Members Mcfontio Posted April 20, 2011 Members Share Posted April 20, 2011 I've found myself in a position to use midi guitar amongst my rig. I don't have any set ideas in how to get the midi from the guitar/audio but, I was looking to pick up one of those motif racks and go from there (unless there's a clear alternative). Of course, I'll have a plan before hardware is purchased. Or maybe a roland GR55? for clarity I'll describe my rig. Guitar > wahs > volume pedal > preamp > power amp midi controller > preamp > effects loop (racked) With the motif rack, I'd just use the midi controller to switch patches with one push of a button (I assume it has that capability???) *edit :S I see that sort of control is not an option... and this is a "live" unit???* and DI the outputs into the snake. So, I would have the guitar sounds independent of the mid sounds. So, not it looks like the GR 55 would be the better choice.. Question 1 (not using midi pickup): does anyone make hardware that could take the guitar line signal and convert it to midi? Could I split the guitar signal with a pedal box then send two cables to the rack - one signal going from guitar right to midi converter > motif and the other going through the wahs > volume pedal > preamp. With this set up, I wonder about tone loss in guitar. Question 2 (using midi pickup): So, I would have a midi cable and a 1/4" cable going from the guitar to the pedal board. Are there products out there that's really just a box for midi, in and out? You know, something to sit on my pedal board so I wouldn't need a midi cable going from guitar all the way to the rack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Karma1 Posted April 20, 2011 Members Share Posted April 20, 2011 I can't address all your questions, but there is a guitar to midi converter box called the Sonnus G2M. They also make an upgraded model that Craig Anderton wrote a review of recently. They only sell for around $100, but one issue is that it is monophonic (1 note at a time) which is fine for leads but you can't play chords with it. I have one and it's cool, but is a limited solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted April 21, 2011 Author Members Share Posted April 21, 2011 Hey thanks. There was a lot of mumbo jumbo up there and you answered the question that actually needed an answer. I got all excited when writing that... So, thank you. It's likely I'm going to get a GR 33 I think (with a GK3). It seems to best fit what I have going now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members germanicus2112 Posted April 22, 2011 Members Share Posted April 22, 2011 If you want to drive external synths i recommend NOT getting the gr33. I had one, and while it tracked very well with its internal sounds, it was not as solid as other options when driving external synths. The gr55 is a much nicer unit in many areas. More feautures, better synth engine, better tracking performance, and better driving of external synths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted April 22, 2011 Members Share Posted April 22, 2011 If you are wanting to drive an external synth get a used axon ax 100 mark II. Best tracking available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted April 22, 2011 Author Members Share Posted April 22, 2011 I was just looking through the tone list for the GR 55.... wow. It would be nicer to just use the floor unit and not need to drive an external synth. I found a couple of you tube vids on the GR 33 showing all it's patches. I wasn't that impressed. Have any of you found samples of all the tones off the GR 55? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Karma1 Posted April 22, 2011 Members Share Posted April 22, 2011 I have a GR33 and with a bit of tweaking I've come up with some awesome sounds, however as mentioned, its not great for driving an external synth via midi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members germanicus2112 Posted April 23, 2011 Members Share Posted April 23, 2011 I was just looking through the tone list for the GR 55.... wow. It would be nicer to just use the floor unit and not need to drive an external synth. I found a couple of you tube vids on the GR 33 showing all it's patches. I wasn't that impressed. Have any of you found samples of all the tones off the GR 55? The tones in the gr55 are a marked improvement over the gr33. I had both for awhile. Theres also alot more in the gr55. I dont think theres any sound in the gr33 that you couldnt get in the gr55 but the same is not true vice versa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted April 24, 2011 Members Share Posted April 24, 2011 Again, if you are looking for driving an EXTERNAL unit, the ax 100 is still the best. Although the GR 55 adds a bunch of features like being able to switch from a regular guitar sound to a MIDI guitar sound with a tap of the button...but those are on it's presets which I think sound great. Some of these people expecting it to be a VG 99 and a synth all rolled up into one for a price of $700.00 (Without GK3 pickup) are dreaming! They know good and well what a VG 99 cost by itself and it is NOT $700.00! More like $1,300.00! And THAT is just for the VG 99! http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Roland-VG99-VGuitar-Multi-Effects-Processor-System?sku=150241 The GR 55 is what it is! But I think it is a great deal considering all that has went into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted May 2, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 2, 2011 The ax 100 still ends with the 13 pin cable going from the guitar to the rack, which might as well be impossible. Plus a separate unit to drive, plus a way to control that... Which, are there even rack synths out there that have a midi inputs for sound driving and patch controlling? I was a little surprised that roland and yamaha's rack synths didn't have that capability and yet they were 'good for live use'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted May 2, 2011 Members Share Posted May 2, 2011 The ax 100 still ends with the 13 pin cable going from the guitar to the rack, which might as well be impossible. Plus a separate unit to drive, plus a way to control that... Which, are there even rack synths out there that have a midi inputs for sound driving and patch controlling? I was a little surprised that roland and yamaha's rack synths didn't have that capability and yet they were 'good for live use'. Well you might as well face the FACT that unless you are going to use a guitar like the guitar hero 3 which you cannot do string bends on, then you HAVE to go through a 13 pin CONVERTER BOX hooked up to a 13 pin MIDI pickup on a guitar. The best tracking box as I have said before is the axon ax 100 mark II. The best 13 pin tracking for a guitar pickup? That is debatable, but most agree that a classical guitar like the Godin ACS SA or Carvin 13 pin classical gives the best tracking hands down because of the way classical strings track. But RMC, Graphtech Ghost and GK3's on steel string guitars all do the job decently. But to be clear.....There IS NO true 5 pin MIDI pickup with built in converter for guitar! Which it seems is what you are asking for. Now...the guy that built the axon unit Adreas Szalay is now working on a wireless pickup that looks like a Roland GK3, but DOES have a 5 pin MIDI pickup. But they are not available yet. Here is some clips of what it looks like and him playing it on the roland Vforums. It looks like FISHMAN is going to be the company that produces them. You can scroll down to read about it. http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3444.0 I just wrote fishman yester day and asked if they had a timeline when this would be released or a price and they said they did get a lot of attention at a trade show they had it on, but did not know when it was going to be released. They just said to keep checking the fishman website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted May 3, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 3, 2011 I don't think I communicated effectively. I plan to use the 13 pin midi pickup on the guitar. I also plan on sending the normal guitar output to my rack amp. So I have two fully independent systems. The axon has the 13 pin input on the front of the rack, yes? Part of what I was saying is that I don't want a cable going from the guitar to the rack without going to the ground first (like my pedal board). And what I was talking about with 'controlling' was using a 5 pin midi controller to switch patches on an external synth if used with that axon (which they don't do) so I wouldn't have to stop playing to change patches. Does that make more sense? This is why the GR 55 is the clear choice. I can buy less equipment and it does/is everything I want for performance. Thanks for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted May 3, 2011 Members Share Posted May 3, 2011 I don't think I communicated effectively. I plan to use the 13 pin midi pickup on the guitar. I also plan on sending the normal guitar output to my rack amp. So I have two fully independent systems. The axon has the 13 pin input on the front of the rack, yes? Part of what I was saying is that I don't want a cable going from the guitar to the rack without going to the ground first (like my pedal board). And what I was talking about with 'controlling' was using a 5 pin midi controller to switch patches on an external synth if used with that axon (which they don't do) so I wouldn't have to stop playing to change patches. Does that make more sense? This is why the GR 55 is the clear choice. I can buy less equipment and it does/is everything I want for performance. Thanks for your help. I thought you were wanting a guitar with a 5 pin MIDI pickup and a controller built in it.(Of which currently there are none for pro use, that pickup I showed you is not out yet) My Mistake. I do not use my MIDI guitar for anything else other than MIDI or classical sounds. (It is a classical Godin ACS SA with 13 pin pickup) I use an Axe FX ultra for my regular guitar sounds and effects But that is what I want the GR 55 for.... so that I can have my regular guitar and MIDI sounds in one unit, but mine would be used when I went somewhere, as I already have a axon/motif XS rack combo that is excellent in sounds and tracking. Sorry for the confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted May 3, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 3, 2011 My experience of COSM modeling is meh. Would you really go from an Axe FX to a Boss modeler? :poke: I'll sell my triaxis/GSP to buy your Axe FX. Or trade? lol JK. I'm drooling at the idea of having the two systems completely independent, not to mention having legit guitar sounds, wahs, volume pedal etc. You know, if the motif could be controlled with my midi controller AND an extension box for the 13 pin GK signal to sit on the pedal board, I'd hands down go for that. *nudge nudge yahama* But then again, having the GR 55 options (three push buttons & expression) is really nice. Too bad the GR 55 doesn't have the ability to sync with a midi clock for the looper - something I think is absolutely necessary for band looping. GAS... {censored} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members econ Posted May 3, 2011 Members Share Posted May 3, 2011 For someone that has an AX Fx Ultra, what would be the best synth tracking box to pair it with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted May 4, 2011 Members Share Posted May 4, 2011 My experience of COSM modeling is meh. Would you really go from an Axe FX to a Boss modeler? :poke: I'll sell my triaxis/GSP to buy your Axe FX. Or trade? lol JK. I'm drooling at the idea of having the two systems completely independent, not to mention having legit guitar sounds, wahs, volume pedal etc. You know, if the motif could be controlled with my midi controller AND an extension box for the 13 pin GK signal to sit on the pedal board, I'd hands down go for that. *nudge nudge yahama* But then again, having the GR 55 options (three push buttons & expression) is really nice. Too bad the GR 55 doesn't have the ability to sync with a midi clock for the looper - something I think is absolutely necessary for band looping. GAS... {censored} I think you misread what I said. I would not give up my axe fx ultra NOR the axon ax 100 system. As I said before, this will be to take out somewhere as an all in one box. My MAIN system will have the aforementioned products in it. But for a box to take out and do lead or synth the GR 55 would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted May 4, 2011 Members Share Posted May 4, 2011 I already have it. It is called the axon ax 100 mark II controller. I have that going MIDI to a yamaha Motif XS rack....GREAT sounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted May 4, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 4, 2011 I figured you were one of those types with multiple systems. Do you just stop playing to switch patches on the motif? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted May 4, 2011 Members Share Posted May 4, 2011 I figured you were one of those types with multiple systems. Do you just stop playing to switch patches on the motif? No I only play the MIDI guitar when a song calls for it and then just play that guitar through the song. When it calls for a regular guitar I simply pick one up. I have four guitars onstage with me. Two are electric (a Fender 57 reissue strat and a PRS Private Stock Modern Eagle 1, one is an acoustic a Taylor 312 CE and one is my MIDI guitar a Godin ACS SA classical) I run the two electrics through an axe fx ultra with a mini mixer and use the MIDI setup (axon ax 100 mark II and motif XS rack) also through the mini mixer and the acoustic goes on its own channel to the board. I have it set up so that I only have to turn up the volume and tone knobs of the guitar I am using and play. When I am done I turn off the volume and tone knobs and pickup another guitar...rinse and repeat. Works great for various songs as I always have a guitar with a particular sound if I need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted May 4, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 4, 2011 Sounds cool. Twas thinking I'll have the expression on the 55 set to volume control and blend it in or serve it straight up with/and/or the audio guitar rig. I tend to switch tones up often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mygolfcart123 Posted May 5, 2011 Members Share Posted May 5, 2011 Sounds cool. Twas thinking I'll have the expression on the 55 set to volume control and blend it in or serve it straight up with/and/or the audio guitar rig. I tend to switch tones up often. I know that a lot of guitarists do not embrace new technology, but I think ALL of it, from vintage gear to the GR 55 is fantastic having so many tools at a musicians disposal. Enjoy your rig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted May 7, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 7, 2011 We are blessed indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mcfontio Posted May 9, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 9, 2011 So, I just gave yamaha a call to put a slip in their suggestion box about the ability to use a ground controller to switch patches on the motif. The guy tells me that I can apparently use a midi merger and send the two signals to the motif and it'll respond to both (the 13 pin GK conversion (5 pin) and the 5 pin signal from the ground controller)! kewl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thefyn Posted June 1, 2011 Members Share Posted June 1, 2011 Everything sucks. I'm so frustrated. Tried them all, one big laggy mess. The latest I tried is the Sonuus USB one. lol, what a piece of crap that is. Unusable for even the simplest of bass lines. So yeah, am going to try this, and pretty much learn to play the keys if it fails. http://audiomidi.com/You-Rock-Guitar-P15932.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aliensporebomb Posted June 2, 2011 Members Share Posted June 2, 2011 As far as guitar-to-midi goes - I use a Roland VG-99. Here I'm using its pitch-to-midi function to play bass live with the rhythm guitar and the HRM solo came later. See:http://pod.ath.cx/vg99/tunes/asb-Giganticus_Rex.mp3 But here's a tune I did playing live electric guitar, along with VG-99 hexaphonic guitar, then using the guitar-to-midi out to external softsynths in one pass: ECgcBVfv654 That worked really well and was live to two track. That one is on my most recent cd, "this is aliensporebomb". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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