Members stangconv Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Been doing some reading on small powered subs. I have looked into the Proel Flash 15's and have pretty much figured on getting 2. There are none in Canada for me to listen to, but I can get 2 shipped to me for $600 each. These would be pretty much exclusively for DJ'ing small events to fill out the bottom end a little. I have looked at used Yorkville LS700P's but the lack of crossover put me off. I like that you can plug 2 outputs into 1 subs and have the 2 outs go into 2 tops. Not sure if all powered subs do that. I also like the casters built in. Should be a quick and easy 1 man setup. I don't need earth shaking loud, or super down low bass. Just to fill out the bottom end on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dogoth Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 I've heard good things about Proel. I have never actualy used them so take that for what it's worth. I've been meaning to try and find a couple to demo as I'm thinking about buying a pair for my little club P.A. They are NOT top end boxes but every review I've read says bang for buck they are pretty good. If you do buy a pair, please give us a review. I'm interested as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 very good choice. I've had a pair for about 3 years and they have been stellar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stangconv Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 What do you use them for? DiD you do a review of them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bugzie Posted May 7, 2011 Members Share Posted May 7, 2011 I have 3 of them. First off you can do a lot better than $600 each. Look around for last years model. I picked up a pair delivered for under $900. I dealt with Joe at KPODJ and he was great. Especially since one showed up with transportation damage, hence the third. He took care of it right from the get go. They are pretty good for what they are. I use a pair under a set of QSC HPR122i's and they rock real well. The QSC's will out run them easily but I just turn them down till I get a good balance. I have to say that the QSC's and Proels make one hell of a keyboard rig. Someone in one of the early reviews called them "musical" and I have to agree, but I'm partial to the sound of a 15" sub. Might have something to do with having a set of Klipsch LaScala's and a set of Klipsch Belle's in my living room...LMAO They move some air but not in the league of a good 18. The big advantage is that it takes some of the workload off of the top boxes. That makes a pretty significant difference. Funny thing is that I bought them to suppliment the thump for the drummers monitor setup. In that use they far exceeded my expectations. The bass player even mentioned how much better his sound was. Can't wait til they paly again so that I can try giving the bass player one too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stangconv Posted May 7, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 7, 2011 I'm in Canada,and the are NO (0) Proel dealers in canada. I get the subs for. $400 each and 300 shipping for the pair. Thanks for the review. I am pretty pumped to hear these bad boys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members themusician Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 I'm interested in hearing how these work out as well..will be waiting to hear ...ummm..what...you hear...lol.. Cheers, B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 Just FYI these are rated at 126db peak - the little Danley TH-Mini's are rated at 135db peak which is about 8x more powerful . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stangconv Posted May 8, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 Powered? Just did a quick look at the Danleys and while they look like great little subs, they aren't right for my application. I don't run my DJ rigs. So I need to have a very simple setup. With the Proels my DJ's can run out of our mixer into a single Proel and then up to the tops. Simple easy clean. The weddings we do don't get crazy loud, so the lack of DB's is worth the lighter weight and ease of setup. If they were powered now.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 Just FYI these are rated at 126db peak - the little Danley TH-Mini's are rated at 135db peak which is about 8x more powerful . Sure the Mini's may do 135 peak. But that would be at 2800 watt input. They are rated at 700 rms, 1400 program, 2800 peak. So guessing the 135 peak output would be from a 2800 watt input. http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/pdf/TH%20MINI%20Spec%20Sheet.PDF You would also need a 2800 watt amp to get this output. I believe the Mini list for for $1200 and a good amp that would give 2800 watt output for around $800? so $2000. For the same price your looking at 4 proels. 2 would give you 132 dbs. What the Mini gives you at a 1400 watt input at 1/2 the price. 4 proels 138 dbs. So spending the same 2 grand on proels gives you 3 dbs more output. Of course which would be louder is not the same as which setup would sound the best. Or which would be the easist to load in,out. 1 box or 4 is kind of a no brainer. But $500 compared to $2000 is a big step as well. Looking at Peak output is at best tough within the same speaker brand/line. Between 2 different companies its just a guess until measured. Who runs their gear at peak levels all the time just to get the job done anyway? Dookietwo Edit: Proel does have a new line of subs. The Flash series I believe are gone. http://www.proel.com/proel/products/sound_system.html?cid=12446378643680/13026234532090/&mode=a This new sub has a 500 watt amp and sports 128 db output. http://www.proel.com/proel/products/sound_system.html?cid=12446378643680/13026234532090/&pid=kms/11066738967290/13027921732870 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 Sure the Mini's may do 135 peak. But that would be at 2800 watt input. They are rated at 700 rms, 1400 program, 2800 peak. So guessing the 135 peak output would be from a 2800 watt input. Yep. 2 [Proels] would give you 132 dbs. I've never seen that +3db for coupling two actually materialize with subs - has anybody ever measured that? Looking at Peak output is at best tough within the same speaker brand/line. Between 2 different companies its just a guess until measured. Who runs their gear at peak levels all the time just to get the job done anyway?A surprisingly large amount of DJ types - at least for a while . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 I've never seen that +3db for coupling two actually materialize with subs - has anybody ever measured that?A surprisingly large amount of DJ types - at least for a while . Subs placed next to each other are the easiest to couple and measure. Closer than 1/4 wave length will give you the best results. 3 dbs for twice the wattage. 3 dbs for twice the surface area. In the case of the proels twice the port area. 126 + 6 = 132dbs. Subs placed apart as in L/R stacks will give 6 dbs in some areas and cancel out in others. Depending on Freq. , location , room etc. When I place 2 like subs touching each other with the same wattage to each sub and I get a measured 6 db gain. Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Unalaska Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 Wait a minute, you're running signal to the sub then to the top box? Same signal? what happened to using a crossover? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 3 dbs for twice the surface area. In the case of the proels twice the port area.126 + 6 = 132dbs.At the very least that explanation doesn't make sense. There is a increase in directionality that does give you some increase in SPL in the fore and aft "lobes" but I'd have to see it for myself as to it being actually 3db in real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 At the very least that explanation doesn't make sense. There is a increase in directionality that does give you some increase in SPL in the fore and aft "lobes" but I'd have to see it for myself as to it being actually 3db in real life. This one is very easy. Take a pair of subs. Put 1 stereo power amp on them or 1 amp channel per sub.Put 1 watt of power into just 1 sub. It should read around 98 dbs or so depending on the sub. (We will say 98dbs for this)With that sub still on turn up the other sub. You went from 1 watt to 2 so you doubled your wattage. 3 Db increaseYou went from the surface area output of 1 18 to 2.so you get another 3 db increase.6 dbs total. Now if you divide that 1 watt between the 2 subs you will only gain 3 dbs. Double the surface area. With the proels you have double power and surface area. To get 6 dbs louder you'll have to go from 2 subs to 4. Want to be 6 dbs louder than that you have to go to 8 subs. Then 16, then 32. Thats how it works.Of course with enough subs you can control the bass direction much as a line array depending on how stacked ordelayed. Put down 2 subs and measure for yourself. You will find a 6 db gain when you double drivers and voltage (wattage) Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted May 8, 2011 Members Share Posted May 8, 2011 I this thread I was mixing 2 different types of sub. I ended up adding delay to one of them to get a very close 6 db increase.If both subs were the same it would have given a 6 db increase in the entire freq range. You can see it still is very close with 2 totally different sub types. http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/mv/msg/42761/0/0/51/ Please note this link is down from roughly 4am to 7 am est. daily Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted May 9, 2011 Members Share Posted May 9, 2011 Wait a minute, you're running signal to the sub then to the top box? Same signal? what happened to using a crossover?you can run a straight "thru" signal to the top cabs from the subs, or you can switch them to filter the lows out of the top cabs at either 110 or 160 hz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members themusician Posted May 9, 2011 Members Share Posted May 9, 2011 Who has the best price on these in the states? Thanks!! Cheers, B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stangconv Posted May 12, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 12, 2011 kpodj.com is where I am getting mine... Become a VIP member for free to get a better price. Gonna order tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bob411 Posted May 14, 2011 Members Share Posted May 14, 2011 kpodj.com is where I am getting mine... Become a VIP member for free to get a better price. Gonna order tomorrow. Tried that a couple of months ago. VIP price + shipping was two, or three dollars less than regular price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bob411 Posted May 14, 2011 Members Share Posted May 14, 2011 you can run a straight "thru" signal to the top cabs from the subs, or you can switch them to filter the lows out of the top cabs at either 110 or 160 hz. What connectors do they have? XLR in, and out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mockchoi Posted May 14, 2011 Members Share Posted May 14, 2011 What connectors do they have? XLR in, and out? Left and right inputs are combo XLR/Quarter inch. Left and right outputs are either XLR or 1/4 inch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members HarpNinjaMike Posted May 15, 2011 Members Share Posted May 15, 2011 I have one and will get a second. I use them for band application, but have ran music through them several times. I think they'd work for your application. The largest live setting I've used it in is the 150ish people range, but we play rock, fwiw. I like the size and weight and got mine for well under $500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bugzie Posted May 15, 2011 Members Share Posted May 15, 2011 Keep in mind that the Flash has been discontinued. Work that for a better price. They ship from Proel's Florida warehouse. I think you can pick a pair up for somewhere around $850-875 delivered in the northeast. Shipping would be dependant on distance so figure from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stangconv Posted May 30, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 30, 2011 Well they should be here tomorrow.... I must say Proel has been a HUGE help in getting me these subs. It was kinda tricky getting them over the border (stupid customs) but ED and Natalia from Proel went above and beyond, in answering emails super quick and getting all the info customs needed to get it across. I feel great having bought them just for the service they have provided! Heres a pic of the back (from google images) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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