Jump to content

The use of Equipment, putting the BS myths to rest


Zachman

Recommended Posts

  • Members

The setup I am using is a Custom Audio Electronics Custom switcher, specifically designed to route everything with care and forethought to where I need it to go, some stuff in front of the amps, some stuff into the wet side of the system, some stuff in series, some stuff in parallel routed through a CAE unity gain Line mixer, ALL of the considerations that you mention have been accounted for.
;)

 

yup! for YOUR requirements spec ;)

 

You addressed that other users can have different requirements or that "most efficient tranfer" isn't always the best option in an integrated system??

(For instance, in the boilerplate, for instance, the fuzz-face loading problem was addressed a couple of ways...Experient, and "put it up front", which doesn't address some use models -- where someone wants a fuzzface after another processor...there is another option within a buffered system...loading network -- now my point there was that you don't have the most efficient transfer there)

 

See that's the deal, and it's VERY common among us engineers - to see our system design and use model as definitely "best"

 

 

 

 

Like building a spread sheet, the design and setup is the pain in the ass part, but once it's done, it's smooth sailing.

 

that can come back to the "playing v programming part" - some users may simply not want to go to the "pain in the ass" part

 

RE: the UI, it performs EXACTLY as one would expect it to, and as it was designed to, MAGNIFICENTLY. ;)

 

;) that can be the problem with us engineers - we think it performs exactly as "one" would expect it to because it works exactly like "I" expect it to

 

You clearly don't have a working understanding of what my rig is and how it's setup

 

my comment was on your "I push a button an go" comment - that's your use model

 

 

or you wouldn't be questioning things like this, as they are clearly an indication that your experience w/ signal routing in a guitar system, utilizing the gear that I am, is limited.

 

There really are NO weak spots in this setup, and the routing is that of a MIDI programmable patch bay, that allow me to put whatever I want where ever I want it, whenever I want in real time. ;)

 

does it allow for cross-fade across multiple paralle paths?

 

that's one place where I find myself working away from switcching systems

 

(seriously, it may sound like some sort of "challenge" - I think you are interpreting my comments on engineering and design as a negative on your design. This is way common for engineers like us, so no worries.

but it's a real question in that I find myself thinking less and less in terms of "patches" with very little on/off routing and more in terms of amounts, mixes, crossfades...now yeah, i can be done is SW - but Im then kind of married to that system...even used to prog a soundart chameleon for that reason)

 

 

 

I know guys that are network engineers for CNN and are geniuses at what they do, but they don't know {censored} about guitar tone and routing a guitar systems signal to be done in the most effective and efficient way.

 

I wouldn't expect them to!

 

I think you might have completely missed what I was saying in that crack (you are an engineer, I thought you'd get the joke there - but I think what has happened is that the convo was so pre-loaded at the get-go that communication hasnt even had a chance to get off the ground as some of the folks have armor strapped on)

 

The guy who built my stuff is the guy who invented the technology. I think he has a good grasp on it, as he has seen and built more rigs than you and I will ever see, for the TOP guys in the WORLD. Literally... ;)

 

Was it, by chance, the guy that said "Experiment to see what works best for you." in that boilerplate?

 

 

I think you are misinterpreting my comments as attack or criticism about your system - it ain't the case

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 1.5k
  • Created
  • Last Reply
  • Members

Voodoo Labs GCX switcher is a good product, (I've wired them up in quite a few racks for people), Sound Sculpture's Switchblade, Custom Audio Electronics, Skrydstrup R&D, and Axess Electronics are GREAT choices to look into, as well, for rack mounted switchers like:


Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche, McLaren, Buggati are all nice choices when looking into exotic sports cars.


(ALL cool possible choices all with different features and options.)


There are pedal based switchers that are also available for guys who want to run their pedals on the floor, so they can tweak them etc... yet want to use MIDI to automate their multi-pedal switching to one button press.


;)

 

 

Zac, do those companies you mention make the bypass switching systems for pedal boards?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

Going by Industry Benchmark Standards: Any "major" studio that you go into will have one or more of these units, as a result.


NEVE, SSL, Trident, URIE, TC Electronic, Eventide, AMS, Lexicon, Pro Tools, Studer, Neumann microphones, etc...

 

 

 

um, that was a set-up for the joke dude

 

you know - Conan, what is best?

 

To crush your enemies

See them driven before you

and to hear the lamentation of the women

 

 

Noe on the "major studio" benchmark - again, that would apply to their use, but might not apply to play X's instrument rig

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

um, that was a set-up for the joke dude


you know - Conan, what is best?


To crush your enemies

See them driven before you

and to hear the lamentation of the women



Noe on the "major studio" benchmark - again, that would apply to their use, but might not apply to play X's instrument rig

 

my bad... flyby over head, cold meds kickin my ass. :lol:

 

Rigs boil down to ones willingness or not to compromise, in one area or another. The more one is willing to compromise, the bigger the rigs limitations tend to be, and vice versa. If one is not willing to compromise, w/ regards to sound processing quality, features, controllability, and flexibility, their rig will likely cost a fortune, and sound "better" assuming programming efficiency, and proper design and setup.

 

Gear in and of itself, DOES NOT guarantee good tone, just the potential for it. Operator error, IMO is the biggest challenge to someone getting good tone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

my bad... flyby over head, cold meds kickin my ass.
:lol:

 

no worries (seriously, I'm used to it and I think I walked into a preloaded convo)

 

[and hey, if you have any thoughts about HW crossfading systems....tell ya what, I'm supposed to watch harry potter with the wife now - Ill yak at ya later abt that stuff]

 

Operator error, IMO is the biggest challenge to someone getting good tone.

 

I hear ya - I don't suppose it matters WHAT the rig is there

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

The thing here, Zach, is you're still arguing the point of how great your system is. It doesn't matter that thousands of stars in the world use that configuration. Steve Vai isn't selling out arenas because of what's in his backline or on the floor in front of him, you know? I highly doubt that any of the big stars got big because they used a switching system or a pedalboard. All the points you're bringing up are useless in the topic at hand.

 

Nobody is arguing that a typical pedal rig is better than a rack setup anymore. The guys that throw that crap out there aren't worth wasting time on. I don't doubt at all that you probably have amazing tone. I think mine sounds pretty good, too. You may be able to cop my tones, and seeing as you have a lot more options in your rig than I do mine, I can't cop some of yours, but oh well. It doesn't matter. I don't need your tones and you don't need mine. For my style and tastes, my rig is about as good as it can be. For yours, it's (your rig) about as good as it can be.

 

You said yourself, "Gear doesn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Zac, do those companies you mention make the bypass switching systems for pedal boards?

 

Yes, CAE, Axess, and there are a few others. Axess is probably the most competitively prices and make the smallest setups I've seen.

 

Here are a couple of pics with some examples:

 

dickey_616_1.jpg

 

yabori_S05-1.jpg

 

yabori_S15.jpg

 

naoto01.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

my bad... flyby over head, cold meds kickin my ass.
:lol:

Rigs boil down to ones willingness or not to compromise, in one area or another. The more one is willing to compromise, the bigger the rigs limitations tend to be, and vice versa. If one is not willing to compromise, w/ regards to sound processing quality, features, controllability, and flexibility, their rig will likely cost a fortune, and sound "better" assuming programming efficiency, and proper design and setup.

 

 

The issue here, to me, is your idea of compromising. I'm not compromising a thing by not having a midi switching system and/or feature-laden rack processors. I'm getting the best out of my gear selections for me. I haven't compromised at all. I've found my personal best (well, just about. Still some missing pieces that the checking account hasn't allowed yet, but you get the point).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

The thing here, Zach, is you're still arguing the point of how great your system is. It doesn't matter that thousands of stars in the world use that configuration. Steve Vai isn't selling out arenas because of what's in his backline or on the floor in front of him, you know? I highly doubt that any of the big stars got big because they used a switching system or a pedalboard. All the points you're bringing up are useless in the topic at hand.

 

Nobody is arguing that a typical pedal rig is better than a rack setup anymore. The guys that throw that crap out there aren't worth wasting time on. I don't doubt at
all
that you probably have amazing tone. I think mine sounds pretty good, too. You
may
be able to cop my tones, and seeing as you have a lot more options in your rig than I do mine, I can't cop some of yours, but oh well. It doesn't matter. I don't need your tones and you don't need mine. For my style and tastes, my rig is about as good as it can be. For yours, it's (your rig) about as good as it can be.

 

You said yourself, "Gear doesn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

AMEN to that...
:thu:

Unfortunately it is the nature, when answering the questions that trolls put out, one does tend to look as though we are trying to justify something, as the questions are indeed designed to be on the offensive and place the person who they're posed to, on the defensive, while explaining and qualifying ones position.


The intent of the thread was to dispel some of the garbage that is put out there regarding running rack gear, be they processors or rack mounted pedals, that was all. I truly feel that guys should have options, and I also realize though, that the answers are only important, if one asks the right questions.


Since it seems clear to me that a lot of guys don't realize that running stuff this way was even an option, I figured I would let them know. Choosing not to, while informed is VERY different than choosing not to, because one doesn't even know they had the choice to consider.


;)

 

 

I agree completely. thhug.gif

 

Hey, are you still working with John (zepman)? I haven't talked to him in a while. How's he doing?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

The issue here, to me, is your idea of compromising. I'm not compromising a thing by not having a midi switching system and/or feature-laden rack processors. I'm getting the best out of my gear selections
for me
. I haven't compromised at all. I've found my personal best (well, just about. Still some missing pieces that the checking account hasn't allowed yet, but you get the point).

 

What I meant by that is related to someone who made the statement to me that a DD2, is just as good as a TC 2290. :rolleyes: SORRY... FALSE, if it's the answer for them because they can't afford to get a better performing device, then for them it is a delay that they can use, and be happy with, and get very nice results with. I use one regularly, and can say with total conviction, it is NOT as good as a TC 2290, but I get nice results with it.

 

Perspective is all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I agree completely.


Hey, are you still working with John (zepman)? I haven't talked to him in a while. How's he doing?

 

 

He has a MASSIVE sale going on w/ Duncan pickups, Core X2 cables and cable kits, and Snake Oil Strings, but then... John had a rough couple of days. He busted a rib falling off a chair, putting in a light bulb, then the next day on Christmas, his cousin was killed.

 

Send him some mojo, or better still send him an email and say hi. I'm sure he'd appreciate it.

 

www.zepman.net

 

Peace :thu:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

Exactly, much appreciated.

 

 

 

Cool,

 

Those products are Custom Audio Electronics Japan. Depending on how many loops you need, Axess may be a more affordable solution.

 

Contact Dave Phillips at LA Sound Design, and let him know that Zach Petersen referred you. The guy is a killer guitarist, and does AMAZING work building pedal boards and racks. REALLY COOL guy, and can consult w/ you on lots of different options.

 

http://www.lasounddesign.net/#home

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

What I meant by that is related to someone who made the statement to me that a DD2, is just as good as a TC 2290.
:rolleyes:
SORRY... FALSE, if it's the answer for them because they can't afford to get a better performing device, then for them it is a delay that they can use, and be happy with, and get very nice results with. I use one regularly, and can say with total conviction, it is NOT as good as a TC 2290, but I get nice results with it.


Perspective is all.

 

Oh, yeah, of course. It's kind of stupid to directly compare two very different delays like that, anyway. :bor:

 

The question that begs to be answered is, "What if said person has an unlimited amount of funds to purchase a delay. Will he go for the DD-2 or 2290?" No one can answer that question. The 2290 may be the best available on paper, but in the dude's hands is what really matters, regardless of price or functionality. I mean yeah, the 2290 is probably technically miles ahead of a DMM, but does it have that certain something that the DMM has in some people's hands? No clue. It might. Might not. Doesn't make one better than the other. :)

 

Oh well. As much as I love these conversations, I need my sleep. Take care, dude. :cool:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

He has a MASSIVE sale going on w/ Duncan pickups, Core X2 cables and cable kits, and Snake Oil Strings, but then... John had a rough couple of days. He busted a rib falling off a chair, putting in a light bulb, then the next day on Christmas, his cousin was killed.


Send him some mojo, or better still send him an email and say hi. I'm sure he'd appreciate it.


www.zepman.net


Peace
:thu:

 

Dang. Poor guy. It seems like for years now he's had too many terrible things happen to him.

 

I'll send him an email for sure. Thanks for the update.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

Dang. Poor guy. It seems like for years now he's had too many terrible things happen to him.


I'll send him an email for sure. Thanks for the update.

 

 

No doubt, his knee (fixed now), torn ACL (fixed now), his neck (fixed now), neurological weirdness (fixed now), but all still bug him from time to time.

 

I love the guy like a brother, and can't wait to see during NAMM. I still talk to him every few days though. He's my brutha from anutha mutha

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

No doubt, his knee (fixed now), torn ACL (fixed now), his neck (fixed now), neurological weirdness (fixed now), but all still bug him from time to time.


I love the guy like a brother, and can't wait to see during NAMM. I still talk to him every few days though. He's my brutha from anutha mutha

 

He's always been real cool to me. We used to talk a lot back in the HC Vets days (2001 or so). Dude loves his Marshalls. :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

A GCX switcher is only about $400, and another $200 and up of course for a MIDI controller. Guys spend more than that on 1 or 2 pedals. SO, the idea that it's uber expensive is nothing more than RED HERRING NONSENSE.


Don't get me wrong, it CAN be expensive, but that depends on the individual, like everything else, and how much compromise they are willing to or NOT willing to contend with.

 

 

or you can get a loop strip(5/6) for ~200.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


×
×
  • Create New...