Members roadweiry Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 We dont always have the option of an isolated split so we are looking to multi track live with the direct outs on our GL2400-32 also. I see the HD24's are cheap on ebay, those 8ch preamp type units are pretty cheap ( will need 3 of them). What would be the best bet for recording live regularly ? I have thought about dumping our GL and its outboard gear so we rented a Studiolive 24 and wasnt really impressed with how it sounded back to back. The recording and no outboard gear is so nice...but for whatever reason it sounded cheap to us. And better digital boards get expensive fast so I think we will just stick with whats payed off and has proven its self..lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soul-x Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 I really don't imagine you are actually hearing anything in the GL that the SL couldn't provide, but if you were looking for cheap, easy tracking of 24 channels, I'd be looking at something similar to a Motu 2408 and some Behr/Presonus/similar AD converters. I am not specifically recommending any brand; just suggesting the type of gear I'd be looking at. Most are pretty comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 I own a HD24XR and use the direct outs on a old vintage Soundtrac Topaz mixer but don't use it for mobile recording because to freaking big and tons of cables. For mobile recording I use cheap sounding SL 1642 mixer being it was good enough for Pual Gilbert to use SL 2442 to record all is live shows with. I guess Pual is not as picky as you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mutha Goose Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 I am very curious as to what sounded cheap to you... There is nothing cheap about the pre's or the converters. They are the same ones used in PreSonus' outboard interfaces IIRC which are very highly regarded in the recording world. I suspect an user-error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members StratGuy22 Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 I multitrack every gig. 2 clicks. Done. StudioLive 24.4.2 No big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IsildursBane Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by Mutha Goose They are the same ones used in PreSonus' outboard interfaces IIRC which are very highly regarded in the recording world. No, they are not.I'm not saying that they're bad or unusable or that they're any better or worse than those in the GL, but they are not "very highly regarded in the recording world." I guess Pual is not as picky as you are. He's a paid endorser. I'd be a lot less worried about that sort of thing, too, if somebody wanted to pay me to not worry about it.To the OP, if you want to keep the GL, I think something like the HD24 is a good idea, though, as pointed out, it's big and will require a few hundred bucks worth of cabling.-Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roadweiry Posted November 5, 2012 Author Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Thanks for the feedback guys, Not trying to turn this into a GL vs SL thing since that seems to be a popular argument on the net. I was just solidifying that I am happy with the current rig to avoid a ton of "get a SL" posts. lol As for our evaluation of the SL involved 2 different systems using 3 different qualified engineers whom we work with on a regular basis. I wasn't alone in my opinion. Certainly cant knock the features of the SL. Moving on.. I like the idea and package of the HD24 as we already have a outboard rack so another small case just for recording isnt going to kill us logistically. Whatever route we go we will most likes get a edac patch bay or better just to make setting up an additional piece of gear not so bad. Our other multi's make for a fast set-up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members StratGuy22 Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Well a bar isn't "regarded very highly in the recording world either" as a good place to record anything either. If you aren't recording with ribbon mics in isolation booths, and full on tube preamps I'm afraid the cork sniffers will look down upon you. Don't forget the Monster Cables lulz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 The HD24 are decent HD recorders just requires lots of cabling or adat type racked micpres. Lot of folks over on the HD24 newsgroup love the Yamaha ov96's along with a Behr ADA8000, Presonus Digimax, and M-Audio Octane are most popular but IIRC the Yamie only support 16 channels of adat and you have to buy an additional adat card. Also just heads up about loud sound environment will require to use shock mounting to reduce sound vibration transmission from low frequency subs can produce. Other then that you'll be good to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Why would anybody need mic pres into an HDR when the source is line level? Want to mess with the signal, now using a mic pre would certainly add more problems than any difference between mic pres in this class of gear. Oh, BTW, the mic pres in the SL are almost identical to those in the GL, so before you start assuming it's the mic pres that you THINK is causing your problems, you might want to step back and consider the other several hundred possibilities first. I have had the SL here in the shop, along with a MixWiz (same preamp as the GL3300, except the 3300 shifts 6dB of maximum gain to the diff amp outside of the input pair, doesn't affect the sound, just the taper) on the identical system with all my lab testing gear, and I thiought that the SL was just as good if not just a bit better (and quieter) than the GL under controlled lab conditions and gain matching on the same system. I have absolutely no problem with the sound of the SL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jorn Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 http://www.allen-heath.com/uk/Produc...CE16&SubCatId= 2 of those will do the trick and you can keep your mixer. thx jorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Why would anybody need mic pres into an HDR when the source is line level? Want to mess with the signal, now using a mic pre would certainly add more problems than any difference between mic pres in this class of gear. What do you mean by messing up a signal using micpre's with the HDR? because I've also own a M-Audio Octane with on board MS encoder for mid side micing.I light pipe in/out via adat with 2 toshlink cables. Never ever had any signal problems. So please elaborate how micpre's can mess up a signal on HDR that lacks preamp section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by jorn http://www.allen-heath.com/uk/Produc...CE16&SubCatId=2 of those will do the trick and you can keep your mixer.thxjorn They look very good but not out until March 2013 which could mean 2014 :-( Nice interface! I wish it had 16 channels of Adat in/out. Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by twostone The HD24 are decent HD recorders just requires lots of cabling or adat type racked micpres. Lot of folks over on the HD24 newsgroup love the Yamaha ov96's along with a Behr ADA8000, Presonus Digimax, and M-Audio Octane are most popular but IIRC the Yamie only support 16 channels of adat and you have to buy an additional adat card. Also just heads up about loud sound environment will require to use shock mounting to reduce sound vibration transmission from low frequency subs can produce. Other then that you'll be good to go. The 01v96 comes stock with 8 channels of adat. You can add another 16 channels of adat with a MY card for 24 channels In/Out of adat. With my Fostex D1624 and D824 midi sync'ed I record 24 tracks that way. Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SpaceNorman Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by jorn http://www.allen-heath.com/uk/Produc...CE16&SubCatId=2 of those will do the trick and you can keep your mixer.thxjorn Can anybody point me to a suggested retail price for this new product? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IsildursBane Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by StratGuy22 Well a bar isn't "regarded very highly in the recording world either" as a good place to record anything either. If you aren't recording with ribbon mics in isolation booths, and full on tube preamps I'm afraid the cork sniffers will look down upon you. Don't forget the Monster Cables lulz I'm not sure what your point is. I made it quite clear that I wasn't slagging the SL; my only comments were about how highly Presonus preamps are regarded in the studio world (they're not) and whether or not a paid endorser's opinions are worth taking at face value.Not having ever used one, I have zero opinion on the sound of the SL. For the purposes of the OP, it's probably fine. If he wants to keep his GL, there are other options. Additionally, if he wants to keep his GL and save some space, but pay a whole lot more money, there's the JoeCo BBR1.The SL may be a perfectly fine piece of equipment; however, it serves no one to exaggerate its standing.-Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by Dookietwo The 01v96 comes stock with 8 channels of adat. You can add another 16 channels of adat with a MY card for 24 channels In/Out of adat. With my Fostex D1624 and D824 midi sync'ed I record 24 tracks that way. Dookietwo My bad thought the Ov96 supported 16 channel of adat stock and the MY card were only 8 channels of adat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Unalaska Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 The new 01v96i has 16ch via FireWire or USB (not sure). But if you have a mixer that you prefer then I'd use a splitter snake and a USB interface if under 16ch and FireWire for more if possible. I use a tascam 1800 which is 8xlr +6 1/4 trs, 2 digital I/O, and 4ch out. I added an 8ch cheap mic pre and a 16ch splitter to the back of the rack. Works great, easy to use and the acer notebook sits on top. Tails go I to the main box or foh mixer and I get 14ch discreet audio. The downside is its only 14ch which goes quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Unalaska Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 The Alesis adat with 3 Behringer ada8000 using optical works great too. I'd use that if I had the need for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dookietwo Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by SpaceNorman Can anybody point me to a suggested retail price for this new product? Looks to be $999Dookietwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by twostone What do you mean by messing up a signal using micpre's with the HDR? because I've also own a M-Audio Octane with on board MS encoder for mid side micing.I light pipe in/out via adat with 2 toshlink cables. Never ever had any signal problems. So please elaborate how micpre's can mess up a signal on HDR that lacks preamp section. What I mean is that the HDR is a line level input device and the output of the inserts (or direct outs) is also line level. Adding a mic preamp between the line level signal path requires that the signal be padded down (or the gain really degenerated) and then reamplified. This will add some noise and distortion, in addition to the potential for ground loop and RFI noise.The mic pre is not necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members The Real MC Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 This is a live multitrack recording - direct outs of GL-2200 straight to Alesis HD24, post-mixed after the showOne Way Out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 This is how I would approach it. Originally Posted by The Real MC This is a live multitrack recording - direct outs of GL-2200 straight to Alesis HD24, post-mixed after the showOne Way Out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted November 7, 2012 Members Share Posted November 7, 2012 Originally Posted by agedhorse What I mean is that the HDR is a line level input device and the output of the inserts (or direct outs) is also line level. Adding a mic preamp between the line level signal path requires that the signal be padded down (or the gain really degenerated) and then reamplified. This will add some noise and distortion, in addition to the potential for ground loop and RFI noise.The mic pre is not necessary. Okay we have miss understanding because I wasn't referring a micpre "in between" the mixer's direct out path that definitely would reamplify the signal.My Octane bypasses my Topaz's direct out signal path and just use the HD24XR output routed to the Topaz for monitoring, but I do understand what your saying about you don't wanna reamplify the signal from direct outs with a another micpre in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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