Members grace_slick Posted February 7, 2011 Members Share Posted February 7, 2011 What are these chords? I can't find a proper chord thing that shows the individual notes anywhere (I know I asked something similar to this a while back but can't find that old thread) Thank you SO much!! A3 D4 F4 G3 B3 D4 C3 E3 G3 G3 C4 E4 B3 E4 G4 A3 C4 E4 F3 A3 C4 E3 G3 B3 E3 A3 C4 D3 F3 A3 D3 G3 B3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stackabones Posted February 7, 2011 Members Share Posted February 7, 2011 Here's one way to think about them ... A3 D4 F4 --Dm/A G3 B3 D4 -- G C3 E3 G3 -- C G3 C4 E4 -- C/G B3 E4 G4 -- Em/B A3 C4 E4 -- Am F3 A3 C4 -- F E3 G3 B3 -- Em E3 A3 C4 --Am/E D3 F3 A3 -- Dm D3 G3 B3 -- G/D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 7, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 7, 2011 Thank you!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stackabones Posted February 7, 2011 Members Share Posted February 7, 2011 You're welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 7, 2011 Members Share Posted February 7, 2011 You should learn to find the root note of a chord. Chances are, you know them instinctively, you just need to learn to find them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stackabones Posted February 7, 2011 Members Share Posted February 7, 2011 That's a good idea (and it's often learned in a first year harmony class), but most of those chords aren't in root position and can be confusing if basic harmony isn't known. Inversions can be more difficult to spot without a fundamental knowledge of how chords are spelled. I don't mind helping out, but I'd rather teach someone to fish rather than give someone a fish, ya know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 8, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 8, 2011 Yeah, see I don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JohnBenussi Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Yeah, see I don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Oh no!! When I saw that you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 1-4-6 isn't 1-4-6. It's 4-6-8 with the 8 placed at the bottom instead of the top. So if 1-3-5 was C major, 1-4-6 is F major with C at the bottom instead of F. I figure you know what a major chord sounds like and what a minor chord sounds like. Start with a C major chord, so C3-E3-G3. Now flip the C to the top so you have E3-G3-C4. That's still a C major, just with an E at the bottom. Now flip the E to the top, now you have G3-C4-E4, that's still a C major, but now with G at the bottom. All major chords based at the root have three keys between the lower two notes, and two keys between the higher two notes. See, look at C3-E3-G3. There are three keys between C3 and E3, basically C#, D, and D#. Then there are two keys between E3 and G3, basically F and F#. If something sounds like a major chord but isn't following this pattern, then flip the notes around until they do, then you'll know what key you're in. Minor chords are similar except that there are two keys between the lower two, and three keys between the higher two, so like C-Eb-G. If you are wondering what chord you're playing, and it sounds like a basic minor or major chord, then flip the notes around until they follow the 3-2 or the 2-3 pattern. For instance, let's say you've got E3-A3-C4. You have four keys between E and A and two keys between A and the higher C, so clearly it doesn't follow a 3-2 or 2-3 pattern. So flip the E to the top, so you have A3-C4-E4. Now you can see that it follows the 2-3 pattern and therefore is an A minor chord. If you can't flip the notes around in a chord to make a 2-3 or 3-2 pattern, then you have a chord that is not a major or a minor triad. Get it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Mm. I'm not sure. lol I'm a little slow, you see. A D F for instance...if it was a normal whatever chord, it'd be A C E, right? But then I move 2 up each to get to the D and the F...so what's that? Stackabones said it's Dm/A...but what IS that? It's a D minor with...an A? What? This is why I'm confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 A D F is still a normal triad, you just don't see it until you put the A at the top. Then you have D-F-A. On a piano, that would be two keys between D and F, and three between F and A. That means it's a D minor. The A at the end tells us that A is the bass note. You shouldn't think of A-D-F having risen from moving the keys from an A-C-E. Sure, that's how you get to that chord, but A-D-F is a new chord altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 No, but I started with A and then went up to the D and then the F. The A MUST be on the bottom or it sounds completely different, you see? I WANT A D F in that order. (and yeah, I didn't mean to think of it as an extension or something or A C E. I know that's another chord entirely, I just used it as an example of how I moved the fingers to get to the A D F chord). So anyway...so what good is it knowing that A D F is actually D F A if when D F A is played, it's not what I want? A D F is? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Of course you want them in that order. That's what we call the voicing of the chord, where we choose where the notes of the chord should go and which ones should be played. On piano, voicing is crucial from day one since all the notes are so easily heard. Guitarists don't tend to learn many different voicings at first and just know one or two and acquire more over time. However, it is actually the same chord as D-F-A. The utility of that? When you tell the guitarist to play a D minor chord, he/she will know what to do with it. That's one of the many. A more advanced pianist can use the knowledge that you're in D minor and make some really cool arrangements on the right and left hands that harmonize nicely with the melody. Also, a pianist has to know many different voicings of a chord to play chords that don't sound sucky. See, you instinctively know that A-D-F must follow A-C-E. That's the kind of instinct that an ensemble singer or a pianist has, that chords need to stay close to the last chord in order to sound right, that going from A-C-E to D-F-A sounds kinda crappy. A guitarist tends to move his/her barre chords around and not worry about voicing as much until he/she becomes an advanced player, and even then, is always limited by the physical limitations of the six strings, whereas a pianist is free to choose all kinds of wacky voicings. Different instruments lead to different musical insights, that's why people learn multiple instruments. Anyway, free piano insight. Instead of going from A-C-E to A-D-F, try adding some notes so that the chords are A-C-E-G then A-C-D-F. A popular chord that might come after that would be G-B-D. Instead of that, try playing G-B-D-F. And then play G-B-C-E. I know it's a bit of a Pandora's box having that fourth note in there, but I just described the first four chords of "Autumn Leaves," a jazz standard. That song also happens to share the same chords as "You Never Give Me Your Money" by The Beatles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Yeah...I just really like how chords sound (some of 'em) when moving just 2 of the notes up or down...they get a kinda mournful and/or poignant sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Yeah but see, if you were adding your left hand, you would find that even when you go from A-C-E to A-D-F in the right hand, the second chord sounds more grounded when you play a D in the bass note. And that's kind of how root notes are. When you're not on your root note in the bass section, it adds a feeling of unease. Which is good if you want that, but you want to save that because if you do it too often, it loses the effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Oh boy. I really know absolutely nothing, don't I!? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 You gotta start somewhere. And you'll be surprised at how far the 1-4-5 can take you, it's the basis of music theory. You know, songs that only use the three chords, C, F, and G. You could voice them as C-E-G, C-F-A, and D-G-B to see what I'm talking about. You can combine them in all kinds of combinations. I was thinking about Mozart pianos sonatas in the car today and the first half of most of them only use 1-4-5. It's equally good enough for Blink-182, Chuck Berry, Mozart. Ain't that something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Yeah, that is pretty darn cool! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stackabones Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 I think honeyiscool has already explained everyting quite well, but I'll say something, too. Dm/A just indicates that the chord is second inversion. You read it as "Dm over A" which just means, as already mentioned, a D minor with A in the bass. D F A = Dm, this is in root position. D is the root and in the bass.F A D = Dm/F, this is first inversion. F is in the bass.A D F = Dm/A, this is second inversion. A is in the bass. If you wish to learn more about it, find a good theory/harmony teacher and start studying. This is first year stuff, and the stuff you learn in that first year will do wonders for your musical literacy. It'll give you most of the fundamental knowledge you'll need to understand harmony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 First year, eh? I feel dumb now! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stackabones Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 First year, first semester. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grace_slick Posted February 10, 2011 Author Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 HAHA! Oh dearie ME I better hop to it then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Johnny-Boy Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 "I was thinking about Mozart pianos sonatas in the car today and the first half of most of them only use 1-4-5. It's equally good enough for Blink-182, Chuck Berry, Mozart. Ain't that something?" - honeyiscool Then again, creating melodies for chord progressions developed from 1-4-5 has been pretty much exhausted. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members eddieboston2 Posted February 10, 2011 Members Share Posted February 10, 2011 Lots of good responses here. Here's my perspective: The way I usually think about it is to forget about the octaves, arrange the notes as close to each other as possible on the keyboard, then look at the intervals between the notes. For example, the first one you asked about: A3 D4 F4 It's pretty easy to see at a keyboard that the notes are closer together if you play the A an octave higher, giving: D4 F4 A4 Then you have the intervals: D -> F = 3 half-steps = minor 3rd F -> A = 4 half-steps = major 3rd Now if you know your chord formulas, you'll recognize that a major 3rd stacked on top of a minor 3rd is a minor chord, making it a Dm. Since you're playing an A in the base, you can write it as Dm/A. I sometimes call this a "slash chord." (I've included links to more info on my guitar lesson blog.) Hope that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.