Members missSHREDerina Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 Hi guys! I was interested to see how many of you guitarists here on at the forum are alternate pickers and who are economy, if any. I was always taught to use alternate picking but lately i have found that i'm slipping more into economy picking. This has lead me to re-evaluate my playing to see which style i prefer; as personal preference is key here. Alternate picking is said to be best for your technique but i've found when it's come to scales, arpeggios,3- note per string patterns etc. economy picking is very efficient and not necessarily bad. However, i was curious to know which you all prefer. Also, I was wondering if it would be a good idea for me to practice alternate picking more, so that it will benefit me later and help to perfect my technique. I know many great players who prefer economy picking, so i figure it can't be too much of a disadvantage for me in the long run; and it will probably help me with my sweeping. any input as to which you prefer, advice or suggested exercises to perfect alternate picking would be GREATLY appreciated!! thanks all, Jess
Members typedeaF Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 Just search the forum. Hell this topic is only a few threads below and it only asked every damned week. Let me improvise. Pro-Economy: "I think its more natural to play this way. I have been playing 300 years and I can do anything an ap picker can do just as easily. AP advocates are nazi. Check out Frank Gambale." Pro-Alternate: "Alternate picking is the best way because its always alternating like AC or a piston. Once you get it down, its muscle memory. Economy picking is decent if you want to be a lame ass. Al DiMeola alternate picks everything." You: "Well I really want to learn both, but I just realized that I never knew what alternate picking was before. I hear so much about it, but it seems hard. What scales should I practice?" Pro-AP: "quote AP :thu:" Pro-Eco: "quote Eco :thu:" You: "What thickness pick should I use. I like my thin Fender picks." Fence-Straddler: "learn both!" Random Guy: "quote FS :thu:" Gennation: "check out my website..." Red|Dragon: "Metal Sucks!"
Members jazzbo Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 Steve Morse alternate picks Listen how fast and clean he is!! except for the places sweeping works better, like Vai or Satriani sweeping But if you can do it better your own way, do it! Edit: I should say that I tried to emulate Morse in my day and really I can't do it... he is a unique player... it discouraged me a little when I couldn't do it... but really he is an inspiration and one-of-a-kind... so don't try to kill yourself trying to do what he does... just be aware that he is one of the best exmples of alternate picking
Members Knottyhed Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 Originally posted by typedeaF Just search the forum. Hell this topic is only a few threads below and it only asked every damned week. Let me improvise. Pro-Economy: "I think its more natural to play this way. I have been playing 300 years and I can do anything an ap picker can do just as easily. AP advocates are nazi. Check out Frank Gambale." Pro-Alternate: "Alternate picking is the best way because its always alternating like AC or a piston. Once you get it down, its muscle memory. Economy picking is decent if you want to be a lame ass. Al DiMeola alternate picks everything." You: "Well I really want to learn both, but I just realized that I never knew what alternate picking was before. I hear so much about it, but it seems hard. What scales should I practice?" Pro-AP: "quote AP :thu:" Pro-Eco: "quote Eco :thu:" You: "What thickness pick should I use. I like my thin Fender picks." Fence-Straddler: "learn both!" Random Guy: "quote FS :thu:" Gennation: "check out my website..." Red|Dragon: "Metal Sucks!" LMAO Red|Dragon: "Use the major scale and play jazz"PRSnotPOS: "Stop being pussies, listen to my song"Kinetic: "Economy picking owns you, your technique sucks"TypeDeaf: "Don't do either, play legato - throw away your pick"Gennation: "Did I mention my website?"
Members Kinetic Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 Originally posted by Knottyhed LMAO You've got to admit that Harmony Central is unlikely to see another post with this level of accuracy for a long time
Members timgibson Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 It doesn't hurt to be adept at both techniques. You will find that each one gives you a different sound and it will make playing certain passages easier.
Members Kinetic Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 Originally posted by timgibson You will find that each one gives you a different sound and it will make playing certain passages easier. Where's a 'banging your head against a wall' smilie when you need one?
Members missSHREDerina Posted March 15, 2006 Author Members Posted March 15, 2006 Originally posted by typedeaF Just search the forum. Hell this topic is only a few threads below and it only asked every damned week. Let me improvise.Pro-Economy: "I think its more natural to play this way. I have been playing 300 years and I can do anything an ap picker can do just as easily. AP advocates are nazi. Check out Frank Gambale."Pro-Alternate: "Alternate picking is the best way because its always alternating like AC or a piston. Once you get it down, its muscle memory. Economy picking is decent if you want to be a lame ass. Al DiMeola alternate picks everything."You: "Well I really want to learn both, but I just realized that I never knew what alternate picking was before. I hear so much about it, but it seems hard. What scales should I practice?"Pro-AP: "quote AP :thu:"Pro-Eco: "quote Eco :thu:"You: "What thickness pick should I use. I like my thin Fender picks."Fence-Straddler: "learn both!"Random Guy: "quote FS :thu:"Gennation: "check out my website..."Red|Dragon: "Metal Sucks!" it isnt so much that i wasnt aware of one or the other styles of picking. I've just noticed that i've become more natural at economy and i'd like to start off with the best technique i can now seeing as i havent been playing that long. However, after reading some of your posts i've come to the conclusion that neither picking style really has much of an advantage over the other. thanks timgibson for acutally answering the question in a polite manner instead of sounding like an idiot like the rest of you all. this was my first post so i dont think you can really bash me for not seeing any other threads on this topic. sorry. thanks for your help
Members bongfodder Posted March 15, 2006 Members Posted March 15, 2006 Well I can't think of anything you can't play with alternate picking.Try playing Disposable Heroes with economy. But if you find it useful and your tone doesn't go out the window by all means work on that too. It's not an either or question but a and also.
Members missSHREDerina Posted March 15, 2006 Author Members Posted March 15, 2006 alright. i'd work on that then. thanks.
Members JesseJackson Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 I used to economy pick, and now I alternate pick. I personally find Alternate picking far, far better altogether. That's just me though. Try both, and see what you find best yourself.
Members Kinetic Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 Originally posted by bongfodder Well I can't think of anything you can't play with alternate picking.Try playing Disposable Heroes with economy. Please....
Members Knottyhed Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 Originally posted by missSHREDerina it isnt so much that i wasnt aware of one or the other styles of picking. I've just noticed that i've become more natural at economy and i'd like to start off with the best technique i can now seeing as i havent been playing that long. However, after reading some of your posts i've come to the conclusion that neither picking style really has much of an advantage over the other. thanks timgibson for acutally answering the question in a polite manner instead of sounding like an idiot like the rest of you all. this was my first post so i dont think you can really bash me for not seeing any other threads on this topic. sorry.thanks for your help I think we all started taking the pi$$ cos there's been alot of threads on this that all seem to go the same way, and in this particular case there was a thread with almost the exact same title on the front page (which we'd all already posted in). Use whatever works, there's plenty of great players that use alternate, and plenty that use economy. Anyway, love to stay and chat, but i've got to go start a discussion about nitro vs. poly finishes on the EG forum
Members Kinetic Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 Originally posted by Knottyhed Anyway, love to stay and chat, but i've got to go start a discussion about nitro vs. poly finishes on the EG forum I've got a better idea: Why not start an alternate vs economy picking thread in the Lesson Loft, it'll really rile them up.
Members Knottyhed Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 Originally posted by Kinetic I've got a better idea: Why not start an alternate vs economy picking thread in the Lesson Loft, it'll really rile them up. What's really funny is this thread is going exactly the way TypeDeaf predicted. It's one of those pointless subjects that always crop and never go anywhere - much like:Gibson QCUSA vs Asian madeAny thread about Kurt CobainPoly vs NitroVintage vs ModernAny thread about 'shredding'
Members Kinetic Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 Originally posted by Knottyhed What's really funny is this thread is going exactly the way TypeDeaf predicted. It's one of those pointless subjects that always crop and never go anywhere - much like: Gibson QC USA vs Asian made Any thread about Kurt Cobain Poly vs Nitro Vintage vs Modern Any thread about 'shredding' Arguing tired old topics to a stalemate in a virtual setting will be the downfall of the western world... mark my words unbelievers.
Members Knottyhed Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 Originally posted by Kinetic Arguing tired old topics to a stalemate in a virtual setting will be the downfall of the western world... mark my words unbelievers. It sure means I do less work, which obviously has a knock on effect within the economy... so i guess i'm doing my bit for the revolution
Members RaVenCAD Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 I can play both, but I prefer economy picking. That's my kick to the deadhorse.
Members bongfodder Posted March 16, 2006 Members Posted March 16, 2006 I'm sure she,assuming gender,deeply regrets cluttering your nice clean room here with her silly questions.
Members ankalar Posted March 17, 2006 Members Posted March 17, 2006 Economy picking is better by definition. economy - n. - Efficient, sparing, or conservative use. Where sweeping is easier, an economy picker sweeps. Where alternate picking is easier, an economy picker alternate picks. Thus, everything is easier for an economy picker. The sound won't be the same, of course, but if you're an economy picker and you want the sound of alternate picking, you can alternate pick. Yay!
Members Kinetic Posted March 17, 2006 Members Posted March 17, 2006 Originally posted by ankalar Economy picking is better by definition. economy - n. - Efficient, sparing, or conservative use. Where sweeping is easier, an economy picker sweeps. Where alternate picking is easier, an economy picker alternate picks. Thus, everything is easier for an economy picker. The sound won't be the same, of course, but if you're an economy picker and you want the sound of alternate picking, you can alternate pick. Yay! Wrong on nearly all accounts... good one
Members Knottyhed Posted March 17, 2006 Members Posted March 17, 2006 Originally posted by ankalar Economy picking is better by definition.economy - n. - Efficient, sparing, or conservative use.Where sweeping is easier, an economy picker sweeps. Where alternate picking is easier, an economy picker alternate picks. Thus, everything is easier for an economy picker. The sound won't be the same, of course, but if you're an economy picker and you want the sound of alternate picking, you can alternate pick.Yay! Sweep picking and eco-picking are different concepts, there seems to be alot of confusion on that subject, but an strict alt-picker is as likely to use sweep-picking as a strict economy picker. Eco-picking doesn't sound any different to alt-picking and alot of the time there isn't any difference in the pattern a alt-picker would use to that a eco-picker would use. *Theoretically* economy picking allows you to cross strings faster on certain phrases - in reality there are alot of strict alt-pickers that would appear to disprove this. Mastering either technique will enable you to pick extremely quickly, so do whichever feels more natural.
Members ankalar Posted March 17, 2006 Members Posted March 17, 2006 Originally posted by Knottyhed Sweep picking and eco-picking are different concepts, there seems to be alot of confusion on that subjectSo in economy picking, crossing from one string to the next with two downstrokes isn't sweeping? I would consider that sweeping. I'm not saying it's a whole swept arpeggio deal, but it is definitely sweeping. Kinetic: Until you let me in on your little secret as to how it is all wrong, I will keep on thinking it is a "good one."
Members Knottyhed Posted March 17, 2006 Members Posted March 17, 2006 Originally posted by ankalar So in economy picking, crossing from one string to the next with two downstrokes isn't sweeping? I would consider that sweeping. I'm not saying it's a whole swept arpeggio deal, but it is definitely sweeping. It's a down stroke, rather than a sweep. A sweep is a continuous motion accross several strings. If was eco-picking picking this:----------5------5-7---I might pick it up/down/down. If i was sweeping i'd be playing it down/hammer-on/down... I'm using one continuous motion - hence it is a "sweep". If i was playing an arp using eco-picking i'd be picking each individual note with a down-stroke, if I did it in one continuous motion I'd be playing the arp using a sweep.It's only terminology, but to prevent confusion it's best to stick to what is generally accepted as the correct term
Members Knottyhed Posted March 17, 2006 Members Posted March 17, 2006 Originally posted by ankalar Kinetic: Until you let me in on your little secret as to how it is all wrong, I will keep on thinking it is a "good one." Aside from the difference between sweeping and eco-picking I outlined, I think Kinetic is pointing out that there isn't a discernable difference in sound, if i get time tonight I'll post an MP3 to prove it.
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