Members BuleriaChk Posted December 3, 2006 Members Posted December 3, 2006 Hi, all, This is a slightly edited post I made to a Yahoo group I moderate (FlamencoDancer), but it might be of interest as a point of departure as a discussion. I am still learning about this as new technology breaks; in my experience, the Flamenco guitar by itself is fully sufficient to support the art without flutes, synths, djembes, accordians, etc., but only if amplified properly to let the full richness of the sound thru without harshness or destroying the sound. So I'm still working on it; I try to describe the problem below with my own analysis and solutions, but I would be interested in hearing others' experiences and solutions... Chuck ============================================I've been watching recent Flamenco DVD's from the recent festivals in Jerez, and the art is fantastic; except for one thing - the guitar amplification. It is generally really bassy and muddy, which is the norm, with very few exceptions, and has been a major struggle for all of my own professional (well, ok, sort of) life... One especially poignant segment was that of the guitarist doing a sound check prior to a performance, obviously extremely frustrated with the sound - it was agony for me to watch. I know this is a dancer list, but dancers might want to pass the following observations (and of course, I'll be happy to discuss them here.) There are two major issues: 1. getting the sound from the guitar to the amp.2. getting the sound from the amp to the listeners (and the guitarists) 1. Getting the guitar sound to the amp. The two basic ways of doing this is with a microphone, a transducer, or a combination of the two. Microphones are problematic - feedback is the major issue, followed closely by proximity effect for omnidirectional mics; the latter produces some (not all - see #2) of the bassy sounds clearly evident on all of the DVD's (where the guitar was amplified on stage - sections shot with camcorders unamplified are fine). And, of course one could record naturally in a studio environment with the help of a professional sound engineer(s) if one had a record contract or had inherited LOTS of money... and that, of course, is not live performance... Until recently transducers (especially piezo) were unacceptable because of a characteristic piezo "quack"; attempts were made (even by me) to install microphones inside guitars, to use a combination of inside mic and transducer, etc. None of these solutions were satisfactory for me since they all had the characteristic "boominess" that I couldn't dial out without destroying the other characteristics .... Finally, materials science has produced an acceptable transducer - in particular, the Pickup-the-world sensor, which reproduces the basic guitar sound very well (even better than those by Fishman, Barcus-Berry, etc..... I have them mounted in all my Flamenco guitars, and haven't looked back since.... 1a. The amp itself. Guitar amps are made for electric guitars, and have entirely different characteristics from amps made for listening to CD's, etc. For a long time I thought the characteristic mid-range and "boomy" sound was due to the effects, but now I think differently, which leads us to: 2. Now that I have the pickup problem solved, the next step was to figure out how to get it thru the speakers. To this end, I have been researching various alternatives, and have spent considerable money, time, and effort pursuing the issue... The bottom line from my perspective is that it is not the effects that are the problem, it is the speaker cabinets themselves (which are used in Flamenco settings). Sound reinforcement companies for rock concerts typically use cabinets to achieve the desired effect for ELECTRIC guitars. Consider this: the electric guitars have steel strings, and need a considerable bass boost since the 3rd, 4th, and 5th strings are weak, compared to those of the nylon string guitar. This means that when you try to amplify a flamenco guitar through and amp into these type of speakers, the flamenco guitar sounds muddy and bassy compared to its natural sound. This bass CANNOT be compensated adequately by EQ, since the speakers are large, often with no tweeter (the trebles are handled by the amplifier circuits.) The answer (I think) is to use studio monitors (this is what one uses in the studio) or for casual gigs, a boombox. For the venues I see in Jerez, studio monitors (with flat responses, e.g. the M-Audio BX5A's) will give a natural sound with plenty of volume for the Plaza..... As far as effects go, I've been looking at modeling software -Guitar Rig 1, Amplitube 2.1, Line 6 Toneport (with all the packs save the bass), and have learned that the first thing to do (with a pickup Flamenco guitar) is to turn off the Cabinet simulations (this assumes you are going into studio speakers) Then you can play with the effects - myself, I like a clean amp with just a bit of distortion, a tad of reverb (Amplitube's twang reverb is bang on), and possibly a little chorus, depending on the palo.... Floor effect modelers I really like are the GNX4, the Zoom G2 and the Zoom G7.1uT. The Roland Microcube will do in a pinch, but it has that rock bass mentioned above, and it can't be dialed out (I just tested the Microcube 20x, and the problem is still there.) One way to test an amp is to take a CD along and play it, AB'ing it with a boombox. The difference between the Microcube and the boombox I use with my iPod is quite obvious .... A portable (battery) alternative is the Alesis Roadfire or one of the ION amplifiers - in the AR you can turn the cabinets off, and the ION's are flat to begin with (I have a roadfire, and have just ordered the ION iPAO2 (which Musicians Friend is blowing out at $80) (Note: locally, electric guitarists aren't impressed with the Roadfire as I am for precisely the same reasons.... ) There is a new iPA03 (for $299) which even has an iPod adapter... ================================================= In any case, if you are performing Flamenco in public, with some rock and roll sound reinforment companying providing the equipment, and wonder why you can't get a decent sound, you might consider the above perspective. Sound guys (especially rock groupies) are notoriously insensitive to acoustic players, in my experience....:-) Anyway, if anyone else has experience, it is a topic important to the flamenco guitar's survival as an accompanying instrument for dancers.... (IMO) The natural sound of the Flamenco guitar is very rich and strong when amplified properly, with no need for violins, djembes, flugelhorns, synths, or whatever to take its place.. provided it can be amplified well in a concert setting..... And let me tell you, I really, really FEEL for that guitarist doing the sound check (and all the others that followed him....:-) Best Regards, Chuck
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