Members FastRedPonyCar Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 So Zach brought by a new treat today. A guy had sent him a 100H with a blown output transfromer. After giving the guy a few choices (trying to get a stock replacement, using one of his Heyboers he puts in the Titans or an O'netics he had laying around) Guy went with with the o'netics and this was the results. The amp also had the same internal SLO mods he did to my 100H a while back and it also had the same JJ's brand KT66's as mine had so this was a cool shootout to do to between them. Just for fun, I also hooked up the 22H with the same EQ settings. Both amps had all the knobs set identically, same tubes, etc. In post recording, the only thing I did to the tracks was adjust the track volumes so the amps are all at the same volume. The 22H was obviously the one with the least volume output but the real shock was how much louder zach's version was. 5.2 dB's louder to be precise - in the recording software at least. (you can actually hear the room mic pick up me commenting after a few chords into playing his amp me saying how much louder it was. I was VERY surprised) Here's the clip http://www.tonefinder.com/files/82-JCA_Comparison1.mp3 You can hear the boost click on during the tracks. Clip starts with my 100H Second is Zach's 100H Lastly is the unmodded JCA 22H with a couple of RFT 12AX7's in V1 and 2 and a ruby HG in V5. My own thoughts are as follows: Zach's was obviously louder but it was also cleaner and crisper of a sound. These amps were pushed fairly well (about stage volume) but it's worth noting that while the 22H and my own 100H may sound dull in comparison to his, the clips were done after setting HIS amp's eq where I wanted it and then eq'ing my own amps to match THAT so I could have theoretically twisted the presence and trebel around on my 2 amps to give them more sparkle to match Zach's 100H but that would have skewed the results and after actually doing that after recording, it's apparent that you really can't even begin to approach the level of top end clarity his had with simple EQ adjustment. Another big difference is that the lead channel on his isn't darker than the clean channel. This is a big beef I have with mine. I can set the clean channel pushed to classic rock gain type stuff and it sounds GREAT but flipping over to the lead channel immediately has a much darker sound. When I set the gain on the clean channel to 3 o'clock and the gain on the lead channel to about 9 o'clock, the amount of gain between channels is virtually the same but the sound going over to the lead channel just gets very dark and dull by comparison. Zach's didn't do this at all. It stayed exactly the same in terms of clarity. But with the same EQ settings on all 3 amps, in the room at least, the old tried and true cliched phrase "pulling the wet blanket off the speakers" couldn't have been more appropriate when going from my 100 to his 100. Pictar (so exciting ) So the big question for me is now that I've heard what the amp CAN be, do I sink even more money into it? Gotta wait for Christmas spending $$ dust to settle and I'm really not playing a whole lot right now anyways but hopefully once our band starts getting back into gear I'll have a good reason to throw more money at him. While I can't justify the huge price tag of the O'netic's transformer, he said that putting one of his Heyboer's he uses for the titans would deliver more or less the same dramatic difference AND allow use of KT88's, EL34's or 6L6's/KT66's so it's tempting. Real tempting.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tech21man Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 Yep it sounds clearer through the mic (100 vs 100). And if it "balances" the brightness between channels why not! By the way why doesn't everybody gets separate tonestacks or follow peavey's example in the 6505+s (separate pressence ressonance controls per channel) is beyond me. I'd go with the heyboyer solution just to get the extra power tube fiddling. The difference is there in sound but if it can partially compensated with the eq and partially alleviated by the effect of the heyboyer switch and different power tube type then win win is with the heyboyer solution. But if what you hear with the o-netics is THE sound you'd like to have, you are busted!!! Guitarists are the pambered breed after all. Also in a band mix would you believe this extra crispiness/brightness in sound would be a good thing? Sometimes it cuts through the "wrong way" (thinner instead of clear and fat at the same time). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soundgardener75 Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 Are you using the Tokai? Your playing's just pretty rawkin' rad, that all three sounds I liked. Might have to look at that 22H now. That 2nd one indeed had great presence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaoloJM Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 To be honest, I didn't notice much between your 100H and Zach's.By comparison the 22H sounded like their gimpy little cousin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FrostByte Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 By comparison the 22H sounded like their gimpy little cousin. Pretty much my conclusion when I tried a 22H and JCA50H in a store. Very thin and tiny sounding Really want to try the 100! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members yourguitarhero Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 I preferred the unmodified one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knucklefux Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 Just to clarify...it would take more than an OT swap for these amps to run EL34/KT88 tubes safely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sheik_Yerbouti Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 I hear a pretty big difference between yours and Zach's, and yeah, Zach's easily sounds the clearest and the best, IMO. The 22H just sounds kinda boxy and dull compared to the two 100s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members extollo Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 I hear a pretty big difference between yours and Zach's, and yeah, Zach's easily sounds the clearest and the best, IMO. The 22H just sounds kinda boxy and dull compared to the two 100s. Thinking about the 22H without comparing to the other 2 I thought it sounded pretty good in this clip. Perhaps an OT mod can be done on that to open up the sound a bit ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members themadscientist Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 did not like the 22H at all, in fact, haven't heard a clip of it that I do like (good playing though) liked the modded one a bit better, although, I prefer a darker tone in general Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FastRedPonyCar Posted December 19, 2011 Author Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 did not like the 22H at all, in fact, haven't heard a clip of it that I do like (good playing though)liked the modded one a bit better, although, I prefer a darker tone in general I think given the right cab and guitar, you may actually like it. It covers a REALLY nice array of sounds and quite well at that. Certainly better than any amp remotely close to it's price tag thats for sure at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members themadscientist Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 In the room you would. If I hadn't leveled out the volume on the tracks, the volume difference alone would tell the story but the difference in the room was like 2 completely different amps.And I agree on the 22H but honestly, 20 watts vs 100+ watts... Kinda expected?I think given the right cab and guitar, you may actually like it. It covers a REALLY nice array of sounds and quite well at that. Certainly better than any amp remotely close to it's price tag thats for sure at least. I was considering it when I picked up my 50H. I'd be curious to check out a 22H, if my local guitar center stocked anything worth a damn, that is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FastRedPonyCar Posted December 19, 2011 Author Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 For bedroom jamming and jamming with a friend, I don't think you can find a better tube amp than the 22H. It and my little avatar 1x12 w/G12H30 packs a mean punch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members colejustesen Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 The 22H didn't sound bad by any means in that clip, however the 100 watters definitely had more push and oomph to them. Honestly, I liked your 100 watt a bit more than the other one. That doesn't mean it sounded bad, but I just preferred the recorded sound of yours more. Cool clip and tight playing Cole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members themadscientist Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 For bedroom jamming and jamming with a friend, I don't think you can find a better tube amp than the 22H. It and my little avatar 1x12 w/G12H30 packs a mean punch. well, in a few weeks, I'll be jamming with a Cerberus that has a 5 watt mode 22 watts is for amateurs LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FastRedPonyCar Posted December 19, 2011 Author Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 well, in a few weeks, I'll be jamming with a Cerberus that has a 5 watt mode 22 watts is for amateurs LOL Bout time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaoloJM Posted December 19, 2011 Members Share Posted December 19, 2011 In the room you would. If I hadn't leveled out the volume on the tracks, the volume difference alone would tell the story but the difference in the room was like 2 completely different amps. And I agree on the 22H but honestly, 20 watts vs 100+ watts... Kinda expected? Absolutely expected, but I wasn't expecting it to be as dramatic. It lacks the umph and presence of the 100 watters in a very obvious way. I was hearing a very Slash (circa Slash's Snakepit era) influence on the playing too, a good thing IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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