Jump to content

So, which one do you think is REALLY analog?


BmoreTele

Recommended Posts

  • Members
  • Members

I cannot see why a designer would limit the max delay time to only 440 msec if the delay is truly digital. Makes no sense to me. An all-analog Deluxe Memory Man can give you more delay time than that.

For a true analog sound delay with a digital core, with all the performance quality and features you would expect from a hybrid of both technologies, check out the Pigtronix Echolution.

Guitar pedal design engineering, repairs, and custom mods:
http://howard.davis2.home.att.net/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

It's probably because they can make a cheap ass PT80 digital delay with 400 - 500 ms of delay and then rip off the unsuspecting consumer (sucker) and move on.

 

I'm just surprised with the boldness of the lie.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually, I'm not really surprised. I just sound like I'm surprised. I have that 80's vintage tone of surprise. It's a very real surprised-like feeling. It fools people into thinking I'm really actually authentically surprised.

 

:eek:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
Actually, I'm not really surprised. I just sound like I'm surprised. I have that 80's vintage tone of surprise. It's a very real surprised-like feeling. It fools people into thinking I'm really actually authentically surprised.


:eek:



Which is really just a clone of my vintage faux surprise that there were as many Police Academy sequels as there were. :confused:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
The SE-ADL Analog Delay with the "feeling of analog delay"


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230168073251&ssPageName=ADME:B:WNA:US:73&isfrommerc=1&refitem=150156631148&itemcount=8&refwidgetloc=watch_reminder_email&refwidgettype=osi_widget&refitem=150156631148&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=watch_reminder_email&refwidgettype=osi_widget&isfrommerc=1


OR the the ADL-2 Analog Delay with the "very analog delay echo effect"


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230169184490&ssPageName=ADME:B:WNA:US:74&isfrommerc=1&refitem=150156631148&itemcount=8&refwidgetloc=watch_reminder_email&refwidgettype=osi_widget&refitem=150156631148&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=watch_reminder_email&refwidgettype=osi_widget&isfrommerc=1


both with max 440 ms delay time!!!!


OR


neither one.


:wave:



its Korean made. I played the first one. Its digital, it feeds back. Some guy took it apart in JP and said what kind of chip it was. Korea did make alot of analog delays but that was in the 80s. Ive had a few, theyre..well..analog delays. but these are digital..

artec has a vibe/trem thats ok, as well., but not great.

they just put out these small black pedals. i posted about the tuner before..
http://www.schoolmusic.co.kr/Shop/index.php3?var=GoodList&middle_name=ARTEC&large_name=%B1%E2%C5%B8%C0%CC%C6%E5%C5%CD&large_number=22&middle_number=534

anyway, go with boss...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 8 months later...
  • Members

 

its Korean made. I played the first one. Its digital, it feeds back. Some guy took it apart in JP and said what kind of chip it was. Korea did make alot of analog delays but that was in the 80s. Ive had a few, theyre..well..analog delays. but these are digital..


 

 

Actually, I have to call BS here. I don't know who that guy that took it apart is or how much does he know about electronics but I just got one and opened it up and here's what I found.

 

There are two chips on it, and only one has 8 pins (per side) like the PT2399 digital delay chip that is supposed to be used in the artec pedal. The outside is different than what on the PT2399 datasheet though. In the datasheet for it it shows this is a TTL chip (5 Volt supply + or - 0.25V). Well, the 8 pin chip in the artec pedal is getting 9 V in pin 1,8,9 and 16, which would either fry or cause a malfunction in the PT2399 chip. So either they stopped using this chip or the guy that claimed this is wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
Actually, I have to call BS here. I don't know who that guy that took it apart is or how much does he know about electronics but I just got one and opened it up and here's what I found.


There are two chips on it, and only one has 8 pins like the PT2399 digital delay chip that is supposed to be used in the artec pedal. The outside is different than what on the PT2399 datasheet though. In the datasheet for it it shows this is a TTL chip (5 Volt supply + or - 0.25V). Well, the 8 pin chip in the artec pedal is getting 9 V in pin 1,8,9 and 16, which would either fry or cause a malfunction in the PT2399 chip. So either they stopped using this chip or the guy that claimed this is wrong.



I'm confused. How can an 8-pin chip have pins numbered 9 and 16? :confused:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

m'kay.

Just had a quick look at the PT2399 datasheet. It's CMOS rather than TTL, but it does require a supply voltage between 4.5V and 5.5V, which is comparable to military TTL chips. Also, from the typical application circuits, it doesn't look like it would do anything useful if all of the corner pins were tied to the positive supply line.

I'm guessing there's a different chip in that pedal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

Hmm. And there's no identification marks or numbers on the chip? Are there any other chips in the pedal (especially 8-pin ones connected to the above mentioned chip)?

 

 

There is an identification on it. It's something like ANXXX. I can't remember and I already closed the pedal. You can look it up anyway in the Artec product page, they have pics of their analogue delay chips there.

 

There are no more 8 pin chips there, unless they are on the opposite side of the board, which I couldn't see entirely, but all I could see there were caps and the pots.

 

Unless some one can prove to me that this chip has an AD and DA converter on it, I assume Artec are speaking the truth and this is an analogue delay pedal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Hmm. Just had a look at those chips.


ics.gif

The text above says "ARTEC Custom Analog Delay Chipset".


If the text is accurate, then they are analog delay chips, and they are being custom made for Artec.

 

Yeah, that's the one on the pedal. If it is analogue then the pedal is a great deal for 50 euros...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Nuno - which of the two models mentioned in the OP is it you have (the SE-ADL or the ADL-2)? I did a quick google search, and the PT2399 does frequently come up in relation to the SE-ADL (the one Seifukusha mentioned having played through). I also remember checking both of these out on the Artec site, but don't remember any mention of their custom chips. One theory could be that they started out with one chip (probably the PT2399), and at a later date decided to commission their own chips.

 

/Andreas

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
Nuno - which of the two models mentioned in the OP is it you have (the SE-ADL or the ADL-2)? I did a quick google search, and the PT2399 does frequently come up in relation to the SE-ADL (the one Seifukusha mentioned having played through). I also remember checking both of these out on the Artec site, but don't remember any mention of their custom chips. One theory could be that they started out with one chip (probably the PT2399), and at a later date decided to commission their own chips.


/Andreas



Andreas, I have the SE-ADL. Maybe that's what happened, I don't know. I actually read this whole PT2399 thing after I ordered it so then I also ordered a DMM. I want this to use with a mixing desk so I can do dub delay feedback loops because I have not yet found a digital delay that sounds good.

Anyway, this pedal does sound nice. It's only a simple delay pedal, no modulation or anything. It only goes to 50/50 Dry/Wet mix though :(

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

 

The most popular and easiest "first" delay for any boutique/hobbyist builder and/or peopel who want to make a batch of 5-10 delays for experience/a quick buck is a PT2399 based digital delay. the chip is limited to only 300ms (400+) is you push it). not all digital circuits can produce long delays, especially if youre going for simplicity or affordability.

 

I'd say both are digital, but does it matter if they sound good?

 

the main indication to me is when they say "analog sounding" or analog-like". usually if a delay is analog, they liek to make a huge point of it being so.

 

EDIT: whooops shoulda read the rest of the thread

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
EDIT: whooops shoulda read the rest of the thread

This almost craves a :cop:

There's no word on the chips themselves - as they are custom-ordered for Artec, they could be anything from proper BBD chips (with or without internal clock drivers) to simple digital delay circuits labeled "analog". But be that as it may - you said it yourself:

I'd say both are digital, but
does it matter if they sound good?

IMO, the key to a good echo sound is using a compander/expander, the right filtering and keeping the echo signal (and feedback) analog - wether the actual delay circuit is BBD or digital matters less, if you've got the other bits right. So, if the Artec units sounds good, that's good enough for me :D

/Andreas

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...