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Friends, Women, and War


curbkid

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This is an attempt at a song about a friend I lost because of a girl. We'd been friends for about 7 years and then this girl came along and in a couple of months we just grew apart. He was worried that I would make a move on his girl, because I had a little crush, which just drove me crazy that he didn't trust me after 7 years. Like I said I did have a crush but I'd never do anything like that. Any way this is only a first draft, and is by no means complete, but I wanted to see what you all think.

 

 

Quite screams inside my brain, all I

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OK, well please just take the comments as "editor comments", so if they sound negative it's because I'm commenting on areas I think could use work - and they only comments on the lyrics as they are -- nt on you

and anyway it's just my opinion and it's from the hip...I'm just going to ramble the thoughts as they come to, hopefully, just record my impressions for ya

so if you do take the comments at all take em with a big big grain of salt

 

I think it's too heavy on the rhyming couplets, makes it play a bit trite

 

I think all the apocalyptic imagry feels sophmoric...it feels a bit self-absorbed. The problem I'm having there is that it doesn't feel like there is any room for me the listener, to follow the narrator or be introduced to the "world of the song". It starts ff so big, I can't really get that "willing suspension of disbelief" or identify with the narrator

I suggest making the song about you him and the girl as opposed to gods warring for heaven

 

Notic that you had to tell us the story as a preamble. I think the thing is sooo loaded with dramatic imagry and device that it's hard to really connect with the story...I don't mean you have to have a plotlike narrative, just that I, as the listener shuld be able to relate to the situation (the detailed facts dont matter...the listener will often relate the situation t their own world) without the need for the factual preamble

 

eh, just some thought

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Is this one of those "based on actual events" things, where many of the fine details are fictional, or did you make a move on her? :D

 

I'm fighting the temptation to critique the speeelllingn nad gramer, so I won't, but many word processors (and Mozilla Firefox browser, in fact) have built-in spelling and grammar checks.

 

Other than that, your use of the great dramatic lends the reader a hint to your age, life experience and experience as a writer. Something to consider when you're writing something you plan on having around for a long time, is "what will I think when I read this in my '80s?", or "what would my family think if they read this?". Now, sometimes you have to intentionally step away from those thoughts for the purpose of achieving what you want as a writer without fear of losing self-image, but sometimes awareness of that self-image can save you from a sophomoric effort. Not saying this one is...Just "in general"...

 

I think you're on to a great start, please update as you move forward with it!

 

:thu:

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I'm not seeing a ton of spelling errors - unfortunately "quite/quiet" will pass a spell check

 

[i'll have tons of typographicals largely because I'm running this machine WAAYYY past EOL -- it's a laptop that has 200mph tape instead of hinges...the 2 ky sometimes even works!)

 

[a few years ago there was this funny little essay written rife with spelling errors that will pass a spell check - I'll see if I can't dig that up. it's funny]

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h, a bit f a tangent, but I found one of those spell chek essays (nt the one I was thinking of, but pretty decent none-the-less)

 

The Shortcomings Spellcheck

 

I would like to apply fore a job as an editor of your paper. I halve a computer, and it has spellcheck, and it wood seam that this is awl I really knead.

 

I had originally intended too dew this last weak, but then I happened to reed my horoscope in The Times, and it said: "Put on the reigns before you lose control of everything. Of coarse, once I red this, I gnu it wood be better to weight four a more auspicious thyme.

 

Aye thought at first that maybe I should caul, but then I decided it mite be better to right. I truly believe that I would be a grate editor--know matter watt--rein or shine. Eye wood make accuracy inn spelling the mane ingredient of my editorial rain. Just to prove my hart is in the rite place, I maid sure this letter was perfect--I ran it threw Spellcheck.

 

I really due wont this job, and I no I could bee a reel asset, butt if yew don't higher mi, I won't whale.

 

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just thought it was an interesting little piece. That's why I called it out as a bit of a tanget

(sorry for the typographicals, trying to build up a new home box, but it's a BTX case and I seem to have mislaid the HDD munting bracket (it doesn't use stndard bays)

 

[curbkid, sorry if it felt like a hijack, just thought it an entertaining little aside]

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Thanks for the advice, I'll try pulling out a little on the drama.

As far as a move goes, well.... no but if things hadn't of worked out well........ ;) who knows what might have happened. No worries about the tangent man. As far as spelling that is the magic of MC Word for you, I wrote the song out and copied it. I'll try rewriting it less dramatic and post the new version.

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i dont think you should pull out on the drama really. the same thing has sort of happened to me in a way and i feel so stabbed in the back/ i think its good, but maybe a bit too many comparisons. i think you should give a bit of the story first, ya know, like gettin the listener in so they could relate and feel how good the way things in the beginning were and how it hurt when a friendship turned to crap. just my 2 cents

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Other than that, your use of the great dramatic lends the reader a hint to your age, life experience and experience as a writer. Something to consider when you're writing something you plan on having around for a long time, is "what will I think when I read this in my '80s?", or "what would my family think if they read this?". Now, sometimes you have to intentionally step away from those thoughts for the purpose of achieving what you want as a writer without fear of losing self-image, but sometimes awareness of that self-image can save you from a sophomoric effort. Not saying this one is...Just "in general"...

 

 

I agree. You come out angry. I guess you probably are, but you seem defensive-angry. It's important to say that i'm not judging you at any way:cop:, and only trying to show you what you wrote in a different light. I have a feeling this story occurred recently, and that your feeling about it are yet to be processed. I don't think you would want to look defensive- angry. It's not the most flattering way to present yourself, and your listeners may see you as immature. I like the concept of your song and your metaphors. The Idea is good to. that's an interesting story. I would just work a bit on the attitude...

Good work! (and I hope you and your friend will overcome this)

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I agree. You come out angry. I guess you probably are, but you seem defensive-angry. It's important to say that i'm not judging you at any way:cop:, and only trying to show you what you wrote in a different light. I have a feeling this story occurred recently, and that your feeling about it are yet to be processed. I don't think you would want to look defensive- angry. It's not the most flattering way to present yourself, and your listeners may see you as immature. I like the concept of your song and your metaphors. The Idea is good to. that's an interesting story. I would just work a bit on the attitude...

Good work! (and I hope you and your friend will overcome this)

 

 

pantera being angry turned out as a masterpeice

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It was about two years ago when everything fell apart. Just recently, he and I started to even talk again. The thing with the tone of the song is I wanted to write it with the mind set and the emotions I had at that place in time, so that someone who has been through, or is going through something similar can identify with the song. I'm not angry now, just regretful, but thats beside the point. I rewrote the song, from scratch this version is allot lighter, but still holds allot of the emotion.

 

I'm not a saint

And I don't want to be

But brother, OOO brother

There's something wrong with me

I shouldn't have talked to your girl

But she trusted me

I guess you could say I have the face of a trusty man

Well you tell them the truth

You let them know

Let them know

I'm not a saint

I don't try to be

But I do believe love aint for three

And she wasn't for me

I swear I had no plan for right away

I swear I'd put it off for another day

Brother man, I'm sorry

We both were wrong

I guess it's true what they say

The Devil 's got a blue dress on

To bad we didn't know

Which way the waters would flow

But in the end

It's like we started all over again

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Let me ask you Thrash as someone who has walked this road, what kind of emotions would speak to you. Like anger, sadness, or what I really want this to speak to people when it's all said and done.

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Let me ask you Thrash as someone who has walked this road, what kind of emotions would speak to you. Like anger, sadness, or what I really want this to speak to people when it's all said and done.

 

 

They (all the emtions) are all vlid. And guess what -- so are each of the perspectives in the triangle.

It's really a question of what you want to say and to whom you are saying it (in the literary sense, the actual audience culd be anyone.)

 

FWIW - the triangle -circumstances can differ a bit, but the ones you describe aren't too rare- is a pretty common experience in love

(If you are a younger guy, some of your peers may not have hit this partiular bump yet. If you are an older guy, ask your friends over a bourbon when the wives are asleep about triangles in their past...betcha theyll have a scar or two)

 

It sunds like you are still actively working through it (not ure that it ever ends, but at some point you can make peace with it) so the work feels really cathartic. So you may just want to take a look at what YOU are actually trying to say

Right now, it looks like it's, essentially, a letter to the othr guy (I mean hes the audience in the literary sense, not that you're going to hand the guy a tape of it)

 

Catharsis is a totally valid function in art (one of the biggies, maybe THE biggie). One thing that you can modulate in that is how you balance the expression in terms of focus on the artist/audience. Focus too much on just the artist without regard for audience and the work can become self-serving (in a ngative sense) and loses relevance for the auience. Fcus too much on he audience and you can find yourself pandering and nt really sayng much of anything - not really making artistic statment.

 

 

The emotional in the first draft , hey, its part of the trip - my comments were more about the expression than the emotion. I think it was the grandiosity, not the intensity, that gets in the way

sometimes it can be a defensive mech...we hurt, it burns, it feels evry bit that bad -- Do I have to admit how alone and small and frail and weak I feel too? ;) - I mean being burned by the fires of hell with broken souls at my feet at least makes it important!

The Who had a kind of critique on that "This is no social crisis, it's just another tricky day for you"

 

 

 

Pretty cool that you whipped out another ver from a different (emotion/perspective) place so quickly

 

I tend to overengineer and edit, so take it for what it's worth...an idea to help the juices more than a suggestion (actually, that's what all my notes are. I don't think I'm good enough to suggest a lot -- just try to give impressions)

 

What if you write (even just as a draft of lyrics like you have been ding) it as a "catharsis suite" ---

OK you wrote one from within the flames (the pain)

Then yu've written from the ashes (the regret)

How were you feeling when it was tinder?

can you see yourself plowing the ashes into the field? (making some piece)?

 

OR (could be and)

 

seems like you are writing to the other guy

 

what would yu write to her?

what would you write to yourself?

 

OR

 

What if you write one thing from your perspective (which, I guess you are currently)

then

try to see if you can from her perspective

then maybe from his (the other guys') perspective

 

might make a good exercise to figure out what you really really, at the core of it, are looking to say

 

(n the plus side, the new desktp box is getting an OS install this mrning, so typos should go down radically and my stuff should be easier to read I noticed the "O" key is the current super-flakey one...it changes from day to day, but we're talking a keyboard that has been dried out in a sauna more than once)

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Let me ask you Thrash as someone who has walked this road, what kind of emotions would speak to you. Like anger, sadness, or what I really want this to speak to people when it's all said and done.

 

well this happen ed like 3 months ago and is still going on. i feel mixed emotions. at first frustrated, then angry, then sadness. i feel sad that those moments with my friend were the happiest ive had in a ERY long time and that he has become obsessed with this woman so much i was mad at her, but i knew i should be mad at him. im just so sad that things couldnt stay the way that they were, i want things to go back the way they were..:cry:

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Thanks for all your help guys I'm going to take these notes and try some stuff out and see where it leads. When I get another draft worth posting I'll put it up, but it might be a while, I'm going to take my time with this one. Thrash man I hope it works out better for you than it did for me, just try to remember he's your friend and everyone makes mistakes, I think I forgot about that somewhere along the road, and wish I never had.

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I really liked the second version. Slight-Return's post was very helpful, thank you! I'm so happy I got into this forum, your post is an excellent professional songwriting exercise. I'll try it myself...

Cirbkid, good luck with the song. I would love to see the results!

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Thanks for all your help guys I'm going to take these notes and try some stuff out and see where it leads. When I get another draft worth posting I'll put it up, but it might be a while, I'm going to take my time with this one. Thrash man I hope it works out better for you than it did for me, just try to remember he's your friend and everyone makes mistakes, I think I forgot about that somewhere along the road, and wish I never had.

 

thanks man, good luck with the song :thu:

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