String height from top at bridge

[chuckyz2]

Hi everyone.  New guy here and a couple years in playing but mostly like setting up guitars as a hobby and learning.  Plus they make nice wall art.
Mostly play electric because they are much easier to play.  And I don't play very much.  It took a few years for my fingers to to actually be able to 
play the new Taylor I bought a about two years ago.  214E DLX SB.  I couldn't even play it when I bought it.  Having all the good tools for setups
I checked the frets for level. They were perfect.  So, I was able to lower the action (sanding saddle on a Starrett surface plate, dead flat) with no buzzing.
I also changed the 12's to 11's.  The guitar was a dream to play but got bright and a tad tinny.  I lived with it as it still sounded good compared to most
I've heard.  I am in the tail end of setting up a Martin clone with solid RW back and sides.  I like the tone better.  And I can actually play it.  It has 13's
on it.  So I put 13's on mine and the tone changed a lot more than I expected.  Tighter, a little more bass and warmer highs but still very defined. 
Here is where the rabbit hole opened and I fell in.  Still descending. I became very interested in this because I still play better with lights.  But 
I am over the tone.  IT seems to the general belief by those with time in playing, setting up and building, that string spacing from the sound board
is important.  That by lowering my action, that in itself will brighten up the guitar, reduce sustain and rob some bass and volume.  
So I went to guitar center to buy a new Nut and saddle and plan on getting that spacing back by putting the saddle height back. I took it down a lot. 
The brake angel on the high E barely brakes.  Lol.  It get better as the strings get thicker.  I lowered the high strings to what is close to a low action 
electric.  They will go low without buzzing as long as you don't beat on it.  Anyway,  I learned the proper way to lower action is with neck angle. 
This is where the wheels started spinning:
If I change the angle, the top of frets wont be level with top of bridge.  Taylor recommends the straight edge should slide right over the bridge wood.
If you change the angle, that will change.  But I can't see the string height changing, which is a good thing.  In my mind that setup requirement is
to keep the strings at the recommended .5" off the sound board.  

I have a bolt on with side and top shims.  Taylor has a system of shims that have to be used a certain way together to get the neck angle changes.
My thought is that I only need to add a shim to the top and that will raise the neck and not change the plane.  Raising the neck in stead of lowering
lowering the saddle.  Not something you would do on set neck.  Too costly and invasive.  I'm pretty sure I can get my action, keep the strings off
off the board and have the proper saddle height brake angels and torque on the saddle to get the top to act like it was designed to act.  
I get less bright high end, more volume and better bass tone.  I can't see the importance of straight lining up with the top of the bridge if the
other areas are in spec. And having the ability to easily raise the neck, or change angle easily is something I've grown to really appreciate
in the Taylors unique bolt on/shim design.  
Wood like to hear the thoughts of those in the know on my plan.

The Guitar sounded amazing when I bought it I know heavier strings make a huge difference.  I am curious to see if the string clearance will
make a noticeable difference tones also.  

For those of you that are going to tell me to buy a Martin or a guitar I like already, save it.  I know all about that already.  
This is mostly a learning experience on a guitar that was only 1200 new and only worth 8 or 9 now.  
I played an older Taylor 810b (Brazilian) and fell in love with that thing.  Might put it on layaway tomorrow.  
They didn't have any high end Martins and said there is a long wait time if I order one.  But I would like to
play one to compare.  But I have my heart set on BR back and sides and those are hard to come by with
the grain and color I like for a price I can afford.  I'm going to have to sell my CS Nocaster or CS 59 Strat.
It's going to be a coin toss on which one because I love them both.  But I'm really liking acoustics now
that I can actually play them with a heavier string.   

[garthman]

5 hours ago, chuckyz2 said:

Hi everyone.

. . . .  It seems to the general belief by those with time in playing, setting up and building, that string spacing from the sound board
is important.  That by lowering my action, that in itself will brighten up the guitar, reduce sustain and rob some bass and volume.  
 

 

Hello and welcome

Well I've been playing guitar for over 50 years and I've been doing my own set ups and minor repairs and adjustments for almost that long too. I have never heard anyone mention that the height of the strings above the soundboard is of importance. Neither have I experienced any difference in sound quality after lowering action (assuming you don't get silly about it - I know one person who dropped the action so low that the strings rattled if you blew on them - but I fixed it for him).

[badpenguin]

Let's go a different route then neck angles and all that. (Also never heard that height above sound board is that important. After 40 odd years of working on guitars, I think I would have heard everything.) Saddle material is... what? You never mentioned. Go obvious, go bone. Got endpins? Go bone or ebony. Brass is nice for looks but end up with a slightly brighter tone.

Stings themselves... you went from 12's to 11's. String material? Bronze? Phosphor bronze? Silk and steel? For a warmer tone, I go Martin Silk and Steels. Some people swear by Elixer... I wouldn't use them on an enemy's guitar. Same with the Martin Authentic Acoustics. Never felt anything so stiff and lifeless. 

[DeepEnd]

Hi and welcome. First, get rid of the idea that you set action by changing the neck angle. You set action by changing the height of the saddle. When a straightedge laid along the frets just touches the top of the bridge, the angle is correct. Place a capo at the first fret and hold down one of the E strings at the neck/body joint (usually the 14th fret) and measure the gap between the string and the 7th fret. It should be about the thickness of a sheet of paper. That's called "relief" and you adjust it with the truss rod. Changing relief will also change the action height so set it first. When the neck angle and relief are correct and the low E string is 3/32" or so above the 12th fret with no strings fretted, the action is correct. You should have some break angle but personally I don't make a big deal out of it. I have an Alvarez beater that has little break angle on the high E and it doesn't seem to matter, at least to me. And last, I've never paid the least attention to how high my strings are above the soundboard. I suggest you worry less about it and more about whether your guitar is playable.

Edited February 16, 2022 by DeepEnd