Reasons Why I Can't Develop Speed?

[RedBarchetta]

The facts:

 

Been playing for nearly 15 years.

Got moderately serious about 2 years ago.

Practice on average 3 times per week for usually no longer than 1 hour.

Present speed is up to 338 notes per minute (cleanly).

 

I have a metronome and sometimes I'll just sit there playing sixteenth notes to the metronome, feeling like a novice because I can't develop speed for my life. Now...here's the thing. I know that somewhere within me is the ability because I've played certain video games where I need to really whale on the buttons and I can really blaze. Now why can't I transfer that to the guitar? I really got kind of depressed when I was sitting in a Guitar Center next to this Jamaican dude who was SHREDDING his fretboard to pieces like you wouldn't believe.

 

I mean, in all honesty, how long do you have to practice to get fast? For someone who doesn't play music for a living, can you honestly expect to get fast? How often do you need to practice? What kinds of things must one practice?

[1001gear]

From a purely physical standpoint, the problem is resistance. In this case, tension.

It's pretty easy to play without tension, just do it. You'll probably lose all precision and flop around a lot. And that's my take on the speed problem. Most people would panic at this stage and stubbornly forge out 'good' chops. I think a better solution is to learn the motions required as slowly as you need to. Once you know where the pure motion lies, you simply speed THAT up.

[dparr]

Three hours a week is not a lot of practice time.

 

Great players put in many hours of practice every day.

 

 

 

You're on the right track using a metronome.

[Li Shenron]

Amount of practice obviously helps, but it's not the point... If you could practice 8 hours per day you will certainly improve more quickly than by practicing 1 hour every day, but even in the latter case you should improve and become able to play fast, it will just take a longer time. 2 years is not a long time with this amount of practice, as long as you do see improvements you shouldn't worry too much.

 

But if you do not see improvements, or if they are very minimal, maybe the problem is in your head. It happens to a lot of players, and they are always people who actually badly want to get fast. Impatience is an enemy, it's a bit like greed. Take some time to think about how you approach practicing: does it make you feel "greedy" for speeding up the metronome, do you have strong feelings of pride (not simply being satisfied) when you "nail" an exercise on the first try, do you often rush over the next exercise so that at the end of the practice you can proudly say you have "done" all the 100 things you have planned to?

 

These are just examples of small mistakes that all end up making practice less beneficial. If your mind is too busy thinking about achievements, numbers, scores and records, it is then not busy enough focusing on the actual path to get there. Rushing causes stress and tension, which are the main obstacle to improvement.

 

Getting faster at playing guitar doesn't mean "speeding up your fingers" at all: the physical speed is always the same, it is in your fingers since the start. Getting faster means to remove the obstacles which make your fingers run in the wrong place and at the wrong time. When you get better at some technique, or even at a specific exercise if you want, you get a feeling of "unlocking" which usually becomes visible in a very significant "metronome limit lifting" (possibly even doubling) during the same practice session.

 

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Consider taking one week of holidays (or if you cannot, at least a long weekend) all for yourself and your guitar, call it a "hermitage".

 

Get completely free of any other business and people for the whole duration. Buy your food in advance so that you don't have to go shopping.

 

Forget about practice schedules during your hermitage. Try to explore the basic physical feelings of playing the guitar: posture, hand position, holding the pick. Try to discover a deeper level of muscles relaxation. And try to understand if you can get your mind clear, if you can manage to not think about: passing time, number of exercises, metronome speed, goals and targets. (Some concrete suggestions: do not bring a watch with you, do not look at the time! When you use a metronome, do not look at the bpm on screen, just listen to the beat but do not read the actual speed).

 

Try your best to just focus on the "here and now" of what you're playing. Do not think about how much you've practiced so far, or how much you still want to practice before the end of the day.

 

When you take breaks, stay calm and don't do exciting things. Cook and eat, take a nap, do some stretching or yoga, lie down on the couch and put on some music to listen to, take a walk outside or ride the bike, read some comics. Don't read something difficult, don't turn on the TV or the PC until it's really the end of the day before going to bed (ok to read the news and your mail or watch/play something only when you've put away the guitar for the rest of the day).

 

Treat the hermitage as an experiment to clear your mind from excessive thinking, and therefore to improve your relaxation and awareness during practicing. On any normal day it's much more difficult when you only have 1 hour and you're surrounded with distractions and duties, to quickly switch to a relaxed/aware state. The hermitage helps you with discovering what it means, and then you have more chances to apply it on normal days as well. If it works out and brings you benefits, you may want to start the habit of having hermitage periods for example once every 6 months to renew your ability.

[Megatron_69]

 

The facts: Been playing for nearly 15 years. Got moderately serious about 2 years ago. Practice on average 3 times per week for usually no longer than 1 hour. Present speed is up to 338 notes per minute (cleanly). I have a metronome and sometimes I'll just sit there playing sixteenth notes to the metronome, feeling like a novice because I can't develop speed for my life. Now...here's the thing. I know that somewhere within me is the ability because I've played certain video games where I need to really whale on the buttons and I can really blaze. Now why can't I transfer that to the guitar? I really got kind of depressed when I was sitting in a Guitar Center next to this Jamaican dude who was SHREDDING his fretboard to pieces like you wouldn't believe. I mean, in all honesty, how long do you have to practice to get fast? For someone who doesn't play music for a living, can you honestly expect to get fast? How often do you need to practice? What kinds of things must one practice?

 

 

 

I think it's important to get your mechanics down for both hands or you can really be spinning your wheels. Tuck Andress has a really good picking tutorial on his website that is gold....read through it 2 or 3 times if necesary. ANd study classical left hand technique if you can for your left hand. I'm painting with very wide strokes here but this shoud get you in the right direction.

 

I'd also recommend double or triple the practice if possible.....even more.

[Virgman]

I will catch flack for my opinion but here it is.

 

I don't think anyone really knows how to surmount this problem.

 

Some people can play really fast. Some can't.

 

Some people can run fast. Some can't

 

Some can throw a baseball 95mph. Some can't.

 

Michael Angelo Batio says he was always fast. Even when he was a kid. I'll wager Paul Gilbert was always fast too.

 

What things do you do well? Perhaps you should develop these things further instead of spending your practice time on a questionably useful skill.

 

If anyone could become lightning fast, then all the fine guitarists out there would be. The fact is that they aren't all really superfast.

 

What does this tell you?

 

All the superfast guys say the same thing. Play slow. Bump the metronome up a little at a time, etc.

 

You tried it. Did it work for you? Who here has done it and gotten as fast as Paul Gilbert?

 

Does it work for everybody? If it only works for a few then it doesn't really work. You are just an anomaly.

 

Some people can sing and some can't sing for beans. All the singing lessons in the world will not make you a great singer if you haven't got the pipes to begin with.

 

On the other hand you may be an excellent chord player, rhythm guitarist, blues soloist, etc.

[Jasco]

My opinion to the original poster is this:

 

You just need to increase your training time. Try two or three hours per day.

 

 

Also, I wouldn't recommend trying to use that time to increase speed, but rather use it to learn to play well. The speed you attain will be a nice by-product, and it will be usable in a musical way.

[jonfinn]

How important is playing fast to you? Why?

 

How will you know when you've achieved the goals you've set?

 

What will you do with the ability once you develop it?

 

How will you develop it?

 

How much time will you devote each day?

 

I'm remembering a quote by Henry Ford: "Whether you say you can or cannot, either way you'll be right."

[Li Shenron]

 

I will catch flack for my opinion but here it is. I don't think anyone really knows how to surmount this problem. Some people can play really fast. Some can't. Some people can run fast. Some can't Some can throw a baseball 95mph. Some can't. Michael Angelo Batio says he was always fast. Even when he was a kid. I'll wager Paul Gilbert was always fast too. What things do you do well? Perhaps you should develop these things further instead of spending your practice time on a questionably useful skill. If anyone could become lightning fast, then all the fine guitarists out there would be. The fact is that they aren't all really superfast. What does this tell you? All the superfast guys say the same thing. Play slow. Bump the metronome up a little at a time, etc. You tried it. Did it work for you? Who here has done it and gotten as fast as Paul Gilbert? Does it work for everybody? If it only works for a few then it doesn't really work. You are just an anomaly. Some people can sing and some can't sing for beans. All the singing lessons in the world will not make you a great singer if you haven't got the pipes to begin with. On the other hand you may be an excellent chord player, rhythm guitarist, blues soloist, etc.

 

 

It's possible, but I would not be that pessimistic... Basically you're almost saying that either you have talent or you don't, but still those who have it, had to work their ass off to get where they are. I still believe that most people who don't get there, is just because they don't work properly about it. Maybe they don't even want to get there really, but don't realize it.

[Virgman]

 

It's possible, but I would not be that pessimistic... Basically you're almost saying that either you have talent or you don't, but still those who have it, had to work their ass off to get where they are. I still believe that most people who don't get there, is just because they don't work properly about it. Maybe they don't even want to get there really, but don't realize it.

 

 

Well, it's never black or white. Everybody has talent in different areas and some people have a talent for speed.

 

I think people get unrealistic expectations about things.

 

Unrealistic goals are not good either.

 

Even someone with natural talent has to work at it to be great.

[jeremy_green]

There are so many factors involved here that without seeing you play it is impossible to really know but I will try.

 

You say you have been playing for 15 years ... what does that mean? You first tried it 15 years ago and barely played? Really when you started has little to do with your progress - it is quality practice time that matters.

 

From what i read in your post you "got moderately serious 2 years ago"... Speed is an element of people who play "seriously". It sounds like you have really been playing 2 years at a very moderate intensity.

 

That really isnt much.

 

If I had to put numbers on things I would say you need minimum one hour per day seven days a week and some years at that pace to really start ripping.

 

I agree with Virgman to a degree he is correct but that doesnt mean your situation is that. Unless you practice seriously you may never know your potential RPM.

 

Technique (as discussed quite accurately above) is another huge factor. I find people who have "been playing for 15 years" can develop bad habits (tension, bad hand positioning, poor state of mind cause they arent where they feel they deserve to be playing wise)

 

You need to look at all these factors and likely get a good teacher to check you out.

 

My 2 cents

[Li Shenron]

 

Well, it's never black or white. Everybody has talent in different areas and some people have a talent for speed. I think people get unrealistic expectations about things. Unrealistic goals are not good either. Even someone with natural talent has to work at it to be great.

 

 

Yes and yes...

 

What I think is that actually a lot of guitarists who "made it" and became professional in technical bands (e.g. heavy metal) did not actually have much natural talent for the instrument, but managed to compensate with a huge amount of training.

 

And a lot of guitarists who never make it to shread, are just people who don't have time. Presumably how much time is needed depends on that degree of natural talent, yes.

 

However, the talent needed for music is elusive... It's certainly not in the hands or the body (think the late Michel Petrucciani). Perhaps for singing it is, but not so much with instruments. It's just so damn hard to define what this "talent" really is when it comes to do something which isn't based on physical prowess or measurable with the IQ!

 

Anyway, someone once said that "talent" is simply the skill - or more properly the LUCK - of figuring out by yourself what is the right thing to do. But if that's the truth, not having talent is not a blocking problem. You just need to find out the right thing in another way: either you try and try (i.e. with time and dedication), or you meet a great teacher that understands what you're missing and tells it to you right away.

 

My 2c

[Virgman]

To me it's a bit like golfing or bowling.

 

When you look at a pro bowler or pro golfer you can't really say they look like "athletes".

 

Especially bowlers.

 

But they have a talent and can do things an ordinary person cannot do (except rarely).

 

I guess it's a high level of coordination combined with mental powers.

 

Nobody is born a great bowler or golfer but some people definitely have a knack for it.

 

You can have two pro golfers and one guy hits it 30 yards farther than the other guy. Both guys can score equally well though. Maybe the other guy putts better.

 

Anyway. All you can do is practice your butt off and see what happens.

[Jasco]

I'm not a big believer in innate talent. I'll grant you that there are some differences between people with regards to natural ability in music, but for the most part it comes down to desire, in my opinion.

 

If you desire the skills enough, you'll find a way to get them. Which ends up meaning putting a lot of focused hours in.

 

Some people come from musical environments, which means they get skilled at a young age and appear to have 'natural' talent, compared to those who don't.

 

But all-in-all I'm of the opinion that natural born talent accounts for about 3% and effort for the other 97%.

[Virgman]

 

I'm not a big believer in innate talent. I'll grant you that there are some differences between people with regards to natural ability in music, but for the most part it comes down to desire, in my opinion. If you desire the skills enough, you'll find a way to get them. Which ends up meaning putting a lot of focused hours in. Some people come from musical environments, which means they get skilled at a young age and appear to have 'natural' talent, compared to those who don't. But all-in-all I'm of the opinion that natural born talent accounts for about 3% and effort for the other 97%.

 

 

I hear you but in this case we are talking something specifically physical.

 

Notes per second. Speed. Finger speed. Coordination.

 

Not really music. Not melody, harmony, etc. Could be but not necessary.

 

People don't like to accept that there might be limitations to what they can do. Everybody has limitations.

 

Except Barry Bonds on steroids.

[jeremy_green]

I hear you but in this case we are talking something specifically physical. Notes per second. Speed. Finger speed. Coordination. Not really music. Not melody, harmony, etc. Could be but not necessary. People don't like to accept that there might be limitations to what they can do. Everybody has limitations. Except Barry Bonds on steroids.

 

Short story: When I was a kid I was the fastest runner in my grade - me and my best friend Stevie. We ran neck and all day long. We loved it it was a source of pride to the two of us so we did it equally - and lots! One day Stevie just started pulling away. OUCH! Hard for me to admit - I was fast - but he was faster. Now i was the "second fastest guy". Eventually i learned to work with that and ended up a lot better at a lot of athletic areas than him.

 

He was faster than me - but I always got picked before him for sports when we were dividing teams.

 

Taught me an important lesson - raw speed isnt everything and we are not all equal ... unless you play guitar then raw speed can cover up what is typically a very limited musical palette. Shredding isnt necessarily music. It can ... be but often isnt.

 

Like a fast car that cant corner (see Cobra) :)

[Virgman]

That's a really good analogy, Jeremy.

 

If you slow shred down (some shred) you find the notes don't fit quite often. The reason they sort of fit when played so fast is I suppose because the tones are all blended.

 

Our brain kind of knows it's not quite right but is confused perhaps..

 

I don't want to get down on shred because it can be good. But some people play unmusical note sequences very fast that don't really go with the underlying chords.

 

They memorize a specific lick and play it over everything really fast. It works to a degree.

[Li Shenron]

I hear you but in this case we are talking something specifically physical. Notes per second. Speed. Finger speed. Coordination. Not really music. Not melody, harmony, etc. Could be but not necessary. People don't like to accept that there might be limitations to what they can do. Everybody has limitations. Except Barry Bonds on steroids.

 

Uhm... I have an adecdote as well.

 

A girl of the neighbourhood, family friends. Her aunt was a pianist and teached her to play piano at a tender age. She was doing well, very skilled although it was hard to say from the outside if she had a talent or if she practiced a lot of hours per day. She was planning to get into conservatory somewhere in her early teen.

 

Her best friend also practiced piano but didn't seem nearly as good, at least technically. She tried also to get into conservatory on the same year.

 

Conservatory teachers ran the entry test, which not only included playing piano of course, but also singing. The first girl sucked at singing, she was out of tune. The second girl sang in tune. Conservatory admitted the second girl but not the first...

 

It still feels to me like speed, technique and physical skills can always be achieved, talented people will get them with less practice and faster, and maybe they'll go over the top of the others. But anyone can get them. There is no evidence that even Steve Vai has a natural talent for technique, since we know he used to practice an insane amount of hours. He just loved practicing... I would be much more worried if I wasn't able to sing in tune. It can be learned as well, but those teachers knew that it was much more difficult without a basic talent.

[Virgman]

Good story. Or a sad story. The first girl must have been crushed.

 

 

You brought up Steve Vai.

 

I was thinking maybe the ability to practice an insane amount of hours like Steve Vai or Al DiMeola might be a God-given talent. An amazing ability to focus for long periods.

[jonPhillips]

 

How important is playing fast to you? Why? How will you know when you've achieved the goals you've set? What will you do with the ability once you develop it? How will you develop it? How much time will you devote each day?

 

 

Please can we make this oft-quoted advice a sticky and have it be required reading before anyone posts any question asking how to play fast. It'd save us all a lot of time going round the circle again and again and again...

[dsimon665]

I think one thing is being able to subdivide the beat. The slower you go, the more you have to work at this. When you go fast, you just try to shove the notes in there.

 

If you play around with subdividing the beat I think this is one conclusion.

 

Work on "rhythmic scales"...subdivide the beat by 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12.

 

In order to do this, you have to play very slow...like 30-40 bpm.

 

Some of those are harder than others...like 5,7,9,11.

 

Others have more common names like 4=16ths, 2=8ths etc.

 

Take 8 for example...32nd notes. 32nd notes at 40bpm is equivalent to 16ths at 80bpm. Not too bad.

 

Go to 12...it adds 50% more notes from 8. "equivalent BPM" goes up.

 

 

 

 

But I think the fast guys have a sense of how to subdivide the beat. Each note counts even if its fast.

 

Its one reason why sweeping is so hard slow. Making each note count. Well for sweeping also its hard to keep the EXACT same technique as when you play fast.

 

That's one thing that Batio talks about for alt picking - keeping the EXACT same technique no matter what speed you go.

 

I think another thing about playing slow...its kind of like QiGong or TaiChi. You learn all the points in between. Even fast these points are important. But if you only play fast you never notice the details.

 

Playing slow is really hard.

[jonfinn]

 

I'm not a big believer in innate talent. I'll grant you that there are some differences between people with regards to natural ability in music, but for the most part it comes down to desire, in my opinion. If you desire the skills enough, you'll find a way to get them. Which ends up meaning putting a lot of focused hours in. Some people come from musical environments, which means they get skilled at a young age and appear to have 'natural' talent, compared to those who don't. But all-in-all I'm of the opinion that natural born talent accounts for about 3% and effort for the other 97%.

 

 

My kids are both teenagers and learning to play. Both of their parents are musicians, so they've grown up in an environment where almost all of their adult role models have been musicians (for better/worse right? Hah!).

 

So when they watch me practice, they see me (and their mom) assemble things in minutes that used to take days. With experience, you get faster at certain tasks. Only time will do that for you. That's both good and bad because they get frustrated when they can't do it. They see it's possible, but they also realize they're not there yet. But that makes them question their own innate abilities.

 

As a parent, any words I give about work ethic tend to fall on deaf ears. After all, they're kids. They're supposed to question everything their parents tell them.

 

One of my closest friends is one of the most naturally gifted musicians I've ever known. He works as a prison security guard because his personality doesn't suit the quiet, isolated patience required to become a pro. He's perfectly happy with that decision actually.

 

My point: I fully agree with the idea that "innate ability" accounts for a small percentage of the overall picture.

[Megatron_69]

FWIW, I do believe if anyone wants to get 'fast' they can do it. If their willing to put in the time, perfect the mechanics in both hands.......anyone can play fast. Look at youtube. It's full of players that can play 3 nps and triad apreggios at hyper speeds....is it very musical?...

 

I really believe anyone could do that. I could design a computer program to blindly run diatonic scales in one key(prolly E minor, lol) forwards and backwards in the most serial fashion with triad arps thrown in for flavor, and it would sound just like a great deal of the shredding i hear. A lot of those people's ears have not developed as fast as there fingers though. If you mentioned it they probably give you a 'deer in the headlight look'.

 

 

You have to watch the whole speed mentality.....it will really zap your energy and creativity.

 

In my classical studies I can put my self in a 'speed trap'. I'll get tunnel vision and end up frustrated and stop picking up my classical for awhile. that thingking always works against me. Instead of just trying to make great music and enjoy it. Striving to be musical and looking forward to each new piece. .....On a side note I need to start practiceing what I preach.

[Jasco]

 

I hear you but in this case we are talking something specifically physical. Notes per second. Speed. Finger speed. Coordination. Not really music. Not melody, harmony, etc. Could be but not necessary. People don't like to accept that there might be limitations to what they can do. Everybody has limitations. Except Barry Bonds on steroids.

 

 

 

True that there might be slight physical differences in peoples potential top speed. But most folks never reach their potential due to lack of effort. That is, it's not their innate talent level stopping them from attaining the high speed they think they want.

[dsimon665]

 

True that there might be slight physical differences in peoples potential top speed. But most folks never reach their potential due to lack of effort. That is, it's not their innate talent level stopping them from attaining the high speed they think they want.

 

 

It is surprising at how much work it really is.

 

One thing that helps me is being honest with myself.

 

"being honest" means not playing faster than my abilities. Am I really playing clean and/or am I just trying to impress myself?

 

Those slow down transcribing softwares are great for that.