Do I want or need a new iPad???

[6Imzadi]

The I/O on an iPad is not remarkable. There is a headphone out, and the rest is through the "plug". Whatever it's called. I've seen a guitar player use it for plugging his guitar into it and using garage band, making it sound any way he wanted it to sound. (plugins)

 

To run smaart, you need an input for the source signal and an input for the mic. You don't have that on the iPad that I know of.

 

I am willing to learn if I am wrong.

[kmart]

 

The I/O on an iPad is not remarkable. There is a headphone out, and the rest is through the "plug". Whatever it's called. I've seen a guitar player use it for plugging his guitar into it and using garage band, making it sound any way he wanted it to sound. (plugins) To run smaart, you need an input for the source signal and an input for the mic. You don't have that on the iPad that I know of. I am willing to learn if I am wrong.

 

 

Not wrong, but there are more and more i/o devices being released for the iPad every day to allow for lining in mics, 1/4" line level devices, etc. I have heard both fantastic and not so great things about the Alesis i/o interface.

[jasps]

I've been living in the techno-doldrums for quite a while now. I've never owned a cell-phone,,, I've never owned an iPod,,, and I don't own an iPad. I don't have a laptop nor a notebook. Things are about to change. I'm looking for a portable computing device, so I can run some tests using SMAART, or one of the freebie analysis programs that were recommended in the RTA thread. Will something like the 2nd generation iPad, be capable of handling this software? Are there any compatibility issues I should be aware of? (Mac/PC) I thought about a MacBook Pro, but boy they're pricey. Why a MacBook Pro? Because, I have quite a few FireWire devices. I have an Apogee Duet interface, and Alesis HDXR 24ch, the PreSonus 24ch StudioLive, etc. Mind you, I already own an iMac, with FW, so I suppose I could get by with the iMac, solely for those items. I wouldn't necessarily need the portability. As for the Mac laptops, you have to go with a MacBook pro, to get FW. What will the iPad allow me to do? Are there audio ins and outs? Can I playback music from an iPad? I'm considering a 2nd generation model with Wi-Fi, 32gb memory, and a dual-core A5 processor. $569. for a refurbed. Your thoughts/comments are appreciated.

Hi, as with anything, you are going to have to define expectations first.

 

Depending on what kind of measurement detail you want to get into, the iPad or iPod touch may be fine. Certainly for an RTA it will work.

 

FWIW and, IME, When I am doing a loudspeaker alignment and tuning(smaart 7), I like a fairly decent sized screen and I like a keyboard for keyboard shortcuts. With a Mac-mini, you could use any dual-FFT program and your apogee interface with an RTA mic and be a lot further advanced than an iPad, but not nearly as "slick" in terms of portability.

 

I have an iPhone 4s that is an awesome piece of hardware and I use iPads regularly for control of LS9 and M7CL consoles and AV control, but I wouldn't want to do SERIOUS measurements from either.

 

So, my advice is that if you only want a passable RTA function and break music and perhaps a fun device, stick with an iPod touch or iPad, but if you want to get serious about measurement, go with the Mac mini.

 

best

[jasps]

 

My understanding though, is that you can't run this app (SMAART) on an iPad. Prices on used iPads up here, are not very good. I'd probably buy refurbed, directly from Apple. That way, it's fully warranteed, and not much more expensive than "used"

 

 

FYI, you can get a TF measurement from Studio Six Digital with phase and magnitude, but SMAART 7 code cannot be ported to iOS. You may be able to do single channel measurements with the Smaart app, but you would be paying for the name "smaart," without the real functionality.

[Bobby1Note]

OK, this begs the question; how much analysis capability do I need/want? Since I've never done testing, nor witnessed in-depth testing, nor do I have any friends or associates who do testing,,,, at what point am I in over my head? Heck, I'm not looking to design a speaker from scratch here,,, I'm trying to determine frequency-response,,, do a little SPL testing at various room locations,,, and setting EQ's. Off the top of my head, I don't know how much more I'd realistically need.

[SoundMan]

$500 iPad, and they couldn't put a single USB port on it?

[Bobby1Note]

Yeah, what the heck is that port they use on the iPad? I presume that port works with an optional adaptor. Knowing Apple though, you could probably run a ton of stuff through that port.

[kmart]

$500 iPad, and they couldn't put a single USB port on it?

 

No, they very well could have put 8 USB ports on it based on the size.

They chose not to, I'm certain for very specific reasons, too.

[scarecrowbob]

 

Not wrong, but there are more and more i/o devices being released for the iPad every day to allow for lining in mics, 1/4" line level devices, etc. I have heard both fantastic and not so great things about the Alesis i/o interface.

 

 

Indeed, but the point is that in order to run smaart you need two inputs, and the ipad has one.

[agedhorse]

 

and I'm replacing my current furnace with a more energy-efficient unit, with heat-pump,,,,

 

 

You are using a heat pump in your climate? Beware that back-up electric heat is ~1/3 as efficient as the heat pump under realistic operating conditions and you may find that in your climate you end up on back-up heat more often than heat pump. Do you have oil/gas/propane available? If so, it's probably less costly and more efficient to use as both the primary and back-up heating fuel unless you don't have a lot of time below ~0 deg C outside. Note that I am being a little sloppy as coefficient of performance is being used kind of interchgangably with efficiency.

 

Heat pumps work great where the ouotside temp is generally above 0 deg C most of the time and is "more" ideal when above 5 deg C. As temp decreases, the COP decreases approaching 1, where 1 is resistance heat. It's limited by the Carnot cycle process.

[Bobby1Note]

Andy,

 

I really don't know much about the details of heat-pumps, but from what I gather, the heat-pumps are used until the outside temperature reaches -12 degrees Celsius (+10 degrees Fahrenheit). Once that temperature is reached, the "bi-energy system" kicks over to the "other" heat-source (proposed 40Kw electric furnace in my case).

 

Apparently, electricity is the cheapest way to heat, here in Quebec. Oil is the most expensive, followed by LNG (gas). I'd have to look into current pricing, but last time I looked, oil was over $1./liter (roughly $4.50/gallon), gas was roughly $0.70/ cu. metre, and electricity was under $0.05/ kwhr.

 

My current system is a forced-air "bi-energy" oil and electricity system. The system uses a 30kw electric furnace to -12C, then switches over to oil when temps drop below -12C. That worked fine when heating-oil was $0.50 a litre.

 

BTW, I have a 400 amp electrical entrance here. It's a fairly big house (roughly 4000 sq.ft.) My existing furnace got damaged in a basement flood, and has to be changed. I talked to six different contractors, and all were in agreement that an electric furnace and heat-pump, was the most efficient way to go, given our current market conditions.

 

I'll definitely check into the latest technology though, before signing on the dotted line. Geo-thermal is available, but apparently it's VERY expensive to install.

[fdew]

 

I don't like smartphones - as they seem to suck people into their world and then have them at their mercy.. constantly looking down at their screens typing/texting while driving, while talking with others, while doing anything. Constantly reaching for it in when it produces a sound in anticipation of an email that is received. The smartphone becomes their life. I find it so annoying.... Al

 

 

Smart phone are great tools but it is important that the owner be smarter then the phone. Often not the case.

 

Frank

[jasps]

OK, this begs the question; how much analysis capability do I need/want? Since I've never done testing, nor witnessed in-depth testing, nor do I have any friends or associates who do testing,,,, at what point am I in over my head? Heck, I'm not looking to design a speaker from scratch here,,, I'm trying to determine frequency-response,,, do a little SPL testing at various room locations,,, and setting EQ's. Off the top of my head, I don't know how much more I'd realistically need.

You are already in over your head, you just don't know how far until you get more sophisticated measurement tools.

 

any dual-channel FFT software will give you better results for EQ decisions--based on FR, but simple SPL and FR are easily handled by single channel measurements, you just have to know that your FR measurement is time blind so your results can be skewed somewhat.

[kmart]

 

Indeed, but the point is that in order to run smaart you need two inputs, and the ipad has one.

 

 

Actually, the point is that some of the third party i/o devices allow for more than one input (Case in point, the Alesis dock has 2).

[kmart]

$500 iPad, and they couldn't put a single USB port on it?

 

Thinking about this more on a philosophical angle...

 

Why should an iPad, or ANY tablet device, have a USB port?

 

Or more importantly, why WOULD it?

 

The generic point of a tablet is to allow for even more freedom of mobility/portability than a laptop. Hell, one could almost argue that by definition, a tablet should definitely NOT have a feature-set that allows for tethering down/to something else in the first place.

 

Now of course, what you or I end up deciding we want to do with a tablet device is up to us alone, and certainly it's possible for third parties to create aftermarket add-ons that allow for connecting an iPad or other tablet to all sorts of things, but I would suggest that if you require a multi-media capable device that is also readily portable, and which still allows you to attach all manner of other items to it, then what you really want is a laptop, and not a tablet.

 

 

The facepalm in your post alludes to you believing Apple failed by not having a USB port on the iPad. I think it was a conscious effort by them not to do so for reasons described above: they aren't interested in making it something that it is not.

[mrcpro]

 

Why should an iPad, or ANY tablet device, have a USB port?

 

 

Drag and drop? I know that there's other more sophisticated ways of transferring files, but I use my USB connection on my Samsung tablet all the time because I'm a dumb{censored}.

[jwlussow]

I personally don't see a need for any ports on the iPad or any tablet. They all have connectors that can be used to transfer data and they all have some type of wireless. I have no issues transferring files via wifi. Very fast and very easy. The dock connector has access to allow data transfers' too. It doesn't seem that tablets were ever meant to replace laptops. If those connections are really that important then a tablet is not what you should be using.

[fdew]

 

Thinking about this more on a philosophical angle... Why should an iPad, or ANY tablet device, have a USB port? Or more importantly, why WOULD it? The generic point of a tablet is to allow for even more freedom of mobility/portability than a laptop. Hell, one could almost argue that by definition, a tablet should definitely NOT have a feature-set that allows for tethering down/to something else in the first place. SNIP The facepalm in your post alludes to you believing Apple failed by not having a USB port on the iPad. I think it was a conscious effort by them not to do so for reasons described above: they aren't interested in making it something that it is not.

 

 

 

This goes back to the statement from Mutha Goose. The whole Apple concept of "you don't need to know because we do it all for you" just doesn't sit well with me. Not on my computers, and not in my government :-).

 

Apple decided how a tablet should and would be used and decided it didn't need a USB port. A different approach might have been;

 

There are thousands of USB devices out there and we can't predict what will be used or how so lets throw in a USB port.

 

Case in point, I work with a company that builds small motorized devices that are powered and controlled with USB. This company has built a prototype motorized fader that can be used with a tablet to control a sound board remotely. But not a Apple tablet.

 

http://www.picard-industries.com

 

Frank

[scarecrowbob]

"There are thousands of USB devices out there and we can't predict what will be used or how so lets throw in a USB port."

 

I gotta say, I think that in general, this is a problematic design principle. A designer's job is expressly to predict what the device will be used for (and how, when where, by who, etc.) and make something that fits those decisions.

[fdew]

 

"There are thousands of USB devices out there and we can't predict what will be used or how so lets throw in a USB port." I gotta say, I think that in general, this is a problematic design principle. A designer's job is expressly to predict what the device will be used for (and how, when where, by who, etc.) and make something that fits those decisions.

 

 

I am a full time designer and you are correct, but a designer must also understand that he can not fully know how his design will be used. A big part of designing is working in things that will allow unexpected use and other things to prevent misuse.

 

Frank

[kmart]

 

Apple decided how a tablet should and would be used and decided it didn't need a USB port.

 

 

No, that's not at all accurate.

 

Apple decided how THEIR tablet should and would be, and decided it didn't need a USB port.

Apple also decided to offer a laptop with only flash memory for storage and no media drive as well.

I fail to see why that's a problem.

 

If you, or anybody else wants or NEEDS a tablet-like device that has a USB port, (or a laptop with a a moving parts hard-drive/media drive) you are free to buy one that has those features.

 

In my experience, attempting to make something that is suited to ALL situations (or as many as possible) generally means that the resulting product will be great for none of them.

[fdew]

 

No, that's not at all accurate. Apple decided how THEIR tablet should and would be, and decided it didn't need a USB port. Apple also decided to offer a laptop with only flash memory for storage and no media drive as well. I fail to see why that's a problem. If you, or anybody else wants or NEEDS a tablet-like device that has a USB port, (or a laptop with a a moving parts hard-drive/media drive) you are free to buy one that has those features. In my experience, attempting to make something that is suited to ALL situations (or as many as possible) generally means that the resulting product will be great for none of them.

 

 

Of course we are. We are also free to comment on how a good product could be better. I looked at apple, I liked a lot of things. I bought a Motion Computing. The motorized devices work great on my tablet. No problem, life is good. just a comment.

 

Frank

[StratGuy22]

This goes back to the statement from Mutha Goose. The whole Apple concept of "you don't need to know because we do it all for you" just doesn't sit well with me. Not on my computers, and not in my government :-). Apple decided how a tablet should and would be used and decided it didn't need a USB port. A different approach might have been; There are thousands of USB devices out there and we can't predict what will be used or how so lets throw in a USB port. Case in point, I work with a company that builds small motorized devices that are powered and controlled with USB. This company has built a prototype motorized fader that can be used with a tablet to control a sound board remotely. But not a Apple tablet. http://www.picard-industries.com Frank

 

 

No problemo. My iPad connects to my StudioLive via wifi & a Mac mini, which has a few USB ports. Connecting my iPad to my mixer via USB would severely limit it's range.

 

 

 

 

From the look of it, the motor needed for a slider is $245 each when bought in quantities of 10. So I would need 30 of them (29 & one spare)...

 

$7350 + tax.

 

 

 

Hmmmmmmm.....

[jwlussow]

I run Pro Tools using a Splashtop connection. Works fine on my iPad. I'd hate to have to be tethered to do it. Wifi works fine.

[6Imzadi]

 

From the look of it, the motor needed for a slider is $245 each when bought in quantities of 10. So I would need 30 of them (29 & one spare)... $7350 + tax. Hmmmmmmm.....

 

 

Those only move 35mm. Wouldn't work for your mixer. Nice try, I thought the same thing........