Members jerime Posted July 25, 2007 Members Posted July 25, 2007 For all you reso players out there which do you prefer brass or wood? I have a cheapy wood dobro and I'm thinking of trading for a cheapy brass dobro. For whatever reason I just kind of think the brass is cooler. But for actual function does one outshine the other?
Members DonK Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 Freeman is the resident reso expert, I'm sure he'll be along soon.
Members AK47 Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 It's all just a matter of taste. I prefer wood bodies myself. I think the brass bodies have too harsh of sound. I also prefer steel bodies over brass. The next person may disagree with me. It's like guitar strings everyone has their favorite brand.
Members Terry Allan Hall Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 Like AK, I prefer wood, too...but a lot of folks do gravitate to metal-bodied resos, as well. It's all good!
Members whit townsend Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 Are we talking round necks or squarenecks?What style of music?
Members jerime Posted July 26, 2007 Author Members Posted July 26, 2007 Round necks, and blues (mostly strumming, but a little fingerstyle) with a little slide.
Members Freeman Keller Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 I have one of each, but some other differenced too. My woodie is a very old type 27 spider, while the chromie is a more modern (1980's type 33H) brass single cone biscuit. Both are true Dobro , but the metal one is very much like a Style 0 National. They have completely different sounds but I attribute that as much to the cones and bridges as a the body materials. Both are round necks and I play them blues style - mostly bottleneck - and mostly in open tunings. Both guitars currently have Quartermans, but I'm thinking of trying one of the new NRP's and a carbon fiber biscuit in the type 33H The wood spider has a very sweet traditional singing note - lots of sustain and just full of overtones. It is really happy playing something like Steel Guitar Rag or Dark Was the Night - you can put a whole lot of emotion into just a little vibrato with the old bottleneck. It has lousy intonation, a characteristic shared by most reso, but you can compensate pretty well with the slide. I don't play bluegrass, but you can hear that sweetness singing in the old gal (and it is more of a feminine sound). The only good word to describe the metal one is Nasty. It is sharp, bitting, loud, flashy, in-your-face just plain Nasty. The attack is sharp and the notes chop of fast - and a set of steel finger picks really brings that out. It is most happy waking up in the morning and lookin' round for my shoes, or maybe Rollin'n' Tumblin' a bit. Its the kind of git that wants to go right on down to the Crossroads and start dealing with the old Devil. When I get it out the cat hides and the neighbor's dog start howling. OK, enough of that sillyness - as you know, there are several different metals used for resonators - but you can basically divide them into hard steel and softer "bell brass" (aka "German steel"). You also know the differences between single and tricones. Almost all metal single cones will be biscuits, but in woodies you will find both spiders and biscuits. Every permutation has a different sound, and one of the very best ways to hear them is to get the cds put out by National featuring Bob Brozman playing darn near every model of Nat that they currently make. That will include single cone woodie biscuits, single cone metal biscuits in both steel and brass, and tri cones in steel and brass. National does not make spiders, but you should already know if that is the sound you are looking for. To further complicate matters, the individual cones seem to make a lot of difference. Vintage cones have their own sound - usually a bit sweeter but many have kind of gone dead over the years, Quarterman's are almost always brighter and a little more ringy than the ones in inexpensive Asian imported reso, and NRP is in the process of coming out with new cones (they have new 6 inchers for tricones and the reso world is anxiously waiting for 10's). Last, and far from least, here is an incredible forum mostly dedicated to resonators and other forms of lap and bottleneck slide players. These guy know their resos - you might want to reask your question over here IGS forum
Members whit townsend Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 Round necks, and blues (mostly strumming, but a little fingerstyle) with a little slide. Then I would say wood. Spider cone.If you played more slide/lead, esp hardcore blues, then I'd go w/metal and a buiscuit cone. Wood and spider is gonna sound sweeter and woodier.Decent economy brand is Regal.Good mid level brand is a Paul Beard Gold tone or a Wechter/Sheerehorn. I'd put most Gibsons in this category too, even tho they cost more.Top of the line: Beard, lots of other custom makers. Metal & buiscuit is gonna be louder and more cutting.Economy/mid level: Try some Johnsons and Regals.More money-National all the way. A wood and buiscuit combination is gonna be kinda in between. You might also want to try a tri-cone. Metal body, spider bridging 3 smaller cones. Sweet sound for a metal body not as loud as a buiscuit but good sustain. Regal makes one, and of course theres National for the big bucks. Depends on the sound you want really. I suggest try to play as many of the different types as you can before deciding whats the best fit for you.
Members Freeman Keller Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 Round necks, and blues (mostly strumming, but a little fingerstyle) with a little slide. I'll take exception with Whit and say that in general I wouldn't recommend a spider unless you really want that dobro (lower case means generic) sound. If your want to play the blues it should be either a single cone biscuit (metal or wood) or a tricone (metal). So really it comes down to a slightly mellower sound from wood vs a raspier sound from metal. Then if you like metal, slightly brighter from steel vs slightly more complex from brass. And/or - more sustain from a tricone vs less from a single cone. And watch the neck profiles too - a narrow more rounded 14 fret neck is better for fretted play, while a wider flatter 12 fretter is my preference for slide. And the shorter 14 fret body has a different sound than the longer 12 fret. Go to National's site and get the cd. btw, here is a really crappy clip of my spider woodie in open G, played with a glass slide and flesh and nails. I'm sorry I don't have the metal one for comparison but it would be a lot more, well, nastier sounding http://media.putfile.com/RollnTumble
Members Fred Fartboski Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 I have a cheapy wood dobro and I'm thinking of trading for a cheapy brass dobro. Why not keep your wood one and have both? http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Johnson-Bell-Brass-Resonator-Guitar?sku=514047
Members whit townsend Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 I'll take exception with Whit and say that in general I wouldn't recommend a spider unless you really want that dobro (lower case means generic) sound. If your want to play the blues it should be either a single cone biscuit (metal or wood) or a tricone (metal).So really it comes down to a slightly mellower sound from wood vs a raspier sound from metal. Then if you like metal, slightly brighter from steel vs slightly more complex from brass. And/or - more sustain from a tricone vs less from a single cone. And watch the neck profiles too - a narrow more rounded 14 fret neck is better for fretted play, while a wider flatter 12 fretter is my preference for slide. And the shorter 14 fret body has a different sound than the longer 12 fret.Go to National's site and get the cd.btw, here is a really crappy clip of my spider woodie in open G, played with a glass slide and flesh and nails. I'm sorry I don't have the metal one for comparison but it would be a lot more, well, nastier soundinghttp://media.putfile.com/RollnTumble I agree. I should read more carefully, forgot he already has a wood body that is most likely a spider. Just trying to point out that a wood/spider combination would have a prettier/mellower sound that might be more condusive to fingerstyle. But if its hardcore delta blues your after, agree a buiscuit is the way to go. A wood/buiscuit model might be enough bite to suite him, and keep a little woody character, or not. Most, but not all, cheapie woodies are spiders, and each and evey metal body I've seen have been buiscuits(tri-cones excepted). As has been pointed out, theres a lot more to it than the body material. The type of cone/bridge system has just as much or more effect. Also set up is huge. Most of these cheapies can be improved considerably with a little work. My Regal squareneck "dobro" gained a lot more punch when I installed a Quaterman cone, sand cast #14 spider, and ebony capped bridge inserts, all for around $60.00. I'm sure roundnecks and buiscuit cones are similar. That Johnson looks ike a good deal if you just wanna try one out for little dough, and keep the one you have. Another +-$100 bucks and you could upgrade them both as well.
Members jerime Posted July 26, 2007 Author Members Posted July 26, 2007 Thanks for all the info guys. Actually that Johnson at MF is the cheap brass body I was thinking of going for. I went ahead and placed the order for one last night. The cheap wood one I have already is the Rogue classic spider. It's ok and wasn't a bad place to start, but I like nasty and figured the Johnson would be a step up. I like trashy (in a good way) sounding blues. I think if it sounds like the guy couldn't afford to buy a guitar and had to build one out of bailing wire and pots and pans he might actually have a reason to be playing the blues.
Members Freeman Keller Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 One of each is not a bad thing. Problem is, I want to add a tricone too
Members AK47 Posted July 26, 2007 Members Posted July 26, 2007 One of each is not a bad thing. Problem is, I want to add a tricone too Me too. Steelbody National.
Members jerime Posted July 27, 2007 Author Members Posted July 27, 2007 Well, between you and me one of each is just fine by me but the wife seems to think different (I'm sure there's a few of you that can sympathize). At the moment I'm not really even sure how many guitars I have. I'm slowly trying to weed out the cheaper one's with more expensive ones. But it's really nice to have a variety laying around because I like to do a lot of recording.
Members whit townsend Posted July 27, 2007 Members Posted July 27, 2007 Be sure to let us know all about that Johnson after you've had time to get aquainted.
Members Fred Fartboski Posted July 27, 2007 Members Posted July 27, 2007 Thanks for all the info guys. Actually that Johnson at MF is the cheap brass body I was thinking of going for. I went ahead and placed the order for one last night. The cheap wood one I have already is the Rogue classic spider. It's ok and wasn't a bad place to start, but I like nasty and figured the Johnson would be a step up. I like trashy (in a good way) sounding blues. I think if it sounds like the guy couldn't afford to buy a guitar and had to build one out of bailing wire and pots and pans he might actually have a reason to be playing the blues. I ordered the Rogue squareneck spider for my wife's sister as a gift, sight unseen, about a month ago. I had no idea what to expect and told her she could send it back if it was a piece of junk. She's an experienced singer/songwriter, and when she got it she told me it was a well made player with a satisfying sound and she would be keeping it. The only thing is, she had to send it back for an exchange as the two small circular chrome soundhole screens were loose(as they are on my $2500 Josh Graves Dobro squareneck) and there was a sizeable ding on the lower bout back binding. Otherwise, she said it's a fine instrument. It's amazing, the advances in quality these lower end guitars have been making in the past few years. So no need to feel ashamed about the price you pay.
Members Fred Fartboski Posted July 27, 2007 Members Posted July 27, 2007 Yeah. So be sure to let us know how the Johnson turns out.
Members jerime Posted July 27, 2007 Author Members Posted July 27, 2007 Will do. If it ever gets shipped that is, seeing as how MF is experiencing shipping delays because of the move. I live about a hundred miles away from their shipping center so I'm used to practically getting things over night from them. I'm slightly disappointed because it doesn't look like I'll be getting it by the weekend.
Members Fred Fartboski Posted July 30, 2007 Members Posted July 30, 2007 I was just googling the Johnson and this place has them for $449! http://www.guitarplaza.com/jostoparenew.html So if it turns out to be a player, $149 is an excellent deal. I may even pick one up for myself at that price as I don't have a roundneck in my collection. I'm looking forward to see what you think of it.
Members Fred Fartboski Posted August 3, 2007 Members Posted August 3, 2007 OK. I couldn't wait for the report. I went ahead and ordered the Johnson(green), too. I also ordered one of these nice $40 cases for it: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/document?cpd=0OEY&doc_id=99371&g=guitar&base_pid=540947&index=4
Members jerime Posted August 3, 2007 Author Members Posted August 3, 2007 Sorry, just got it yesterday after at least a week. It's funny because it took a week to be "packed" and since I only live about a hundred miles away, once shipped it was here the very next day. All I can say is holy crap this thing is awesome. Most of the time when you get a good deal on something, afterwards it seems like that's the price you should have paid anyway. Not this guitar. This guitar feels closer to a 400 dollar guitar than a 150 dollar guitar. This guitar booms. I thought my Epi AJ Masterbilt was a loud guitar. This thing could probably cut through the mix of 10 other guitars all playing at the same time. It's not quite as heavy as some other resos I've played. Might be because it's bell brass, but it's still heavy. I think the packaging weight was 12lbs. I would guess it weighs every bit of 10lbs. I don't think it sounds that harsh or nasty sounding as some others I've heard, but it defiantly has that metallic twang to it. For the most part I think it sounds like you would think, but like I said not as nasty or trashy as some. The set up out of the box was decent. The action was fairly low, which might be bad if you want to play a lot of slide, but about right if you play a little here and there. This guitar looks like a million bucks. I got the green because blue might have been too much and gray was just too dull. The green in my opinion somehow almost gives it a vintage look. The neck is nice. Not too fat and not too thin. Tuners seem fairly cheap but stay in tune decent enough. Might eventually upgrade. The wood of the neck is really nice looking, mahogany I believe. The nut is the only thing that looked a little rough. The slot for the low e didn't look quite deep enough. Overall I would say if you are looking for a metal bodied reso and you haven't bought this guitar yet. What are you waiting for, buy it now before they are gone. It's hard to find one for under two hundred even on ebay. Heck even the Rogue metal bodied reso sells for over two hundred new at MF. With time and a good set up I think this is going to be a great players guitar. A nice guitar to sit back and play the blues with. PS If anyone wants to see some pics I'll try to get them up later and maybe if I get time I'll post a little sound clip. Fred I hope you get yours soon. I'm sure my post won't make the wait any better. Let me know what you think when you get yours. Let me know how the case works out too, none of my cases fit it.
Members Fred Fartboski Posted August 4, 2007 Members Posted August 4, 2007 Wow! Thanks for the review jerime, but mine won't be shipping till the 10th.Glad I ordered the green on Wednsday they ran out by the end of the day and blue is all they have left. I didn't care for that color either. I ordered that particular classical case as the MF site had full measurments for both the guitar and the case in the product specs. They matched very close. Then I ran across this at the Johnson website: Our metal body and wood body roundneck resonators fit nicely in classical sized cases. So it should work out great. Can't wait to see your pics as the retailer stock photos don't do the guitar any justice. I did find this nice photo at the Fender Forum though:http://www.fenderforum.com/userphotos/index.html?recid=26375Looks like the same Musicians Gear Classical case.
Members Fred Fartboski Posted August 4, 2007 Members Posted August 4, 2007 I don't think it sounds that harsh or nasty sounding as some others I've heard, but it defiantly has that metallic twang to it. For the most part I think it sounds like you would think, but like I said not as nasty or trashy as some. Maybe put some cheap strings on it?
Members Fred Fartboski Posted August 9, 2007 Members Posted August 9, 2007 Let me know how the case works out too, none of my cases fit it. Johnson arrived Monday and case arrived this morning. It's a perfect fit.
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