Jump to content

Zager ZAD-50 OM Acoustic


TESmith

Recommended Posts

  • Members
It's funny that he would need to modify ANYTHING on the guitars being built with his name on the headstock. You would think it would be much cheaper to have the magic "String Science" (lowered action, flat frets and wider string spacing) performed in the overseas plant prior to shipping.


Sigma guitars are all advertised with scalloped braces. I guess he must scallop the scallops.....
:freak:



You would think Martin would throw a set up on their guitars too, but they don't.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 245
  • Created
  • Last Reply
  • Members

 

You would think Martin would throw a set up on their guitars too, but they don't.

 

 

How do you Martin doesn't do a set up on their guitars? Please tell us.

 

(How do you like the question in bold print? Pretty stupid, huh?)

 

Every decent guitar gets a factory set up before shipping. My $229 Alvarez came with a handwritten inspection card after it was set up at the factory.

 

The factory set up may work for some folks, but others may prefer higher action or lower action.

 

Martin sets up their guitars for bluegrass players. Therefore, they come with medium-high action. Taylor guitars come with fairly low action. They tend to be marketed more to fingerstyle players.

 

I don't know why you are arguing about a subject you seem to know very little about.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Thread Summary:
Hudman says Zager is overpricing his set up, yet can't articulate what exactly Zager does to modify the guitars 'cause he doesn't have one (and hasn't seen it done), and that you are getting a $200 guitar, yet, he can't supply any evidence that the Sigma solid tops are or were selling new at this price = talking out the ass.

OGP loves to talk about his $150 Sigma, but it was bought used, is NOT a solid top and thus has no bearing on the topic guitar of this thread.

Posters who like their Zagers are ignorant hicks who don't know any better or "what a set up is" and should play their Zager in good health, but realize they are making music on an inferior guitar, because we "experts" who play overpriced big name guitars know better.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Thread Summary:

Hudman says Zager is overpricing his set up, yet can't articulate what exactly Zager does to modify the guitars 'cause he doesn't have one (and hasn't seen it done), and that you are getting a $200 guitar, yet, he can't supply any evidence that the Sigma solid tops are or were selling new at this price = talking out the ass.


OGP loves to talk about his $150 Sigma, but it was bought used, is NOT a solid top and thus has no bearing on the topic guitar of this thread.


Posters who like their Zagers are ignorant hicks who don't know any better or "what a set up is" and should play their Zager in good health, but realize they are making music on an inferior guitar, because we "experts" who play overpriced big name guitars know better.

 

Summary:

valentsgrif has trouble following a simple post. He is a very bitter and angry individual that knows nothing about setting a guitar up. He believes in Denny Zager's magic "String Science". He hates "big names".

 

Guitar Hack loves BOLD print and asking dumb questions. He is another angry Zager owner.

 

valentsgrif and Guitar Hack LOVE their Zager guitars. They want the forum to love Zager guitars too. valentsgrif is becoming very obsessed with Hudman.

 

Hudman is VERY happy they love their Zager guitars. Hudman thinks Zager / Sigma guitars are good but that Denny charges too much for the "String Science". Hudman knows "String Science" is a set up with wider string spacing at the nut. Hudman knows this because he can READ. Hudman knows any guitar tech can perform "String Science". Hudman isn't interested in buying a Zager.

 

Hudman doesn't own any overpriced, big name guitars.

 

 

 

:thu:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Thread Summary:

Hudman says Zager is overpricing his set up, yet can't articulate what exactly Zager does to modify the guitars 'cause he doesn't have one (and hasn't seen it done), and that you are getting a $200 guitar, yet, he can't supply any evidence that the Sigma solid tops are or were selling new at this price = talking out the ass.


OGP loves to talk about his $150 Sigma, but it was bought used, is NOT a solid top and thus has no bearing on the topic guitar of this thread.


Posters who like their Zagers are ignorant hicks who don't know any better or "what a set up is" and should play their Zager in good health, but realize they are making music on an inferior guitar, because we "experts" who play overpriced big name guitars know better.

 

 

this summary may be a bit more accurate-

 

some 'new' folk's stop into a forum and ask the collectives opinion of a specific brand/type of guitar. the collective answers as they always have in the past. the people who asked the question proceed to insult and argue with the very people they asked for the opinions of.

 

we have seen photo's of a 'zagerized' guitar that clearly illustrate poor workmanship and poor practices. perhaps you could post some pictures of you instrument, it might prove enlightening for us all.

 

this forum collectively should be considered an "expert" source of information. if you were to add up the years of experinience shared by all the regulars in here is would be staggering. yet most all of them are humble to the point of self deprecation at times.

 

and not all of us play "overpriced big name guitar's", heck, i have an $89.00 rogue 12 string, an old 30's no name parlor guitar my dad rebuilt from a crushed basket case, and a surf city les paul knock off... far from expensive or over priced... in fact less total than a single Zager...

 

several member's actually build their own guitar's from the ground up.

 

why not just call this horse beat... in the end the instruments are but a tool that is used to channel tones and feelings. be it expensive or cheap... it's all the same. i dare say some of the greatest guitar music ever known was played on the cheapest guitars ever built.

 

the forum tends to have fun with zager and esteban only because from time to time they pop up in here and the outcome is usually the same... deja vu all over again. at the same time this is all volunteer- people taking their time to try and help other's pursue a goal. to get offended if you don't get a reply you appreciate or understand is poor form.

 

as many have said already- let's get past this and play some tunes...

 

now i have lot's of CAD design to get back to on this lovely saturday night...8^) later-

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I'm going to go ahead and agree with everything that Hud and Knock have said in their posts on this thread. The base guitar that Zager sells is a decent entry level instrument. No one is saying they are absolute crap. And the "string science" consists of nothing more than adjustments I can have done to any guitar at my local shop for around $50 (and to my exact preference there as well).

 

I think it is very important to let new players in the market for a new acoustic know about these FACTS before they go and purchase a guitar. Knowledge is power, maybe some of the angry Zager owners should study up a little on acoustic guitars instead of just blindly defending their purchases.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

OOOOHHHHH. Hudman can read therefore he knows how a Zager guitar is altered???? but so far you havan't provided facts such as

1) how you know (other than you read something) (not played, not observed it being Zagerized, not looked at Zagers patent, nothing) what is done to the guitars,

2) Havn't supplied the list of manufacturers whose written warranty will honor a warranty on an guitar with a replaced nut, filed frets and altered bridge.

3)havn't supplied the lists of sellers dealing $200 new ST Sigma's that you base your "overpriced" opinion on.

I am not obsessed with Hudman, only amused at how many poor souls may have been tainted with his talking out the ass expert opinions in his previous 6,000 posts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Hey valentsgrif.... Just for the sake of my curiosity, how many acoustic guitars have you owned in your lifetime? And have you ever payed a local tech or luthier to perform a setup on any of them?

 

I suspect the answers to those questions will be that you haven't owned many acoustics and that you've never had a qualified tech or luthier set up an acoustic to your exact playing preferences.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Have owned three acoustics, going back 30 years. Did my own set up on my 2nd, a Yamaha (lowered bridge is all it needed).

I suspect you assume that all Zager players are ignorant hicks that bought the guitars not knowing any better.

I bought the guitar after reading the advertising on line, became interested in Zager as an electric player whose strats have always been set low, and wanted to see if the guitar is what it says it is. It was no risk on my part because if it sucked I intended to send it back.

It didn't suck. I'm not on their payroll. I'm just a bemused forumite who finds it fun to gore a few sacred ox's on here, notably, those offering opinions on guitars based on information they "read somewhere", or on limited trials of somone elses singular used or unsatisfactory guitar.

Havn't had a need to pay a luthier to set up an acoustic, but have spent a few dollars paying techs to set up my electrics, with very mixed results.
The idea of buying a $300-$400 new acoustic and turning it over to a tech, who may, or may not get it playing right so close to the edge, made me nervous. Letting Zager do it, and retaining the warranty and the option of sending it back, just made the "expense" a reasonable fee for peace of mind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Have owned three acoustics, going back 30 years. Did my own set up on my 2nd, a Yamaha (lowered bridge is all it needed).


I suspect you assume that all Zager players are ignorant hicks that bought the guitars not knowing any better.


I bought the guitar after reading the advertising on line, became interested in Zager as an electric player whose strats have always been set low, and wanted to see if the guitar is what it says it is. It was no risk on my part because if it sucked I intended to send it back.


It didn't suck. I'm not on their payroll. I'm just a bemused forumite who finds it fun to gore a few sacred ox's on here, notably, those offering opinions on guitars based on information they "read somewhere", or on limited trials of somone elses singular used or unsatisfactory guitar.

 

First of all, if you knew much about acoustic guitars you would stop referring to the "saddle" as the "bridge". Second of all, you admit you are an electric player who has only owned three acoustics over 30 years. Most of us here have owned quite a few acoustics and primarily play acoustic guitars (the type of folks I would trust if I was a new acoustic player looking to purchase a guitar).

 

I've owned guitars made by Alvarez, Yamaha, Fender, Takamine, Ovation, Seagull, Washburn, Guild, and probably a few others I can't remember. I've had all of them set up by local techs for $50 or under and anyone who has played them has raved about how easily they play. And someone who actually knows a little about acoustics doesn't need to get within 100 miles of a Zager to know that the "string science" is overpriced, overrated, and downright deceptive. For a fair market price I wouldn't have a problem with them at all.

 

And I don't believe that everyone that buys a Zager is an ignorant hick. I believe that a large portion of them are new to acoustics and had they recieved honest and correct information about acoustic guitars they would have made a better decision.

 

Oh yeah, just because I'm a nice guy I'll go ahead and teach you a little something....

 

D03_bridge.jpg

 

Brown part bridge, white part saddle. The saddle gets the adjustment, not the bridge. If a saddle is so low that it can't be lowered any more the guitar needs a neck reset not the bridge lowered. This is something that is usually only needed every 20-30 years or so.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I guess every thing comes down to price.
I live in the suburbs of New York City. The equivalent set up and nut replacement, fret work etc here on an acoustic averagsis about $125, including new strings. Once the nut/bridge of the guitar is altered, the manufacuture's warranty is over.
I wanted a ultra low action: I know what I wanted and got it with little risk. No one has proven anything so far here regarding anything being overpriced.
You makes your choices, but like I said before, how much "overprice" is bulit into the Martins and Gibson's sold everyday? I bet it far exceeds the $75 or so that Zager arguabley gets as a premium.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Well, a new guitar shouldn't need a new nut or any severe fret work, so that price would come down at least $50. If you want wider string spacing, just buy a guitar that comes with a wider nut width.... And like I've said quite a few times before, no one is altering the "bridge" and no alterations to the saddle or nut void the warranty of any quality acoustic (you keep calling for us to show you where it doesn't, how about you show us all the warranties out there that you are so sure state that simple set up adjustments void the warranty...)

 

And as for price.... I can get a brand spankin' new Yamaha FS-700s with a solid top/lam back and sides for around $200 just about anywhere in the country. Most of those shops will include the set-up exactly to the players specs for free with purchase. So that makes $200 for the brand new yammie with local store customer service vs. $495 for the cheapest Zager out there. I could sure do a lot with the extra $300. And even if the store charged a ridiculous $100 for the setup I'd still be ahead $200 and have a guitar that most people consider far superior to the Sigmas that Denny is hawking. I'd call that a good case for them being overpriced.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

FWIW, I just checked the warranties on both the Yammie I mentioned in my previous post as well as the Guild that I own. Neither one states that work on the nut, saddle, or frets will void the warranty. In fact, the warranty on my Guild states that that nut wear, saddle wear, and fret wear are not under warranty as they are items that will wear and require maintenance or replacement at some point; therefore directly stating that it is expected that they would be adjusted by a qualified tech or luthier.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

FWIW, I just checked the warranties on both the Yammie I mentioned in my previous post as well as the Guild that I own. Neither one states that work on the nut, saddle, or frets will void the warranty. In fact, the warranty on my Guild states that that nut wear, saddle wear, and fret wear are not under warranty as they are items that will wear and
require maintenance or replacement
at some point; therefore directly stating that it is expected that they would be adjusted by a qualified tech or luthier.

 

 

You are wasting your time talking to valentsgrif.

 

He believes Zager has a patent on wider string spacing and low action. It seems like Zager owners believe Zager performs a procedure to guitars that no one else can do. It appears that the guitars are being marketed to players that are unfamiliar with the mechanics behind basic guitar set up work. One of the new Zager owners here asked what a set up was AFTER he recieved his $750 ZAD 80. http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1886196

 

Zager didn't invent basic luthiery skills. Guitars were around and worked on long before he invented "string science".

 

No one will ever convince me that an after market set up should add $150 -$200 (ZAD 50) or $250 - $350 (ZAD 80) to the price of a new guitar. valentsgrif claims that the set up cost is built in to the price of Martin guitars. He is correct. EVERY guitar company performs a set up on their guitars to factory spec prior to shipping (including Martin owned Sigma that Denny sets up with low action). It is in the price of the guitar (they paid their employees to perform the work).

 

Having your nut, frets and saddle worked on will not void your warranty. That is pure BS. They are wear items not covered under warranty. They have nothing to do with the structural integrity of the guitar. Every guitar will require some nut, fret and or saddle work in the future.

 

There are two issues being confussed in the Zager threads: The quality of the guitars and the value of the procedure perfomed on the guitars. I never said anything bad about Sigma or Zager guitars. I don't have to play one to know how much a set up should cost. Why? I actually know what is involved in the set up process. My guitars are set up precisely to fit my playing style. My Alvarez plays just as smooth and easy as my Larrivee. They sound completely different, but they have equal playability for me.

 

I believe a person is better off having their guitars set up to their own playing style and comfort level. Why buy a guitar set up to play for Denny Zager. Why not buy a guitar and have it set it up to fit your playing style? I will take it a step further: I think every acoustic guitar player should learn how to perform their own set up work. It's not difficult.

 

The Zager route worked for valentsgrif and Guitar Hack. I am happy for them. Why did it work? They like the same ultra low action Zager likes and they were comfortable with the price they paid for it. Unfortunately, ultra low action will not work for everyone.

 

Honestly, I don't know why Zager owners are worried about my opinion. It's their money.

 

 

Back to my constantly ignored question:

Why don't the headstock and label thumbnail pictures of the Martin DM on Zager's website enlarge when you click on them? They are the only pictures that won't give you the option to enlarge? I would love to hear an answer from a Zager owner. Go here and try it if you think I'm lying:

http://www.zagerguitar.com/index.php?event=public.guitars.models&model=dm1&id=19

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
1) Right smack on the front page of his "EZ-Play Guitars" page, the two guitars AT THE TOP of the list of guitars he is selling are listed as "Martin DM Acoustic," under a bolded header in large print reading, "Martin."

That is deceptive.

 

It appears to me that all the stock of Martin Sigmas are not yet exhausted. You will note in the first line of the first paragraph after the title it says "Sigma" (which is a division of Martin) This ain't rocket science. However you can find an evil motive everywhere if you look.

 

THis is from the Martin Web Site http://www.sigmaguitars.com/

 

Sigma Guitars

 

* From 1970 to 2007, Sigma Guitars, a division of C.F. Martin, provided players with an affordable option in tradition and value

* Sigma Guitars were based primarily on original Martin

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

You are wasting your time talking to valentsgrif.



Zager didn't invent basic luthiery skills. Guitars were around and worked on long before he invented "string science".


From the web site: "EZ-Play" Guitars are modified by Master Guitar Luthier Denny Zager to play easier than any other guitar made. The EZ-Play modification process involves:


* Lowering the strings closer to the fret board so you no longer have to press hard to form a chord.

* Adjusting the string spacing so there is more room for your fingers which enhances speed and reduces buzzes and rattles.

* Modifying the bracing, bridge, and saddle in harmony to amplify the tone and resonance.



No one will ever convince me that an after market set up should add $150 -$200 (ZAD 50) or $250 - $350 (ZAD 80) to the price of a new guitar. valentsgrif claims that the set up cost is built in to the price of Martin guitars. He is correct. EVERY guitar company performs a set up on their guitars to factory spec prior to shipping (including Martin owned Sigma that Denny sets up with low action). It is in the price of the guitar (they paid their employees to perform the work).


THis statement is just wrong. Most guitar companies do
not
put much of a set up on a guitar they sell. Some Takamine's come that way. I have a Martin D-15 Custom and it needed a set up because the action was too high. All you're going to get from the factory is a very basic at best. Wide spaced nut and work on the bracing ain't gonna get done. Those are custom things.


Having your nut, frets and saddle worked on will not void your warranty. That is pure BS. They are wear items not covered under warranty. They have nothing to do with the structural integrity of the guitar. Every guitar will require some nut, fret and or saddle work in the future.


Where did that come from?


There are two issues being confused in the Zager threads: The quality of the guitars and the value of the procedure perfomed on the guitars. I never said anything bad about Sigma or Zager guitars. I don't have to play one to know how much a set up should cost. Why? I actually know what is involved in the set up process. My guitars are set up precisely to fit my playing style. My Alvarez plays just as smooth and easy as my Larrivee. They sound completely different, but they have equal playability for me.


Sigma and Zager guitars are not the same. Putting on a custom nut will cost you $50-75.00 depending on the material used can be much higher. Making sure your frets are level can cost another $50.00. A basic set up can cost another $50. Having the braces modified probably can't be done by a tech and would probably cost $50 to $100 (I'm speculating on this one). I know these prices because I just had it done on another guitar that came from the factory without a set up. The only speculation is on the modification of the bracing and that is a conservative estimate.


I believe a person is better off having their guitars set up to their own playing style and comfort level. Why buy a guitar set up to play for Denny Zager. Why not buy a guitar and have it set it up to fit your playing style? I will take it a step further: I think every acoustic guitar player should learn how to perform their own set up work. It's not difficult.


As with every guitar you can have it set up to your personal preferences


The Zager route worked for valentsgrif and Guitar Hack. I am happy for them. Why did it work? They like the same ultra low action Zager likes and they were comfortable with the price they paid for it. Unfortunately, ultra low action will not work for everyone.


I lowered my action a little bit because of my personal preference.


Honestly, I don't know why Zager owners are worried about my opinion. It's their money.


Back to my constantly ignored question:

Why don't the headstock and label thumbnail pictures of the Martin DM on Zager's website enlarge when you click on them? They are the only pictures that won't give you the option to enlarge? I would love to hear an answer from a Zager owner. Go here and try it if you think I'm lying:



Thats what is commonly known as a "broken link". Or perhaps he has a nefarious motive. He want's to hide the fact that this is in fact a Sigma (subdivision of Martin) DM model and want's you to think it is a Zager guitar and he is putting in words like
"Denny likes the Martin Sigma series because it offers you the quality and patented design characteristics of Martins higher end instruments (costing several thousand dollars) for a fraction of the price"
just to throw you off from his evil purpose. Maybe he wants to date your sister? Who knows but we all know it's evil because his name is Zager and it starts with the last letter of the alphabet and we all know what Alpha and Omega, means beginning and end. So "Z" being the end must mean it is of Satan. Oops Marxist's don't believe in that stuff.


Or its just a broken link.

 

 

See response within the quote above in bold

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Hey, GuitarHack, if you talk to most people here, they think those are overpriced also. As for me, I do not own any big name, expensive guitars, but I still think Zagers are overpriced. We cannot change your opinion, so why try to change ours? One of the advice we give everyone is to play the guitars you are curious about and then decide, if you are happy with it, more power to you. But, you need to realize attacking and insulting people is not going to change our opinions about a product. That is marketing 101

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

See response within the quote above in bold

 

In response to your nonsense above:

 

You don't know what you are talking about, yet you continue to ramble on.

 

Every decent guitar gets a factory set up prior to being shipped. You are badly mistaken if you think Martin or Takemine didn't perform a factory spec set up on your guitar prior to shipping. It is obvious you have no clue about what happens when a guitar is built. My $220 Alvarez came with the set up specs and inspection card with the measurements handwritten and it intialized by the person that performed the work.

 

You are confusing having a guitar set up for you verses a guitar set up to factory specs. There are many players that are perfectly happy with the factory spec set up on their guitars. My buddy plays bluegrass. He loves the stock action on his Martin HD-28. It's too high for me, but it works for him. He would never consider lowering the action. He's been playing guitar for 35 years.

 

Your Zager nut didn't cost $50 - $75 unless the price of plastic went up. That guitar came from the plant built to Denny's specs. He didn't have to replace the nut.

 

Why would you need to have your Zager set up after paying a ton of money for a String Science set up? You proved my point by admitting you lowered your action after you got it. :freak:

 

There is no "broken link" on the link I gave you. It's obvious you didn't even look at it.

 

You need to actually look into something prior to defending it. You would look a little smarter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

Hey, GuitarHack, if you talk to most people here, they think those are overpriced also. As for me, I do not own any big name, expensive guitars, but I still think Zagers are overpriced. We cannot change your opinion, so why try to change ours? One of the advice we give everyone is to play the guitars you are curious about and then decide, if you are happy with it, more power to you. But, you need to realize attacking and insulting people is not going to change our opinions about a product. That is marketing 101

 

 

He needs to work on his sales technique. He should start by learning something about guitars.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 

1)


By the way take a look at Musicians Friend at the Martin DM which replaces the Sigma and you will note that it sells for $899.00. That means at your friendly brick and morter store It's going to cost over a $1000. Thats with Mahogany (laminate) back and sides. The Zad 80 has rosewood laminate back and sides and sells for $745 right now. Rosewood is more expensive. Perhaps Martin has gotten a clue from Zager that a laminate guitar done right will have great sound which allows them them to raise the price. Quality has it's advantages.


Perhaps Zagers aren't overpriced after all. Compared to the Martin DM they're a bargain.

 

 

Do you ever get anything right? I love your constant use of speculation as fact.

 

The Martin DM has been around for years (there are reviews on the HC Review page dating back to 1998). It didn't replace the Sigma DM. Zager has been calling those Sigma DM guitars "Martin DM" guitars since 2004 on Ebay. He was using the "Martin DM" name to help sell his guitars.

 

CF Martin owns Martin and Sigma but they are two seperate brands.

 

GM owns Hummer. Does that make a Trailblazer equal to a Hummer?

 

You are hilarious.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

In response to your nonsense above:


You don't know what you are talking about, yet you continue to ramble on.


Every decent guitar gets a factory set up prior to being shipped. You are badly mistaken if you think Martin or Takemine didn't perform a factory spec set up on your guitar prior to shipping. It is obvious you have no clue about what happens when a guitar is built. My $220 Alvarez came with the set up specs and inspection card with the measurements handwritten and it intialized by the person that performed the work.


I said most only give you a rudimentary set up. I said some do ie Takamine on some models. the $50-75 is for someone to do the custom work that is on a Zager. You will note your Alvarez does not have the wider spaced nut because it is not "custom". From the factory you get one size fits all. Granted that is a factory from Zager but no one else does that.


You are confusing having a guitar set up for you verses a guitar set up to factory specs. There are many players that are perfectly happy with the factory spec set up on their guitars. My buddy plays bluegrass. He loves the stock action on his Martin HD-28. It's too high for me, but it works for him. He would never consider lowering the action. He's been playing guitar for 35 years.


The HD-28 cost $2500. Most of the higher priced guitars are set up


Your Zager nut didn't cost $50 - $75 unless the price of plastic went up. That guitar came from the plant built to Denny's specs. He didn't have to replace the nut.


The 50-75 cost is for tech time only and doesn't include the cost of the nut. Zager uses corian for the nut which isn't the cheap plastic on your $200 Alvarez. Some people prefer fossilized Walrus Ivory. That can cost you over $100 just for the nut.


Why would you need to have your Zager set up after paying a ton of money for a String Science set up? You proved my point by admitting you lowered your action after you got it.
:freak:

Well you see in the world of guitar playing different people have different preferences. I just like lower action. So I went out and did what I would do on every guitar I own and get it set up precisely the way I like it. If you aren't doing likewise you are settling for mediocrity.


There is no "broken link" on the link I gave you. It's obvious you didn't even look at it.


I did and there is a thumb of the headstock on the Sigma on the board. But click on it and it sends you to something else. That's called a "broken link". A broken link is one that doesn't send you to where it's supposed too.


You need to actually look into something prior to defending it. You would look a little smarter.

 

I did. You need to stop supporting positions you are unfamiliar with and about which you have no knowledge.

 

Everything you've said is of little value because you still haven't played one yet you opine many things.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

 


Do you ever get anything right? I love your constant use of speculation as fact.
I could ask you the same and be more accurate but I won't as it violates the posting rules.


When I make a mistake I admit it. I have pointed out many you have made but you don't admit them. You see I have actually played a Zager and I have played a Martin D-15 custom and when I said the D-15 needed a set up I was right. The action was way too high. I've also played a Martin D-28 and it has nothing on the Zager Zad-80.


The Martin DM has been around for years (there are reviews on the HC Review page dating back to 1998). It didn't replace the Sigma DM. Zager has been calling those Sigma DM guitars "Martin DM" guitars since 2004 on Ebay. He was using the "Martin DM" name to help sell his guitars.


I stand corrected with regard to the Martin DM replacing the Sigma DM. However the comments about the Martin DM being overpriced stand as they use cheaper wood and charge more. In fact the Martin DM is comparable to the Zager Zad50 which is $500 not $900.00. How does that make the Zager overpriced and the Martin not?


CF Martin owns Martin and Sigma but they are two seperate brands.


You'll note on the head stock of a Sigma it says Sigma by Martin.


GM owns Hummer. Does that make a Trailblazer equal to a Hummer?


No and it doesn't make a Martin Sigma a Zager. Nor does it make a Malibu an Impala


You are hilarious.

 

 

Come up with some facts you can substantiate rather than spew speculation and innuendo.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


×
×
  • Create New...