all your fault, or, thanks for nothing

[eor]

i finally got my photo posting issues out of the way, so eor can finally make this post.

 

a few weeks ago, eor had family over, who took the trouble to break my computer before they left. about $400 and two weeks later, i was back and better than ever.

 

eor had his eye on something for a few days before the puter went down. i had to borrow my brother's cell phone so i can seal the deal at work, but he didn't pay the bill and the service got disconnected that very morning. so i called him at home and he took care of it for me.

 

and since none of you were around to stop me from doing it, this is all your fault.

 

 

 

photos are sucks- i haven't sat around and photographed it since i've had it. but there it is. 1968 guild f-112.

 

love,

eor

[spruce goose]

Who is this "i" character you speak of? Is he related to eor?

[eor]

issues- well, it's apparent to me now, but wasn't listed in the auction, there's a crack in the top. the seam from the bottom to the bridge. and the bridge itself is cracked between the lower set of pins. there is a vauge buzzing while playing, i hope the bridge is the cause.

aside from that, its a little dingy, and the finish has a few spots where some kind of solvent ruined it on the side. guitar is very playable, but the action may be a touch high. not sure yet. strings need changing and the tuners are a little stiff.

and for what its worth, this is the most amazing guitar eor has ever heard. can't say whether its the wood, the age, the finsh or the workmanship or what, but it is. nothing i've played, regardless of age or value can win this guitar.

love,
eor

this guitar makes my fingertips sad

ps- i got this set up today, so if you'd like to see more photos, or some of my other guitars, try here: http://s4.photobucket.com/albums/y125/squeezenor/ i only have two of them up, but they are very pretty.

[babablowfish]

Good for you. She's a nice looking little guitar. The issues you mentioned - the seam, bridge and split top should all be fixable. A 40 year old Guild 12 string - not something you run across everyday!

[SkippyX]

...and since none of you were around to stop me from doing it, this is all your fault.

It wouldn't have mattered if you could have gotten online or not. These guys would have egged you on. I've a Guild on the stand behind me to prove it.

Happy NGD! She looks like a beaut!

[eor]

i went in knowing it would need a few things, and am perfectly willing to do it. for the price of the repair, i'd end up with something a million times better than what i can get new.

so what would you guys recommend?

-i hope to replace the bridge, so what material should i use?
-the nut and saddle appear to be a plastic of some kind, should i change them for bone?
-the pins are plastic, too. i like ebony, but is it "wrong" to make such changes on an older guitar like this?
-the split in the seam is cosmetic only, right?

love,
eor

suer, she's a little "plainer", for lack of a better term, that what's out there, but man, she's something. no inlays or fanciness anywhere. never buying a new guitar again.

[SkippyX]

suer, she's a little "plainer", for lack of a better term, that what's out there, but man, she's something. no inlays or fanciness anywhere. never buying a new guitar again.

 

 

Heck, the pins probably need to be changed. They're likely as old as the guitar. If you're worried about it, you could always keep the original pins in a box.

 

I don't have enough experience to offer a qualified opinion on the rest of your questions, but I couldn't help but respond to the last paragraph.

 

IMO, "plainer" is better. There's an inherent beauty to it. I find I'm much more attracted to something or someone that's a little more plain than something that's all tarted up. Form follows function. Anything beyond that is silly. To me.

 

I think that's true in most things. I like ladies that don't feel the need to pile their hair up high and apply the make-up w/ a putty knife. I don't date women that have had plastic surgery (aside from recontructive surgery). I think that's a sure sign of insecurity, and I'd rather be in a relationship with a secure, healthy woman that has sagging breasts than be in a relationship with a woman that is insecure but has had her boobs stuffed & lifted.

 

I like an old pick-up truck that gets me where I want to go comfortably. I don't feel the need to put on fancy wheels or dress it up w/ all kinds of plastic/fiberglass do-dads.

 

I don't wear jewelry.

 

You can cover up a turd w/ gold leaf - and it's still a turd. Give me quality - and if it's understated quality, 'tis even better.

 

Of course - as with all things - YMMV.

[MattSkibaIsGOD]

Congrats on a great looking guitar Eor.

[AndrewGG]

The seam split is structural and should be repaired; I would replace the bridge with a replica in the same wood as the original. Pins are consumables so I wouldn't worry about them unless they are looking especially chewed up at the bottom end; that might suggest the bridge plate is worn and needs replacing.
Nice guitar:thu:

[guitarist21]

-i hope to replace the bridge, so what material should i use? -the nut and saddle appear to be a plastic of some kind, should i change them for bone? -the pins are plastic, too. i like ebony, but is it "wrong" to make such changes on an older guitar like this? -the split in the seam is cosmetic only, right?

 

 

- The whole bridge? I don't know but I sure saw some nice looking rosewood ones in my latest Stew Mac catalog.

- Leave the nut unless it is damaged. Saddles are pretty easy to make yourself, so that one's up to you.

- Check out the Annex for some sound clips of pin changes and then decide what you like. Bone would probably be pretty nice. I don't think it's wrong to make a change on an older guitar if it is going to be one of your main players. If its just for eye candy, leave it. Otherwise, change away.

- This "crack" of which you speak... from the pics it looks like it is just the joint between the two pieces of the bookmatched top, right? Or is there actually a crack somewhere that I'm not getting?

 

Ellen

[Terry Allan Hall]

Nice, eor!

[Samilyn]

Congrats on such a great find!! Truly a beauty!!

Rosewood bridges are nice and so is ebony. I do tend to lean toward ebony for both bridges and pins. I've heard a couple of 12-ers with bone pins and they sounded okay - definitely brighter than with wood pins. (Have to be careful with too much brightness in a 12-er or the higher octave strings can sound downright twangy. yuk.)

Of course, that's all highly subjective and a matter of personal taste. For what it's worth, I'm one of the few on this forum that routinely plays Silk & Steel strings and my taste leans towards "soft, warm and mellow."

[T.B.]

Congrats eor, a New Jersey 12 string at that. I would only replace parts on that Guild if they were damage or no longer functional. By all means replace the saddle with bone, if the tuners are funky/stripped, yep. Some nice bridge pins/end pin would be a nice touch though. (IMHO)

http://www.13thfret.com/bridge-pins.html

Trina

[JerseyGuy]

I am so jealous -- Guild 12s are absolute cannons.

As for the crack, take the beauty into a dark room -- no, this is not going to be that kind of post -- put a small flashlight into the sound box and see if the light comes through the crack. If it does, it's more than just a hairline. My local luthier tells me that cracks from the bridge to the bottom are usually not a big problem, and won't affect the quality of the sound, but with temp and humidity changes they can get worse. You should also do an inspection with a flashlight and a mirror to see if the same conditions that did the crack also loosened any braces, and check to see if the bridge is lifting from the back (can you slip a piece of paper under it, even for just a small stretch?). There's so much stress on 12s these might have happened, too. But all eminently fixable, and while I might try it on a 6 (I've done this on a Parkwood), I don't think I'd do it myself on a 12, let alone such a prize as this one.
Good luck -- or have you already exhausted your luck by just getting this? I am so jealous.

[Freeman Keller]

i went in knowing it would need a few things, and am perfectly willing to do it. for the price of the repair, i'd end up with something a million times better than what i can get new. so what would you guys recommend? -i hope to replace the bridge, so what material should i use? -the nut and saddle appear to be a plastic of some kind, should i change them for bone? -the pins are plastic, too. i like ebony, but is it "wrong" to make such changes on an older guitar like this? -the split in the seam is cosmetic only, right? love, eor suer, she's a little "plainer", for lack of a better term, that what's out there, but man, she's something. no inlays or fanciness anywhere. never buying a new guitar again.

 

 

- Replacing the bridge will be a bitch. Don't do it if it isn't necessary. You will have to have one custom made to fit, position and clamping are critical - not a do it yourself project. If you do replace it I would personally match the fretboard - ebony or rose depending on what you have.

 

- Changing both nut and saddle can be worthwhile if they need it, but again, not just a do it yourself home project - particularly on a 12. Measure the nut slots carefully and maybe do a good setup here. When I made the saddle for my 12 string I put about 6 hours into getting the compensation right (but then I'm not a pro so it went pretty slowly).

 

- Listen to the pin test. Same things apply to a 12 that do to a 6 (only twice as much). You will need two sets of whatever you put in. This would be a good time to make sure they are properly tapered and ramped - particularly the back set. I run plastic in my Martin 12, bone in my home made one.

 

- Maybe right, but could also be some minor or serious damage. As you know, this is probably a fault of the guitar being too dry. It may have other low humidity damage too. At the least check for loose X brace and tone bars, consider cleating the crack. If you are going to replace the bridge you will be clamping inside the git anyway so make sure everything is sound inside.

 

The one thing you didn't mention is the neck angle - I assume it is OK. Go carefully with the dual truss rods when trying to set it up - I've been told to take a lot of measurements and make the changes a little at a time (I've never done a dual rod Guild). Should be a fun git.

[eor]

ok, i took a few more photos with my cell phone.

pretty headstock



string height at 12th fret (markers obscured by flash)



cracked bridge and seam- shows severity of bridge crack, which connects the bottom six pins, but doesn't extend any further.



tried the flashlight in the dark; no light showing through crack in top. maybe i did it wrong? and see the two little nubs on the bridge? i was able to get a sheet of paper under either one to just before where the nubs meet the bridge, but not at all in the large center part.

how could eor accurately determine/depict the neck angle?

and mind you, i have no intention of doing any of the work eorself. hell, i'd let someone else change the strings if i could. not sure if the nut/saddle/string need replacing, just figured i would if all that other stuff was getting done. i want to super maximize the guitar's potential. and the plastic looks cheesy.

as it stands, the guitar is tuned a whole step down, just like all the rest of mine. like it. (relatively) playable; too soon to attribute any difficulties to the guitar.

trina, i will study your link, but i'm 72% sure i'm an ebony guy. and sammy, you are all alone on the silk and steels. for reallys. and mind you jerseyguy, this is their om size, not the jumbo. have yet to stage loudness wars against other guitars yet.

love,
eor

ps- fixed the link in the first post so now you guys can see all my photos. removed the password thing.

[eor]

update: talked to (didn't go see him, just talked on phone) eor's guitar guy and he said:

-the buzz/rattle may just be a string that isn't properly seated and the ball end is causing the noise.

-the bridge crack and seam split don't sound life threatening

-a bone saddle may be nice. nut, not as important.

-the bridge lifting is fine. as in, if it is lifting, we want it to lift. it makes the repair easier and cleaner. if it stays, it stays.

at any rate, i'm going to start shopping around for parts for this (maybe ust the saddle) and another guitar and then i'll go visit him and get the official word. he'll also do a little setup and string change and what not.

love,
eor

[babablowfish]

Cool. Keep us posted. That is a real nice guitar.

[lauren]

looker eor.

[JerseyGuy]

Yes, please keep us posted. I'd also be interested in how it sounds compared to a jumbo Guild.