Odd Question

[55gibby]

I have a Parkwood 320M that I really like. One thing that I noticed is that I can feel the body vibrate when it's played (in a good way). A buddy stopped by and said that if you can feel the body vibrate, it's an indictaction of a poorly braced/made guitar. I played his D-28 and his doesn't vibrate nearly to the extent that my Parkwood does. I tend think the opposite

 

Who's right?

[rjoxyz]

You are.

 

On most of my solid bodied guitars (and a couple with lam sides/back), I can feel the vibrations all the way up to the first fret. This includes my HD-28, which is very similar to the D-28 with the exception of having scalloped braces, which increase the top movement and indirectly, the vibrations of the entire guitar.

[Tony Burns]

Some guitars just vibrate more - my Martin OM-28v makes me feel like im getting a massage when i play it - It is wonderful because i feel like im part of the music. My Guild doesnt vibrate as much but its still a wonderfull instrument ( in fact my favorite guitar ) all guitars vibrate differently because of how their made , thickness of woods , bracing etc. I can say this because ive owned alot of different guitars over the past 35 plus years and their all different - but wonderful !

[Hudman]

Your buddy would love a cheap laminate guitar. They barely vibrate.

 

He is wrong. Vibration depends on body shape, bracing pattern and finish.

 

Most people prefer a guitar that vibrates.

[Treborklow]

 

Your buddy would love a cheap laminate guitar. They barely vibrate. He is wrong. Vibration depends on body shape, bracing pattern and finish. Most people prefer a guitar that vibrates.

 

 

+1 Those vibrations open up the wood and make it age nicely and sound better as years go by. That's why some people place their guitars in front of high fi speakers and blast music into the guitar to get the vibrations to open up the wood.

[deoreo]

There are many different ideas and arguments on this topic, I'm not an expert by any stretch, but heres my 2 cents from a classical guitar background.

 

The ideal situation would be that all of the strings vibrating energy be transferred only to the top, or soundboard of the guitar. Any energy spent vibrating the neck, back, and sides lowers the projection, and volume of the guitar.

 

Remember the famous Manuel Torres paper mache guitar

http://home.earthlink.net/~guitarandlute/gtrhstry.html

 

So there seems to be two camps, one that believes that a stiffer back and sides keeps all the energy in the top, and the other that wants the lightest most resonant guitar as possible including the neck, back, and sides without "imploding" on itself.

 

So in a way, you are both "correct"

[55gibby]

I gave him my response, and it went like this:

 

It sounds good, seems well built, plays great and is every bit as loud as I need it to be. To my feeble ears, it appears to have a very complex tone and project well enough to fill a livingroom. I'm not really sweating it if in 25 years it hevelops some serious issues, I'll be to old to care. I paid less than $500 with a case and some extra do dads (soundhole humidifier, strings and a tuner)... I bought this to be a porch strummer, not a collectors item or the guitar of my dreams

[Hudman]

There are many different ideas and arguments on this topic, I'm not an expert by any stretch, but heres my 2 cents from a classical guitar background. The ideal situation would be that all of the strings vibrating energy be transferred only to the top, or soundboard of the guitar. Any energy spent vibrating the neck, back, and sides lowers the projection, and volume of the guitar. Remember the famous Manuel Torres paper mache guitar http://zohourian.com/Main/Classical%20Guitar%20Time%20Line.htm So there seems to be two camps, one that believes that a stiffer back and sides keeps all the energy in the top, and the other that wants the lightest most resonant guitar as possible including the neck, back, and sides without "imploding" on itself. So in a way, you are both "correct"

 

Speaker cabinets are stiff. You can feel the vibration when you touch the side of a speaker cabinet. The vibration is caused by the speaker, not the cabinet. Vibration transfers to anything thing it touches.

 

I do vibration anaylsis on industrial machinery at work. Thick, reinforced concrete vibrates when machinery is mounted on top of it. It's the nature of vibrating energy transfer.

 

The vibration you feel through the back of a steel string acoustic guitar has less to do with the "stiffness" of the back, it's due to the vibration of the soundboard, the size / shape of the body and the density / weight of the woods / materials used to build the guitar. It is the same reason you can feel the vibration in the neck and headstock on some guitars.

 

A classical guitar is a different animal than a steel string acoustic. By nature, a steel string guitar soundboard will vibrate more than a classical guitar soundboard. The steel strings are under more tension.

[Queequeg]

Freeman is going to do a test for us.

 

(when pigs fly)

[Queequeg]

I have a Parkwood 320M that I really like. One thing that I noticed is that I can feel the body vibrate when it's played (in a good way).

If you are feeling this vibration in your gut, then you are sustaining yourself with the proper amount of beer.

[Harmonycat]

I have only one of those "Jump off your Lap" guitars.

 

I wish they all did.....It has a heavier bass response than any other guitar I own. It is a VERY light guitar.

 

I own another that really vibrates more than most....it is light and delicate too, and also has very good bass response.

 

These guitars resonate where they should.....starting a low "E" and going up from there.

 

Others I have that do not vibrate as much, resonate starting a low "A" and centering on "C". The bass response is OK, just not as pleasing as those two.

 

Funny....Overbuilt guitars just don't seem to resonate much at all and lack bass response.

I had a couple of those that did not vibrate much at all.

 

I sold them!

[55gibby]

If you are feeling this vibration in your gut, then you are sustaining yourself with the proper amount of beer.

 

 

Or proper amout of gut!!!

[DeepEnd]

I've speculated that if the player is overweight the guitar might not sound as good because the extra body fat is absorbing vibrations that would otherwise be radiated. Probably no truth to it but makes as much sense as a lot of other stuff.

[Hudman]

I've speculated that if the player is overweight the guitar might not sound as good because the extra body fat is absorbing vibrations that would otherwise be radiated. Probably no truth to it but makes as much sense as a lot of other stuff.

 

Tell Don Ross.

[knockwood]

Or proper amout of gut!!!

 

Or both...

 

I'm definitely with the "vibration is better" people.

[missedmyexit]

 

Freeman is going to do a test for us. (when pigs fly)

 

 

Awesome when Freeman's done with that he can drill some sound ports into his martin and give us a before and after feel for it? Freeman you supply the Martin I'll supply the drill?

[guitarcapo]

The back and sides of a guitar act as a sympathetic resonator to the top so they might olor the sound slightly. Stiffer and denser back and sides mean a brighter guitar with more sustain, but less bass and a more "tinny" sound. This is sometimes a property of the wood itself...or it's thickness..or how it is braced.

 

Classical builders deal with nylon strings and they are always striving for brightness and sustain. That crisp bell-like tone (along with volume and sustain) that is so easily achieved with metal strings is more difficult to obtain with nylon. (In contrast, some luthiers argue that the wonderful bass tone of a classical is the elusive goal of steel string guitar makers)

 

At any rate, to make a classical guitar brighter and sustain more, you stiffen the back and sides as much as possible. You don't want the back and sides vibrating as the body will act like a damper or sink to vibration energy...And a nylon string guitar doesn't create as much energy to spare for that. You don't worry about the brightness this causes because you want that.

 

A lot of classical builders are making the backs and sides stiffer these days. Laminates for the sides and thicker backs are coming back. But I would think that the bottom line would be that the idea might hold a little merit for classicals. But tell your friend that you get better bass response and depth of tone on a steel string if the back and sides are involved in making the sound.