Lowering Guitar Action

[Sesro1978]

Hi,

 

I just purchased a Seagull S6+ CW Folk and am noticing that the guitar's action is slightly higher than what I'm used to playing. Is it possible to lower the action a little? If so, what will be done at the shop (I'm not intending on doing this myself)? Finally, what is a typical cost for this procedure?

 

Thanks,

Seth

[DonK]

A set-up typically costs about $30, depending on where you live and how much work is involved. Action is ultimately a matter of geometry - think of the strings and the fretboard as two planes that aren't quite parallel. That's because the strings start out at one height (or amount of separation) at the nut and end at a different height (or amount of separation) at the bridge (if you extend the fretboard plane in an imaginary path to the bridge). Thus, action is initially a matter of the respective heights (or amounts of separation between the strings and fretboard) at these two points. This gets a bit complicated by the fact that the fretboard isn't typically a perfectly level plane, but rather a slightly curved one due to the tension of the strings, which tend to pull the neck (and thus the fretboard) upward to impart a slight bow. The embedded truss rod is used to counteract this pulling force to restore the neck, and thus the fretboard, to more of a straight plane. All of these have to be evaluated in a set-up, though most of the time lowering the action on a guitar properly set up at the factory is a matter of lowering the saddle (i.e., the height of the strings at the bridge). The neck will also be checked for bowing, and will be adjusted as necessary. Assuming the neck is perfectly straight at the outset, as you lower the strings by reducing the saddle height, it may be necessary to add some relief (bow), by loosening the truss rod, to prevent the strings from buzzing against the frets. if the neck isn't nearly straight to begin with (you need at least a little relief), the tech will adjust it appropriately. I personally go for the lowest string height I can get at the body fret (14th fret on your guitar) with an almost perfectly straight neck. That gives me the overall playing feel I like. Everyone is different, though.

 

It can get more complex if the guitar wasn't set up properly at the factory, i.e., if the frets aren't level, if the nut slots are cut too shallow or too deep, etc. You'll be looking at a good bit more than $30 if you have any of these issues, but on a new guitar of Seagull's quality, I wouldn't expect these to be problems. So you're probably looking at lowering the saddle slightly and possibly an adjustment of the truss rod. It's also possible all you need is a truss rod adjustment. It's not uncommon for the neck on a guitar to bow a bit in a new home as it adjusts to a change in humidity. Try holding your guitar firmly at the sides of the body with the headstock pointing away from you toward a good light source at eye level, and then sight down the neck: you should be able to see if it's nearly straight (or level) or significantly bowed. If it's not, and if the string height at the 14th fret and beyond is to your liking, then the only thing you likely need is a simple truss rod adjustment. The shop at which you bought the guitar might do this simple adjustment for free (if you're not comfortable doing it yourself).

 

Check out Freeman Keller's "Is My Guitar Sick" sticky for more info.

[guitarist21]

+1 to the most complete post ever written.

 

Ellen

[DonK]

+1 to the most complete post ever written. Ellen

 

I'm pleasantly bored tonight, after getting back from my annual 8-day "vacation" on Lake George in NY's Adirondack mountains. I put "vacation" in quotes because it involves staying at a "camp" built 50 years ago by my wife's grandfather. It also involves being in constant close proximity to 9 other adults and 10 kids, the oldest of which is my 15 year-old son, and the youngest of which is my 3 year-old niece. As you might imagine, 22 people living in a combination of a two-bedroom cabin, a lean-to, and two tents is a bit claustrophobic, particularly when there's only one bathroom (and a porta-john rented for the summer; now I know what it was like for my parents growing up). For an introvert like me, it's insanity. Yes, it's a paradise of nature, but there's no internet, no showering (there's a shower, but it's just not done!), and no place to slink off to and hide. As a client of mine once said, "my idea of roughing it is having only one color TV". To that I might add, "and using an outhouse and having no internet!"

 

Each year, my wife takes our three boys up there to join her parents, three sisters and various nephews and nieces for the month of August. I join them for a week. Tonight I'm back, sitting on my chair in the family room and blissfully surfing the 'net between bouts with my new D-16RTGE, which is resting nearby. All is well...

[riffmeister]

As you might imagine, 22 people living in a combination of a two-bedroom cabin, a lean-to, and two tents is a bit claustrophobic, particularly when there's only one bathroom (and a porta-john rented for the summer; now I know what it was like for my parents growing up).

 

Yup. "Vacation" is a very optimistic way of describing your adventure!

 

[DonK]

Yup. "Vacation" is a very optimistic way of describing your adventure!

 

Taylor ran an ad for awhile in Acoustic Guitar that showed this cute girl sitting on a sofa in her husband's in-laws' cabin, deep in thought thinking pretty much what I just described, as she lamented being away from her Taylor. I could have written the ad's text! Maybe I should contact Taylor and volunteer. But then, I ran back to my D-16, not my 414.

[riffmeister]

Are you sure you didn't run to the shower first?

 

[DonK]

Are you sure you didn't run to the shower first?

 

In fact, that's EXACTLY what I did. My kids thought it was hilarious.

 

The idea is, you're supposed to take a morning swim to rinse off in lieu of a shower (no soap allowed; can't damage the environment). Well, I don't know if you've ever been in an Adirondack lake, but it ain't your backyard pool in Maryland. To boot, it dropped into the 40's the last two nights I was there, so like, yeah, I'm gonna jump out of bed and into the lake.

[Queequeg]

Twice in the last 5 years I have ventured up into the Adirondacks to old friends' "camp" near Saranac Lake about 10 miles from Lake Placid for a week. Beautiful place. Last year, after 4 days of rain and with the impending arrival the following day of another family with lots of kids (bless their hearts, don't get me wrong, I love kids) I said my goodbyes 3 days early and headed back to Michigan- land of LCD monitors, flush toilets and more guitars than anyone has a right to own.

[Sesro1978]

Hi-

 

Thanks for the excellent answer!

 

Sounds like your time at home might be the real "vacation" :-)

 

Thanks again,

Seth

[Dave W.]

Twice in the last 5 years I have ventured up into the Adirondacks to old friends' "camp" near Saranac Lake about 10 miles from Lake Placid for a week. Beautiful place. Last year, after 4 days of rain and with the impending arrival the following day of another family with lots of kids (bless their hearts, don't get me wrong, I love kids) I said my goodbyes 3 days early and headed back to Michigan- land of LCD monitors, flush toilets and more guitars than anyone has a right to own.

 

 

Hey, I live up here. It's not so bad, and yes, my toilets do flush when you pull the handle. We even have power most of the time, except during last nights storms...lightning you could read by...

[Queequeg]

Dave, I love it up there. Forests of wild cherry trees, crystal clear lakes, beautiful mountains and rivers, abundant wildlife...

I'm just getting too old to rough it for days on end without a warm shower and indoor plumbing, no matter where it is.

No offense my friend.

[Glenn F]

I had to do an intensive week-end phys-ed canoe trip at Lake Saranac to graduate from CEGEP (junior college) in October one year. It rained (until we got on the bus to go home) and it was freezing. Like Calvin's father would say, 'it builds character.'

 

Lovely place, though.

[denvertrakker]

To get back to the original thread (All together, now...puuuuuulllll!):

 

Don's answer was so great and detailed I'm printing it out to save for future reference. That's the great thing about this forum...somebodyon here usually has the correct answer for everything!

 

And to wander back off, I always thought "roughing it" was a hotel without room service...

[Freeman Keller]

Here is one way to look at what Don has so eloquently said

 

 

"Action" is the intereaction of the string height at the nut (just high enought that a string doesn't hit the frets while it vibrates, "relief" or the curvature of the neck which allows the vibrating string to not touch the next fret, and the overall height above the fretboard, which we usually measure at the 12th fret but is really a measure of how hard we have to push the string down into that valley.

 

A good tech will ask you to play the guitar and will take some measurements before she starts working on it, and should show you what she is doing. As Don said, we each have our preferences, but a well set up guitar is a real joy to play. Enjoy your new 'gull - a great guitar.

[Bernie P.]

Dave,where abouts are you in CNY?I'm about 30 miles north of Utica just inside the park.