall 8008 power amp in stereo and to the wet cab(s). My 2x12 cabs are switchable mono / stereo so I can either take just 2 2x12 cabs with me, or 2 2x12s and 2 4x12s.

 

The big rack / MIDI rig I'll come back to later, because it's a bit complex and I'm hungry :)

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As said, it's a little in flux at the moment (and not much of it is at home) but it used to look like this:


rackfront.jpg

With a Peavey JSX head, Peavey XXX head, two Laney GS412LA cabs and two Laney GS212IE cabs. I don't keep my IEM system in my rack anymore, and the Marshall 8008 power amp and one of the GSP1101 units are in a separate rack case... missing from the picture is a TC G Major, and still to come is a RJM Effect Gizmo and a better line mixer (there is a little Rolls mixer on the second pedal shelf on top of an Axess GRX4).


My non-MIDI pedalboard (pic to follow) currently has my modded Burkey Flatliner Pro power supply, the two modded DS1s, the Acoustic Simulator pedal, a Bad Horsie wah, Little Alligator volume, a Korg tuner pedal, the footswitches for the two amps, a Radial Headbone VT, a Suhr ISO Line-Out box, the GRX4 and a Rocktron MIDI Xchange pedal on it. Basically, the guitar runs into the wah, then to the GRX4 loop 4 (with the Korg tuner in it) for a mute switch, then to loops 1-3 (Acoustic Sim and the two DS-1's in the loops), then it goes to the Little Alligator and out via a Pedalsnake to the GSP1101 in the 2U rack. From the send it goes back down the Pedalsnake to the Headbone, which switches between the two heads, then from the speaker level out to the Suhr ISO box. The speaker thru goes to the dry cab(s) (depends on the size of the gig), the line out goes back up the Pedalsnake to the return of the GSP1101, then into the Marshall 8008 power amp in stereo and to the wet cab(s). My 2x12 cabs are switchable mono / stereo so I can either take just 2 2x12 cabs with me, or 2 2x12s and 2 4x12s.


The big rack / MIDI rig I'll come back to later, because it's a bit complex and I'm hungry
:)

 

Sweet rig man!

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Have you considered checking out the AxeFX with a good FRFR setup?

It may give you most of what you are looking for and be considerably less to haul.

 

 

Honestly, no I haven't. I don't know much about AxeFX, but it seems people are constantly bringing it up so I guess they have a pretty good rep. Have you used one?

 

If possible, I do want to get away from modelling. I don't know why but I guess I'm keen on a 'real' rig (what ever that means). But if the AxeFx is legit, (ie uncompromising sound quality, unlike all other modellers I've heard/used) then it is definitely an option.

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Honestly, no I haven't. I don't know much about AxeFX, but it seems people are constantly bringing it up so I guess they have a pretty good rep. Have you used one?


If possible, I do want to get away from modelling. I don't know why but I guess I'm keen on a 'real' rig (what ever that means). But if the AxeFx is legit, (ie uncompromising sound quality, unlike all other modellers I've heard/used) then it is definitely an option.

 

 

I do have an AxeFX, as well as the GSP1101...and almost every Line 6 unit ever made...and a few other modelers.

The AxeFX is far more involved, more tweakable and makes the others sound like junk. Even if only used for effects, it's by far not in the same league as the others.

I've used it both as a stand alone unit that provides my amp/power amp modeling and effects and I've used it with my Egnater rig where I'm only using it for effects. It's incredible at both.

The only thing that keeps me from using it and only it is that I still love the ability to grab a knob and make a quick tweak to my tone without hitting "Layout / Amp / Edit".

Then again, I'm in a new band where I'm still working out my tones and effects and trying to make all the tweaks I want on the fly without having a laptop connected to it for quick changes; it's not quite as easy to make major changes while everybody else is standing there waiting...

Once I get more comfortable with WHAT I'm going to be playing in the new band, I'll be able to make the tweaks and settings on my own time and then walk in and not have to spend so much time fiddling with stuff; then it may be my only unit.

There's something pretty awesome about being able to plug into it and a power amp and have everything you need in a 4 space rack...my problem is that my main rig is a 12 space Mesa shockmount rack which is so heavy, I can't carry it alone -- makes it a pain in the ass sometimes, so the AxeFX and a power amp sure makes life simpler, lighter with next to no compromise in tone.

The AxeFX isn't for everybody - you need to be able to KNOW how to set up gear and tones and have the time to spend with it.

It's not a quick unit to get 100% of what you want.

As long as you know that, it's a great unit.

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