Mixing E-Drums: Separate or Combined Outputs

[TheDoctorMo]

For those of you who use/mix electronic drums, do you prefer to have individual outputs from the drum module or let the drummer mix the levels and only send a mono or stereo feed to the main mixer?

 

One of these days, I want to get a set of e-drums for home and the hopes that my drummer will want to use them.

 

However, I can imagine that a less-expensive module that only gives a stereo output will cause problems mixing the FOH and IEMs.

 

Is it worth the extra grand, or so, to get a module that has 4+ outputs?

 

Thanks

mike

[tuchan]

I mix a band that runs a TD20. I use the 8 outputs plus the stereo L/R out. The 8 outs are for FOH pre fader and I send the stereo back to the drumstage monitors. Stereo is AF so the drummer can set his own levels and mix to his liking.

 

PF and AF on the brain

[twostone]

Personally I like 4 sends that way I got control of the kick, snare, grouped toms, and group cymbals, so if I need to adjust the snare EQ I'm not EQing the whole kit with just your typical stereo send. Lot e-drummer like to change kits for particular songs so with the 4 sends I got more control if for example the kick has been boosted really hard because it sounds great in the drummers headphone but not so great in the room.

Also depends on the drummer it's not a must have direct sends and if the drummer takes time to tweak the kits to the PA and room a stereo send is sufficient.

[KF650SB1000]

More outputs to me to contorol the drums volume level the better it is.

[dboomer]

Just the opposite to me. If you spend time adjusting the presets and get the exact balance you want then separate output only increases the possibility that someone will screw it up.

 

I use a Roland TD-12 brain and send the mixed kit in stereo. I usually use the pan pots on the mixer to reduce that stereo mix to something that is mostly mono.

[witesol]

I like a kick, snare and everything else on the stereo outs or a mono out. that way if the mix is jacked up or there is no time to balance the kit, like no soundcheck, i can at least work the kick and snare. then you have high frequency stuff mixed with low on the stereo so subtle EQing can balance toms w cymbals

[twostone]

 

Just the opposite to me. If you spend time adjusting the presets and get the exact balance you want then separate output only increases the possibility that someone will screw it up. I use a Roland TD-12 brain and send the mixed kit in stereo. I usually use the pan pots on the mixer to reduce that stereo mix to something that is mostly mono.

 

 

Yea but I run aux fed subs how would that work out?

[jwlussow]

We assign all 8 outs for the TD-20. I guess I'm just semi-old school. I mix it just like an acoustic kit. I guess a stereo or summed out would be fine but I like the control over each trigger.

[abzurd]

We use a TD-8 and have for many years now. It has 4 discrete outputs and we do Kick, snare, toms/crash, hat/ride. I think it's important to maintain the ability to mix the kick and snare versus sending a stereo signal where you can't do anything until the set is over and you can get to the module. There's also the aspect of being able to tweak the channel strip EQ for a subgroup of the drums versus the entire send. I'd love a TD-20, but frankly nobody would notice and it's not like we'd get better gigs if we used it. The TD-8 has good enough sounds and 4 outputs seems to be a good balance between being too limiting with a stereo output and needing a 24 channel board because 8 channels of 16 channel mixer are taken up with drums.

[IsildursBane]

 

Yea but I run aux fed subs how would that work out?

 

 

One of the big draws of aux fed subs is reducing the amount of LF feedback and rumble that's picked up by microphones onstage. An electronic kit does not have this problem, because there are no microphones. Just send the whole kit to the subs.

 

-Dan.

[TheDoctorMo]

Lots of good information. I'm thinking the 4-out module would be perfect because, as Abzurd said, I don't want to suck half the channels of my SL1642 just for drums. Four would be plenty as long as the toms and cymbals are premixed on the module.

 

This would also allow me to send a different mix of kick, snare and very little of the rest to the IEMs.

 

Since we run FOH from the stage, most of the time, it would be a necessity to have the kit levels set as good as possible with little tweaking required at the mixer.

 

I'm actually surprised how many of you are using e-drums. I really wish our drummer would start heading that way, but he is old school and just assumes the module will break.

 

Thanks again

mike

[abzurd]

The module may very well break. Unfortunately, e-drums are expensive because the smart money says you need a backup. We had ours fail once and need $200 in repairs. We carry a backup..... except that night. I almost killed my drummer. Ended up with a miced up 5 gallon paint bucket, a tambourine taped to the high hat trigger, kick drum trigger with paper over it and miced and a lot of cowbell. We made it through, but the drummer will NEVER make that mistake again.

[twostone]

 

Lots of good information. I'm thinking the 4-out module would be perfect because, as Abzurd said, I don't want to suck half the channels of my SL1642 just for drums. Four would be plenty as long as the toms and cymbals are premixed on the module. This would also allow me to send a different mix of kick, snare and very little of the rest to the IEMs. Since we run FOH from the stage, most of the time, it would be a necessity to have the kit levels set as good as possible with little tweaking required at the mixer. I'm actually surprised how many of you are using e-drums. I really wish our drummer would start heading that way, but he is old school and just assumes the module will break. Thanks again mike

 

 

If your mixing on stage and use the same PA over and over a stereo send would be fine as long as you took a little time to make any necessary parameter adjustment for the room your playing in. If it a Roland e-kit their tech told me that they use a dial down method so IME the factory kits have a lot of ambience so dialing down the ambience will help along with maybe a little minor EQ tweak for what ever kit piece and your good to go.

[agedhorse]

 

Just the opposite to me. If you spend time adjusting the presets and get the exact balance you want then separate output only increases the possibility that someone will screw it up. I use a Roland TD-12 brain and send the mixed kit in stereo. I usually use the pan pots on the mixer to reduce that stereo mix to something that is mostly mono.

 

 

I agree, I would rather have a good mixed output than winging it on the fly. This means spending the time and effort editing in advance. I also do not care for a wide stsreo spread.

[twostone]

 

Lots of good information. I'm thinking the 4-out module would be perfect because, as Abzurd said, I don't want to suck half the channels of my SL1642 just for drums. Four would be plenty as long as the toms and cymbals are premixed on the module. This would also allow me to send a different mix of kick, snare and very little of the rest to the IEMs. Since we run FOH from the stage, most of the time, it would be a necessity to have the kit levels set as good as possible with little tweaking required at the mixer. I'm actually surprised how many of you are using e-drums. I really wish our drummer would start heading that way, but he is old school and just assumes the module will break. Thanks again mike

 

 

Could be your old school drummer doesn't like the feel of a e-kit. It the number one complaint I get with my e-kit from drummers that never played on a e-kit.

[jwlussow]

I was actually pretty surprised how natural the pads on the TD-20 felt. I'm not a drummer but was expecting less bounce back. They felt like real drums to me.

[MarkGifford-1]

We use to use 4 - K, Sn, Stereo mix of Toms/Cymbals.

 

Worked fine.

 

MG

[jgthatsme]

I used DDrum 2 for about 10 years and then tried DDrum 4 for a few years. I fell asleep and didn't jump on DDrum 3, but that's a story for another time.

 

My DDrum 2 module had individual outs for every pad. My DDrum 4 module had some indidual outs and some group outs. Things were much better with DDrum 2 in my opinion. For our typical events (weddings, corporate events, etc.), I mixed sound from behind my kit. For larger events when a pro sound company ran sound or in studio, the engineers were extremely happy when I could give them individual outs for each pad.

 

Editing things in advance is great, and it needs to be done, but it always needs some refinement based on the venue. I think it's best to give the engineer the ability to control as many levels as possible. Also, some guys edit in advance with headphones, others use cheap studio monitors, others use home stereo gear...no telling what will be used. I always achieved my best results by finding the sounds I wanted for my e-kits mixed within the module and monitored through my PA, and then sending the individual pads to a line-level mixer so I could tweak things as needed.

[agedhorse]

 

I always achieved my best results by finding the sounds I wanted for my e-kits mixed within the module and monitored through my PA, and then sending the individual pads to a line-level mixer so I could tweak things as needed.

 

 

Editing with your typical PA can get you a level of conistency that may be better than your average hack level club/dive bar sound guy can get with individual channels. Also, you can generallly program 1 output for a monitor mix that would only be routed to monitors (like kick & snare).