Members 144dB Posted May 16, 2016 Members Posted May 16, 2016 One of the trends of the moment must be rolling-off or shelving high frequencies. If you listen to an eighties R&B or pop tune, and then listen to something recorded and mixed today, there is a lot less treble content, despite the advances in technology. Listen to Ray LaMontagne, Ryan Adams, Adele, David Gray, etc., and the high end seems damped. I'm sure it's genre dependent, but it sure seems to be true of the singer/songwriter types.
Members Anderton Posted May 16, 2016 Members Posted May 16, 2016 Interesting. Maybe it's because people are no longer turning Dolby on while recording then leaving it off when mixing. But maybe it's because the more recent songs are being mixed and mastered by a new generation of engineers who haven't blown out their hearing.
Members 1001gear Posted May 16, 2016 Members Posted May 16, 2016 The latter sounds plausible but I suspect there's some consumer training in the mix.
Phil O'Keefe Posted May 16, 2016 Posted May 16, 2016 Just a thought, but maybe it's a reaction to digital and a desire to minimize some of the gremlins that rear their heads most obviously in the high frequency range?
Members nat whilk II Posted May 16, 2016 Members Posted May 16, 2016 My guess is that shaving down the high end helps music listened to on laptop speakers sound just a little bit less horribly horrible. nat whilk ii
Members Anderton Posted May 17, 2016 Members Posted May 17, 2016 Just a thought' date=' but maybe it's a reaction to digital and a desire to minimize some of the gremlins that rear their heads most obviously in the high frequency range?[/quote'] These days when mastering I often roll off the very highest frequencies with a steep 48/dB octave filter. The rolloff starts at about 15 kHz. Interestingly, some people have commented "Oh, so you're using analog processors now, eh?" I will say it does indeed sound somewhat more "analog."
Members Folder Posted May 17, 2016 Members Posted May 17, 2016 I haven't noticed any reduction in high frequencies but I hear a lot less of that "digital" brittleness in today's' recordings.Digital converter technology has improved greatly since the early days and I think that has a lot to do with why today's recordings sound less harsh. I have a hypothesis that there are certain frequency ranges that are more pleasing to the human ear than others. Human ears are attuned to the frequency range of human speech and I think low-mid range frequencies are pleasing to most people. It just so happens that analog tape can produce a pleasing frequency range or "bump". To much high end and to a lesser extent to much low end can sound fatiguing after a while.
Phil O'Keefe Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 I haven't noticed any reduction in high frequencies but I hear a lot less of that "digital" brittleness in today's' recordings. Digital converter technology has improved greatly since the early days and I think that has a lot to do with why today's recordings sound less harsh. I think that could definitely be a contributing factor. It's also possible that more and more people are using tape simulators and other analog simulation plugin software on their stereo busses and that's having a sonic effect on the highs too. I suspect it's probably a combination of factors that vary on a case by case basis.
Members E-money Posted May 19, 2016 Members Posted May 19, 2016 I think that could definitely be a contributing factor. It's also possible that more and more people are using tape simulators and other analog simulation plugin software on their stereo busses and that's having a sonic effect on the highs too. I suspect it's probably a combination of factors that vary on a case by case basis. DAW gain staging awareness too. I think more engineers have figured out the audible benefits of recording individual tracks at lower volumes than they used to in the analog world.
Phil O'Keefe Posted May 19, 2016 Posted May 19, 2016 DAW gain staging awareness too. I think more engineers have figured out the audible benefits of recording individual tracks at lower volumes than they used to in the analog world. I don't know about that. I still get a staggering amount of stuff from home (and even occasionally from "commercial") studios that is just slammed to the wall and even oftentimes clipping because they tracked it so hot. I've been trying to remind people for years that they don't need to track that hot, but if the stuff I get is any indication, lots of people still hold the mistaken belief that tracking as hot as possible is preferable to leaving some headroom.
Members onelife Posted May 19, 2016 Members Posted May 19, 2016 … a new generation of engineers who haven't blown out their hearing. I recently had my hearing tested and I do have significant high frequency deficiency. I've been aware of the classic noise induced dip at 4KHz and took that into consideration but now I'm beginning to wonder if I can trust myself. My loss came from years of playing in front of a Twin Reverb while in close proximity to crashing cymbals. I'm concerned about this "new generation" and what will happen to them as a result of turning up their ear buds to compensate for ambient noise. I set the maximum volume on my iPod at home in a quiet room. Sometimes when I'm outside, the iPod is completely drowned out by the sounds around me but I cannot make it louder or I probably would.
Members Voltan Posted May 19, 2016 Members Posted May 19, 2016 not just high sound pressure levels but also be aware that constant or long term exposure to even relatively low sound pressure levels are quite capable of causing fatigue and permanent damage to our hearing...
Members Voltan Posted May 19, 2016 Members Posted May 19, 2016 all those hours sitting in front of the piano keyboard?
Phil O'Keefe Posted May 19, 2016 Posted May 19, 2016 I'm concerned about this "new generation" and what will happen to them as a result of turning up their ear buds to compensate for ambient noise. It's a significant and very serious health concern. Today, 1 in 5 teens has some form of hearing loss - that's a rate 30% higher than in even the 1980s and 1990s! I set the maximum volume on my iPod at home in a quiet room. That's a very good suggestion - otherwise you're dealing with masking and can't assess the levels accurately. Sometimes when I'm outside, the iPod is completely drowned out by the sounds around me but I cannot make it louder or I probably would. That's the other thing that people are often unaware of - the barrage of environmental noise we're subjected to in everyday life. It's particularly bad in urban and suburban environments, but even rural folks can be subjected to more noise than they might think. Everything from traffic and vehicle noise to household items like vacuum cleaners, blenders, lawnmowers and even hammers. While some locations and occupations are worse than others (and "musician" and "recording engineer" are definitely high-risk occupations!) no matter where we live or what we do for a living, modern society assaults our senses (don't get me started on light pollution), and even damages them - if we let it. Being aware of the volume level that's hitting our ears, and being willing to turn it down (when you can) or wear protection / limit exposure time (when you can't) is a good place to start if you're interested in fighting back, and protecting your precious hearing.
Members onelife Posted May 19, 2016 Members Posted May 19, 2016 "precious hearing" indeed we need to bring Beethoven back for a lecture tour of high schools
Phil O'Keefe Posted May 19, 2016 Posted May 19, 2016 "precious hearing" indeed we need to bring Beethoven back for a lecture tour of high schools Or just modern musicians. I know parents and other "old people" are often ignored, but if it's coming from musicians that the kids like and look up to, I think it would have more impact.
Members Anderton Posted May 20, 2016 Members Posted May 20, 2016 Wear hearing protection on airplanes, you won't regret it.
Members onelife Posted May 20, 2016 Members Posted May 20, 2016 Or just modern musicians. I know parents and other "old people" are often ignored' date=' but if it's coming from musicians that the kids like and look up to, I think it would have more impact. [/quote'] The reason I brought up Beethoven was the word precious that you used in describing hearing. Although Beethoven composed some great music while he was deaf he didn't get to hear it the way everybody else does. btw, I wonder if he got it right - if what he wrote accurately depicts what he was trying to get accross. I usually notice my own mistakes while listening to a playback
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