Some Kind Of Fire/USB Mixer/Interface Thingy. HELP.

[LordBTY]

I'm in a band that uses a drum machine through logic. After many gigs of using the headphones output through a DI on a macbook, we've realized sound guys don't like it.

 

We basically need something we can hook up to the macbook via usb/firewire and assign each track/drum to. To elaborate: we want to be able to send different tracks through to the sound desk via some kind of interface. I'm aware there are mixers and interfaces out there. I'm ultimately looking for something budget that can handle maybe four or more outputs - that's it.

 

Help!

[agedhorse]

WHY do sound guys not like it???

 

That's the most important question. They may not like the other solution even more.

[RoadRanger]

Surprisingly enough very few Soundguys seem to carry a 1/8" stereo to dual XLR transformer isolated interface for the stage. What's up with that anyways? I have three Art DTI's now . Anyways just get one of these:

http://audiopile.net/products/DI_Boxes/DBRC-2A/DBRC-2A_cutsheet.shtml

and a 1/8" male TRS to male TRS cable or use an Art DTI with a 1/8" male TRS to dual male RCA cable. I prefer the Art DTI because it can do XLR in to XLR out which is useful for taking a stereo feed from a keyboard amp or submixer.

[twostone]

 

I'm in a band that uses a drum machine through logic. After many gigs of using the headphones output through a DI on a macbook, we've realized sound guys don't like it. We basically need something we can hook up to the macbook via usb/firewire and assign each track/drum to. To elaborate: we want to be able to send different tracks through to the sound desk via some kind of interface. I'm aware there are mixers and interfaces out there. I'm ultimately looking for something budget that can handle maybe four or more outputs - that's it. Help!

 

 

Maybe a Focusrite Saffire IIRC is a 4x6 interface meaning 4 inputs and 6 outputs and you can assign your Logic tracks out to the 1-6 interface out.

I'm assuming your drum machine is pre-programed and recorded into Logic so when you play out your using the mac for play back for your drum tracks?

If not use the drum machine to the mixer?

 

Here's something that you might look into later on.

EZdrummer it's a software based drum machine with endless combination of groves and fills, since it has midi files that come with it.

You can program and arrange midi groves and fills in Logic for really complex drumming if you got the time, even tempo changes since your using a Logic as your DAW program.

Another advantage with EZdrummer is you can send different kit pieces to the FOH mixer with the Saffire.

For example you could assign your Saffire outputs like this 1-kick, 2-snare, 3-toms, 4-OH's and still have 2 left over.

That way the soundguys has more control of the drum mix.

Just food for thought for ya.

[LordBTY]

To elaborate, I mean we use a jack converter via the headphones output straight into a DI box and then works fine. The issue sound guys don't like is the fact that they can't adapt the kick/snare/everything else for the venue/system very easily. We hold the laptop on stage and we're reluctant to hand over logic to the sound guy.

 

We, in fact, use EZdrummer, but thank you for you recommendation. That said, we also use DnB drums in our set as well (just mentioning that.)

 

Is there anything under

[twostone]

I understand you don't wanna hand your lappy over to the SE. Do you show up early enough to maybe re-mix your drum mix for the room? What sounds good in your headphones might sound so good in a larger room through a PA along with reflective surfaces.

 

Might look in the used market for a usb interface which will be cheaper then a firewire interface, but usb might have more latency vs firewire.

[twostone]

Oh yea when I mean re-mix. What I meant by that is, you might have to re-eq the drums and turn off the reverb or room ambiance FX for the room. I'm assuming DnB is loops probably with the 808 kick which not much you can do with loops except tweak the EQ so it sounds good blended in with the rest of the band.

[agedhorse]

How about taking some time to balance the drum mix out so that it's good to go without messing with multiple channels to the console? As a sound guy, this is how I would prefer it.

 

Be sure that you are not using a Y cable to sum the outputs of your laptop, that can make them sound a little distorted and lackig dynamic range. Be sure you have a proper summing device or carry and AV direct box (that has the summing built in.

[LordBTY]

Actually, I don't use premade loops - unless you count sampled breakbeats e.g. the amen break.

 

We show up plenty early, but sound guys generally aren't willing to let our soundcheck go on for too long and they're not necessarily willing to let us fiddle for however long it takes. When it comes down to it, the sound guy generally wants to do the sound and he has no idea what our sound is as we're so different. A USB interface would be good, but I'd like to know what would be best and find out a specific product - figured I could ask people on here as well as trying to find my own.

 

But no, drum and bass rarely uses an 808 drum - the 808 drum, more or less being a sine wave, is more appropriate for sub frequencies - our kick drums tend to spike around 100hz to make room for the heavy sub frequencies on the bass. I also have a home studio set up with flat response speakers and the like, so I do have a good idea of what I'm doing.

[agedhorse]

How does a home studio that's "flat response" give you a good idea of what it will sound like in the field?

 

This is a very important aspect of what you are trying to do IMO.

[LordBTY]

With all due respect, it's there for various uses, not just making live tracks. We have the means to eq each individual drum sound live via the laptop but for an unpaid, casual gig it is unlikely that a sound guy will devote much time or let us devote much time to running everything, including the bass + guitars + vocals. What a sound guy wants is to be able to raise the cymbals/snare/kick/synths/bass etc.

 

I think you have completely misunderstood the score - the sound is fine, it's well mixed and I'm more than competent knowledge of audio technology. What I don't know, however, is the name of a low cost, low latency interface I can hook up from the laptop to the sound desk - thank you for everything else, but that's all I'm really asking for.

 

Edit: To make it clear again, I EQ everything anyway during soundcheck but sound guys generally want to be controlling everything at their desk.

[agedhorse]

What I was getting at is that you need to do your track eq while listening to speakers TYPICAL OF WHAT THEY WILL BE PLAYED THROUGH in a live event.

 

Look, I do this sort of thing professionally, I am offering suggestions based on the thousands of events I have done. I'm suggesting ways that have a history of working in the field and suggesting ways to avoid things that have a history of problems in the field.

 

If all you care about is self-validation of what you are trying to do without the experience of those here who have been there and done that, you might have better luck in the recording or video forums. That's where re-inventing the wheel seems to be taken to a higher are.

[LordBTY]

I'm not really trying to prove anything, I feel like we have a misunderstanding here. When it comes down to it, I can EQ and fiddle all I like but it doesn't change the fact that sound guys are actually quite difficult to work with. We've played through many sound system and I want to emphasize again that we do EQ during sound check.

 

I've had many people doing our sound complain that they couldn't change each individual levels when they felt it appropriate. I'm sorry if I've offended you in some way, but I'm not currently finding your input helpful. When it comes down to it, if I had a large sound system in a hall some where, I might be able to spend a while trying to find tonal consistency and get everything present whilst yelling at the bassist/guitarist for changing their tone where they're not supposed to.

 

What I'm asking for is a method of the guy who has more experience working with the system more control. I'm asking for help with that, nothing else. Everything else is fine and we have had good sound before, but it's rare that the sound guy really knows what to do with such an odd set up.

 

But for the record, I was pretty offended you assumed I was mixing through headphones and using pre-made loops, but I can understand why you thought that would be the case. But no, if you think a Drum and Bass kick drum is probably an 808, then I'm afraid it's apparent that the genre is a mystery to you and I'd appreciate it if you didn't talk down to me.

 

Again: we EQ live and it can have great results, but we're not always in the position to spend a heavy amount of time in sound check. After all, the sound guy also needs to accommodate each sound to the sound of the guitarist and the bassist (seeing as we're often using house amps, this can vary alot.)

[LordBTY]

I'd appreciate it if you could use your experience to recommend an appropriate interface for my needs.

[RoadRanger]

If you're looking for cheap you can just use multiple 2 channel USB dongles (and still use the headphone output too), they are something like $5 and up on fleaBay. You'd still need DI's for them. Also I know they sell cheap 5 channel sound dongles but I don't know if the Mac can "talk" to them as individual channels?

[twostone]

SO if your drum mixing is so great then why are SE's complaining?

Let me guess you got a different drums for every other song?

$160 and you expect perfection good luck.

[LordBTY]

Let me guess you got a different drums for every other song?

 

Nope, we have two sets of virtual 'kits' - one made to sound 'real' the other to be electronic.

[agedhorse]

 

But for the record, I was pretty offended you assumed I was mixing through headphones and using pre-made loops, but I can understand why you thought that would be the case. But no, if you think a Drum and Bass kick drum is probably an 808, then I'm afraid it's apparent that the genre is a mystery to you and I'd appreciate it if you didn't talk down to me.

 

 

Not me saying this, you have this all mixed up. I never suggested you were mixing through headphones (studio monitors was what I was commenting about) and I just "might" have designed a few mics in my day... 808 was not MY comment.

 

I was just suggesting what I see work most of the time most reliably out on the road. Since I do mostly national acts, perhaps my comments don't apply to the level you are at.

[LordBTY]

 

Not me saying this, you have this all mixed up. I never suggested you were mixing through headphones (studio monitors was what I was commenting about) and I just "might" have designed a few mics in my day... 808 was not MY comment. I was just suggesting what I see work most of the time most reliably out on the road. Since I do mostly national acts, perhaps my comments don't apply to the level you are at.

 

 

Woops, sorry, I wrongly read something as your comment.

 

Yeah, the main issue is the bizarre nature of our set up and the lack of humility with regards to understanding it combined with the limited time we get in sound check. That said, when it comes down to it, he/she's more used to working with the sound system - the downside is that they're not so used to embracing electronica in the manner that we do, so we're keen on making it as easy as possible for them.