Worship forum...

[Michael Blue]

You had a 4th wife named Fritz?

[Rudolf von Hagenwil]

You had a 4th wife named Fritz?

Fritz, my fourth stuffed cauliflower vegetable wife was a wonderful pal I dedicated several works to

Mein Freund Fritz.mp3
http://www.sendspace.com/file/vq85o3

.

[iamgodsvek]

i see your 4th wife named Fritz and raise you an ex girlfriend surnamed Beduchea (be-duche-a)

[skempe]

yeah I'm totally late on this, I haven't been on in awhile.
I'm the one that posted the thread back in July for just worship leaders or those who play in worship bands to just talk about it.
About that...completely sorry...didn't mean to offend anyone. I mean the moderator and another guy really took it over the edge. I mean dang guys I'm 16. I write on this during my free period at school. I'm a junior. Worship leading is just what my playing and writing has been coming to. It's more and more being what I'm called to do. I love talking about God to people and helping them with God and I love playing music and playing live and using intricate rigs and effects and working with them and modding them and making them better and better. So i get all of my favorite slices all put together. That's all I wanted to talk with people about on a popular forum. I mean come on which do you think gets looked at more, Harmony central or "worshipforum.com" or whatever. I mean whether you're methodist, presbyterian, non-denominational, baptist, jewish, buddhist, whatever, you still use music to worship your God. The one you believe in. And i mean if theres people of other religions on there, id love to learn about what they do. as far as me and other people i play with, its loud contemporary worship. Again sdorry if i offended anyone with that thread or anything. Just trying to figure out how that could get going. Which i did like that yall discussed that and this poll came up. thats cool guys thanks.
excuse my signature its from 8th grade by the way

[myredshoes]

I don't see the point. Music is Music, PA is PA, whether it's in a gin joint or holy roller joint. While I think I can appreciate the fact that the religious folks take a little heat here now and then, I think that a sub forum based on worship is just too specific. We'd end up needing a hip hop forum, metal forum etc. If people want to talk about a specific genre there are plenty of genre specific sites available for those discussions. Cheers. C.

x2

[OAFCORE]

Actually, yes, every time a remotely religious lyric has been posted since I've been here there has at the very least been the whole "the lyrics aren't my thing" "I'm obviously not your market" etc. comments, and usually something a lot less innocuous. Worship music is about WAY more that just musical ability, musical theory, etc.. The lyrics and meaning are what it's about, there's no separating the music from the meaning...Therefore you're wasting your time asking non-Christians whether it's effective or not, and generally you're just asking to get summarily destroyed by the membership here posting anything like that.

 

 

Now I've not been here long, but I haven't seen anyone put down for the original music that has been put up. I shared my bands work and I got the same response from B2B...."I'm obviously not your market"....But he also included his honest opinion about the material, WHICH IS WHY WE ARE HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE. I am strongly against anyone putting your music down because of lyrical content, and I don't evaluate people based on whether or not their lyrics agree with my own personal views. In fact, I'm more critical of the ones who DO share my views. IMO this is the type of place you SHOULD be wanting to post. A place where people of all genres/ideologies are going to be evaluating your music.

 

There are several major religions (ESPECIALLY Christianity) that have the idea of conversion so deeply rooted into their beliefs that they care more about spreading the word to others outside their religion then their own. This is a the PERFECT environment for that.....who knows, maybe someone will read your lyrics and listen to your song and be inspired to follow Jesus....isn't that what you want?!

[Michael Blue]

...There are several major religions (ESPECIALLY Christianity) that have the idea of conversion so deeply rooted into their beliefs that they care more about spreading the word to others outside their religion then their own. This is a the PERFECT environment for that.....who knows, maybe someone will read your lyrics and listen to your song and be inspired to follow Jesus....isn't that what you want?!

 

 

It is specifically forbidden by forum rules.

The rules themselves restrict what we can post, then the Christian-haters here destroy us for posting it anyways.

 

It is against forum policies to blatantly attack or demean another member, but for some reason, when that attack follows a post containing any sort of Judeo-Christian content, the attack is viewed as somehow being warranted or deserved, and no action is taken against those blatantly and specifically harassing the original poster.

 

Now, I understand there are many facets to Christianity (and Catholicism), and that some of those facets can be Newtonistic, but that does not include all denominations, nor all churches in any given denomination. I do not attempt to inspire piety with fear or guilt, and "you" (general "you") haven't been to "my" church, so the instant massive negative feedback incurred by my particular posts is completely unwarranted.

 

At any rate, it's beyond discussion now, it's been disavowed by the staff here, and a sub-forum won't happen. Christians in particular are doomed to being blasted when we post our lyrics, so I, for one, won't be posting much of my work here.

 

It's a shame; I have NO problem honestly critiquing someone else's work, no matter how explicit, without condemnation...It would be nice if the staff here could (or would) encourage the same of others.

 

This is a dead issue.

[DeveryHarper]

If it is dead then why do you keep bringing it up? You are so quick to point out what others are not giving you, or doing for you, as if you deserve something. Do you realize how you present yourself on a post to post basis? It is not that coveting.

 

Remember, the meek shall inherit the earth.

 

You come here with what you think is a brilliant idea. Many people reject that idea including the staff here and you condemn them for this? If it doesn't work it doesn't work. Here it does not work. So please stop beating this dead horse.

[dr5euss]

Perhaps this thread should be moved to the "Epic Fail!" forum

[OAFCORE]

It is specifically forbidden by forum rules. The rules themselves restrict what we can post, then the Christian-haters here destroy us for posting it anyways. It is against forum policies to blatantly attack or demean another member, but for some reason, when that attack follows a post containing any sort of Judeo-Christian content, the attack is viewed as somehow being warranted or deserved, and no action is taken against those blatantly and specifically harassing the original poster. Now, I understand there are many facets to Christianity (and Catholicism), and that some of those facets can be Newtonistic, but that does not include all denominations, nor all churches in any given denomination. I do not attempt to inspire piety with fear or guilt, and "you" (general "you") haven't been to "my" church, so the instant massive negative feedback incurred by my particular posts is completely unwarranted. At any rate, it's beyond discussion now, it's been disavowed by the staff here, and a sub-forum won't happen. Christians in particular are doomed to being blasted when we post our lyrics, so I, for one, won't be posting much of my work here. It's a shame; I have NO problem honestly critiquing someone else's work, no matter how explicit, without condemnation...It would be nice if the staff here could (or would) encourage the same of others. This is a dead issue.

 

 

In my short time on this forum I believe B2B to be a fair and just moderator. I would be very interested in evaluating your lyrics or song content in a fair and diplomatic fashion...and I can promise you that if you are berated for that posting I would gladly defend you and ask that B2B take the proper actions...

 

....but I don't think trolls are the only issue here...because they wouldn't go away if you had your own forum....

 

I mean, I hate God as much as the next guy, But I honestly would like to hear your material and tell you what I think from a SONGWRITERS standpoint.

 

It takes a musician and a songwriter to see how effective your lyrics are in conveying a feeling, not another christian....

[skempe]

I guess I'm way late on this..i haven't gotten on in quite some time. I'm the one that started the last worship leading thread..and all I'll say is wow guys...my bad. I seriously had no intention some religion war or something. I mean the moderator and others completely complimented eachother and hacked at eachother at the same time in that thing. I'm 16. I've been a musician for 5 years. I've already been in and out of many situations, and I was just trying to somewhat discuss what I'm being more and more called to do. Like seriously I'm writing this from the computer lab at my high school where I'm a junior. that being said, its obvious that im still new to world situations and whats going on in the world as far as religion. I love talking to people about God and helping them with him, and i love playing music anywhere. I also love working with intricate rigs. so through worship leading i just get the best of all 3 of those worlds. ive seen people on that thread i started talking about how theyre not christian, how they wanna be competitive from the writing standpoint, and other situations. worship leading also does have a large deal to do with songwriting, for the record. i mean any music does, someone has to write the songs. I really wasnt caring if you were christian, buddhist, muslim, or what denomination of christianity you are. if some buddhist checked out a worship forum, id actually like to hear about what they do as far as music to worship. Thats pretty cool to learn about. Now if someone comes in wanting to be competitive about the songwriting, they can just leave. i mean even the last guy saying i hate god too but lets see what yall can write. whats that? yall are talking about being ignorant, thats ignorant. i mean i guess trying to discuss that on here may be a bad idea. but wheres it gonna get more posts? which website do you think is looked at more, harmonycentral or "www.worshipforum.com"? seriously harmony central blows any other place out of the water. so excuse me for starting all this crap guys. my bad.
somebody who wants to not have a problem with everything and everyone and just wants to talk about the actual topic, message me or something where others wont just give you crap about it.

[the-good-way]

but wheres it gonna get more posts? which website do you think is looked at more, harmonycentral or "www.worshipforum.com"? seriously harmony central blows any other place out of the water. so excuse me for starting all this crap guys. my bad.

somebody who wants to not have a problem with everything and everyone and just wants to talk about the actual topic, message me or something where others wont just give you crap about it

 

The reflection of that can desire be a gift! just as the draw of harmony-central is seen as wider then "worshipforum.com" can can the draw of the HC main songwriting forum be in relation to a proposed worship forum.

Giving an opportunity for all to comment from a wide variety of perspectives - devine, religious, secular and the whole spectrum in-between

[Michael Blue]

If it is dead then why do you keep bringing it up ?

 

 

I don't. I respond when there is something to respond to, if there wasn't, I'd let it die, as it should.

 

As for "what others can do for "me"", that's ridiculous. You obviously don't know anything about me or my beliefs.

 

The point here wasn't segregation; if you bothered actually reading before throwing in your $.02, you'd know that. From a strictly musical standpoint there is no reason not to post all materials in the existing Songwriting forum. But then, that wasn't the point, either. Worship music, in all its many forms, no matter how you define that, aspire for something more than being "good", musically, or being good to listen to. It is the single form of music that intentionally strives to move its participants (notice, I did not say "listeners" - another huge difference from standard secular music) into a specific state of being, and then, to action. There is no other form of music on the planet that sets out - from the start - to do this. From that standpoint alone, those who are only familiar with secular music cannot offer positive feedback. It's no different than a plumber offering advice on invasive heart surgery - or vice versa.

 

Now, your individual perception causes you to interpret anything that you view as "religious" as being bad and overly aggressive and brought about by whiners who are power and attention hungry, and that's unfortunate. But it's also very narrow minded and short sighted. You would do well to stop evaluating all things that you perceive as being somewhat related to those kinds of causes in that way, because most of them do not fall under your blanket statements. You never know, you just may run into something/someone that would surprise you, if you opened your eyes and gave them a chance to be different than your past experiences.

[DeveryHarper]

How can I even respond to this gibberish? You sit there and tell me that "You obviously don't know anything about me or my beliefs" and then you begin to tell me about mine and how I didn't "bothered actually reading before throwing in your $.02," accusing me of being of not being thoughtful with my posts and not reading the thread. Just because I disagree with your whole premise this is what I get?

You then say "that your individual perception causes you to interpret anything that you view as "religious" as being bad and overly aggressive and brought about by whiners who are power and attention hungry, and that's unfortunate." Now let's turn the page. . .how do you know what I believe? Do you know that I was a minister for a couple of years? Do you think I am a Christian hater? How do you know how I view religion? Frankly son, you are a whiner. You are also an incessant complainer. You also come across as if HC owes you, your holiness something. Even I am more humble than this (though I am now an atheist).

How can I even respond to you?

I guess I am "very narrow minded and short sighted" and that "I would do well to stop evaluating all things that you perceive as being somewhat related to those kinds of causes in that way, because most of them do not fall under your blanket statements. You never know, you just may run into something/someone that would surprise you, if you opened your eyes and gave them a chance to be different than your past experiences."

I can not repeat it enough times. Your idea is good for you. Not for HC. HC is not yours. It is not mine. You come here with a good idea. But this idea is not good as a whole. You then accuse others of the same nonsense you accuse me of, that if we have any negative input whatsoever we somehow did not read the thread or already have some blinding bias that blinds us.

How can I respond to this?

What does HC owe you?

And enough of the holier than thou attitude. Don't tell me or others what you think we should or shouldn't do just cause we don't agree with you. If you want to argue than go over to the political forum and have at it. You would fit in.

[cg_25]

I feel it would benefit those who's main area of music (like me) is the muisc ministy in our respective churches.





































Please HC! Pleas!

[Dean Roddey]

I don't see the point if having a section that is based on a belief system that has nada to do with music. We don't have a Dog Lovers section. We don't have a Satan Worshiper's section. Why should we have a religious music section? That kind of seems like asking for special status to me.

[the-good-way]

It is the single form of music that intentionally strives to move its participants (notice, I did not say "listeners" - another huge difference from standard secular music) into a specific state of being, and then, to action. There is no other form of music on the planet that sets out - from the start - to do this.

 

 

Even there we can have different interpratations- the war march (with the anthem being, perhaps, a closer counterpart to praise, rather than, worship music), the protest song, even the forms of dance music (the 'called dance' comes to mind), for instance can share that.

 

That very difference in perspective can be instructive and a source of constructive feedback

 

The point here wasn't segregation; if you bothered actually reading before throwing in your $.02, you'd know that

 

Much as we were discussing on the, now closed, companion thread. It can be that peopl are reading, but have come to a different understanding .

[Michael Blue]

If you want to argue than go over to the political forum and have at it. You would fit in.

 

 

Actually, I think I've made like "one" post there. I avoid it like the plague.

I hate arguments, and I detest ignorant political debates amongst those who cannot change anything.

[DeveryHarper]

Absolutely nothing. I've never stated or behaved like it did. Your interpretation of my posts is sharply skewed. Holier than thou?! Wow...Again, skewed. I don't believe I've told anyone "what to do". I'm sorry you feel the way you do about me, about this topic, whatever. You have shown your feelings clearly though, so to say "how do I know how you feel" doesn't give yourself enough credit. Actually, I think I've made like "one" post there. I avoid it like the plague. I hate arguments, and I detest ignorant political debates amongst those who cannot change anything.

 

My interpretations are not skewed good sir. You have been, in my opinion, making a fool out of yourself here. You are condescending and come across as a know it all. You hurl out ad hominems, accuse others of not reading, not comprehending, literally being ignorant--or worse yet stupid. You tried your hand and the powers that be at HC did not think it was that great of an idea and refused your request. Even after that you continued, as if HC owed you something. So, with that said, you might not feel that they owe you something, but you sure carry on as if they do.

As far as the 'holier than thou' comment, I'm sure others can attest that this is spot on. You do have an air of cockiness. I would never even think about talking to people like you do, unless I'm over on the political forum, not if I want something!

Look, we could go on and on and on with each other. Since this is not going to work (the new forum), maybe we could just start over, no? I have nothing against you. You are passionate, there is nothing wrong with that. But if your passion starts to rise above others to the point that you speak down to them then it is hard for me to just stand by and watch if you know what I mean. Anyways. I hope to hear some more of your music around these parts in the future. ,

[Michael Blue]

Likewise.

It's supposed to be "all about the music", and personality differences carry the potential to ruin that. I do have a tendency to be "transparent", and people have a hard time with that. It's not that I think I'm better than anyone else (quite the opposite, actually). But I do speak what's on my mind, and people aren't used to that, so they react like you have, thinking I'm awfully arrogant to be speaking that way. It's actually only because I consider myself nothing, so I have nothing to hide. But that's just me.

If I understood you right, your story (priest gone atheist?) sounds like a deep one, and I'd love to hear the details sometime. I bet walking your particular path makes for some very interesting musical inspiration, and I'd love to hear your work sometime.

[kurdy]

First let me say that I don't think the OP's idea is a bad one. As he said, the difference between a worship forum and a hip-hop, metal, bluegrass, etc. forum is that with other genres, it's all about the music. We discuss the merits of the music, and how well it stands on its own. But with worship music, it's about all the stuff surrounding the music, and how well the music can support what else is going on. I guess a good analogy would be music created for therapy. It serves a different purpose than entertainment. There's more to it than merely whether or not it sounds good. And someone who isn't familiar with the form will judge it based on criteria other than what it was intended for. That's the argument I think the OP is trying to make. Not that everyone who doesn't get it is ignorant, or that we need to separate the believers from the non-believers.

On the other hand, I'm not sure how smart a move that would be on the part of HC in the long run. It really wouldn't make any difference to us long-time posters--we know the reputation of HC and that it has no religious affiliations, and people of all types of beliefs are welcome here. But eventually people here move on, and new people might want to join. A non-religious person coming here for the first time might see "Worship forum" and get scared off--not that they'd have any reason to. But as this thread has demonstrated, many people, especially a lot of musician/creative types are very touchy on the subject of religion, and it wouldn't take much to turn them off. And I'm assuming it wouldn't be in HC's interest not to attract as many types of people as possible.

[DeveryHarper]

Likewise. It's supposed to be "all about the music", and personality differences carry the potential to ruin that. I do have a tendency to be "transparent", and people have a hard time with that. It's not that I think I'm better than anyone else (quite the opposite, actually). But I do speak what's on my mind, and people aren't used to that, so they react like you have, thinking I'm awfully arrogant to be speaking that way. It's actually only because I consider myself nothing, so I have nothing to hide. But that's just me. If I understood you right, your story (priest gone atheist?) sounds like a deep one, and I'd love to hear the details sometime. I bet walking your particular path makes for some very interesting musical inspiration, and I'd love to hear your work sometime.

Yea, I am an interesting character. I always said if I wrote a biography it would come across as fiction. I don't know if my "de-conversion" influences my music in any way. Maybe it would have several years ago when I was bitter. But since I am over the bitter stage...

I also trust you are not arrogant, Michael. Who knows, these forums can bring the worst in all of us out if you know what I mean. So much also can get lost when your not right there in front of a person watching the hand movements and hearing the tone of voice. Anyways. . .

As far as my stuff, I have yet to really share any of it here. Maybe some day I will.

[Michael Blue]

As far as my stuff, I have yet to really share any of it here. Maybe some day I will.

Well, I cheated...You have a link in your sig, so I tip-toed in.
First, I read your synopsis of your "style", and I thought I recognized your avatar from the KSS forum...Your synopsis intrigued me.

Listening to "Inviting Confusion"...If all your stuff is "similar", I'm a fan.
"Squaring the Circle", ahh, there's a nice mix there, electronica and acoustic...Just like most of mine, just less "pop" than mine.
"Realization", perfect. LOVE the Korg-esque sweeping synth.
Nice stuff, mate. I look forward to delving deeper...

[DeveryHarper]

What is it, 85% of all communication is non-verbal? Something like that, so yeah... Well, I cheated...You have a link in your sig, so I tip-toed in. First, I read your synopsis of your "style", and I thought I recognized your avatar from the KSS forum...Your synopsis intrigued me. Listening to "Inviting Confusion"...If all your stuff is "similar", I'm a fan. "Squaring the Circle", ahh, there's a nice mix there, electronica and acoustic...Just like most of mine, just less "pop" than mine. "Realization", perfect . LOVE the Korg-esque sweeping synth. Nice stuff, mate. I look forward to delving deeper...

 

 

LOL! I don't know if any of my stuff is ever the same. My newest stuff has lots of African type percussion. Sometimes I'm in a classical mood, sometimes I'm in an electronic mood, sometimes I'm in my heavy metal mood! Every song I do I try to experiment with different sounds and styles.

All my stuff has been done with the Yamaha Motif and the Motif ES. I don't have any Korgs. I should though! I also have a ton of plug ins by EastWest Quantum Leap.

What is the KSS forum?

[Michael Blue]

Keyboards, Synthesizers and Samplers.

 

I like the ethnic influences, reminds me of stuff in my Planet Earth module.