Dylan Busted!

[knockwood]

It's none of his business what I am doing, sitting there in my truck, gazing at the sunset.

It is if you have beard, freak.

[JasmineTea]

I think everyone should be required to carry a .45, a quart of wisky, and plenty of tobacco at all times.

Think of all the problems this could solve.

[SkippyX]

I don't drink (had my fill a few years ago). I don't own a gun (no need for one).

I do smoke, though, so I got the tobacco part covered!

[guildfire]

Not anymore. Ever heard of road blocks? A few months ago, I was at the local lake, taking in the sunset. Hell, I'm a songwriter, it was a poetic moment. I have lived in this very small town my entire life. A city policeman came up to me and asked for identification. I said On what grounds? Because I asked you, was his reply. You look suspicious. My gosh, I was just sitting there in my truck, minding my own business. You guys who don't see anything wrong with this, I disagree. The police state is getting closer, this is ridiculous. It's none of his business what I am doing, sitting there in my truck, gazing at the sunset.

 

 

I agree with you, but some on here don't see it that way. If you look "suspicious" to a cop, then you are subject to whatever he/she says and tells you to do. You keep your mouth shut unless spoken to, show your I.D. and answer "yes officer, no officer" to any questions. If you question their authority and you will be deemed to have an "attitude" and your fate will only get worse. Sorry to say that's the way it is now.

[SkippyX]

I agree with you, but some on here don't see it that way. If you look "suspicious" to a cop, then you are subject to whatever he/she says and tells you to do. You keep your mouth shut unless spoken to, show your I.D. and answer "yes officer, no officer" to any questions. If you question their authority and you will be deemed to have an "attitude" and your fate will only get worse. Sorry to say that's the way it is now.

 

 

Trut.

 

They have a badge, a gun, a nightstick, a taser and chemical weapons AND the right to use them any time they'd care to, so long as they can (cough) um...justify...their actions.

 

You're gonna mind.

[T.B.]

What freaks me out about this is not that a couple of kids didn't recognize Dylan, but when the {censored} did it become illegal to take a walk?

Thank you.

[fretmonster]

So you don't think some poor old scruffy looking dude like Bob or some other "profiled" type person wandering around Beverly Hills or some other "upscale" neighborhood would not get the same treatment as Bob did?

 

 

So when was the last time you went to Beverly Hills? Hell everybody looks like Dylan down there. He may be scruffy but he sure as hell doesn't look like a vagrant, least ways the ones I've seen. I didn't see where his clothes were tattered and he smelled like puke and piss. Anyway, I would at least hope to assume that he might be recognized in an upscale neighborhood.

[fretmonster]

I disagree 100%. A scruffy looking person would be far more likely to get picked up by the police in an upscale neighborhood. Cops are too busy dealing with real crime in rough neighborhoods to worry about scruffy looking people wandering around. Besides, there are TONS of scruffy looking folks wandering around rough neighborhoods.

Well OK then, we agree to disagree. Please refer to last post.

[fretmonster]

There you go. Now we can call it following a good police instinct. Fact is call it what you will, there will always be a tension between freedom and safety.

Exactly. I take two paragraphs and you cut right to the meat of it. Well said.

[flemtone]

I'll stay out of this debate - except to post this Public Service Announcement:

[YOUTUBE]uj0mtxXEGE8[/YOUTUBE]

[Ohioarrow]

I'll stay out of this debate - except to post this Public Service Announcement:

That was good.

[rhancox]

I am quite surprised that this thread has grown to 7 pages and 130+ posts. I hadn't even bothered to read it after it reached it's second page. Quite the interesting arguments though.

FWIW, here's my 2 cents...

First, the cops were only doing what was asked of them. Some scraggily looking guy walks up on my lawn and is checking out my house is going to be looked at suspiciously. Personally, I probably would have gone outside to see what he wants. Since it was raining, I think I'd have just watched him to see what he would do next. If he looked and moved on, then no harm no foul.

However, the cops were called. They come out, as they should. Maybe they could have just watched him instead of stopping him. But since they stopped him, I thought they handled it with extreme restraint. In the end, I see no huge problem with it. Not like the Harvard professor story.

Now, do I want a cop bothering me while I'm looking at a sunset? No. And I don't like the "because I asked" response to questioning the ID request. But in today's world, as a cop, you never know what you're going to encounter. It's not excusing extreme behavior, but to some degree, you can't blame the cops for some of their reactions to certain situations.

Consider the following...

If you live in a small town of, say, 500 people, if you know 100 people, you know 20% of the population. If you know 100 people where you live, it's less than 1% in most cases. I live in a city of 1.4 million. If I know 100 people that's .00007% of the population. The point is, the more people I know within the population, the more trusting I will be of people I don't know. When I barely know a handful of people out of the whole city, I will be more on guard with people I don't know.

If someone approaches me in the supermarket parking lot saying they need a couple dollars because they ran out of gas, I'm skeptical at first. If I lived in a small town, I probably wouldn't even bat an eye.

We have the death penalty, and other harsh penalties, to try to deter crime. Consider this, if you knew you had a 1 in 100 chance of actually getting caught compared to an even chance you'd get convicted if you were caught, which odds look better? Penalties don't deter because there's a better chance you won't even get caught. The point here being, there aren't enough cops, by half, to stop a fraction of the crime that takes place. There is so much crime, and so many people, the cops don't know who to trust.

Put yourself in their shoes. Again, it doesn't excuse all their behavior, but my guess is, a number of people here would look like Don Knotts if they had to encounter half of what cops encounter everyday. I know I would.

[knockwood]

I thought they handled it with extreme restraint.

 

 

Absolutely. Usually, if you ask a perp his name, and he sasses you by actually telling you, what you do is club him to death. IMO he should at least have been tasered a few times. Once the law has been called in, it's not like they can let some perp just continue taking a stroll.

 

I wonder how all these bleeding hearts would be reacting if we all woke up to the headline, BOB DYLAN SLAUGHTERS ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD WHILE DRESSED IN DARK SWEATSHIRT.

 

Thank God they got him in time. THIS time.

[rhancox]

Absolutely. Usually, if you ask a perp his name, and he sasses you by actually telling you, what you do is club him to death. IMO he should at least have been tasered a few times. Once the law has been called in, it's not like they can let some perp just continue taking a stroll. I wonder how all these bleeding hearts would be reacting if we all woke up to the headline, BOB DYLAN SLAUGHTERS ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD WHILE DRESSED IN DARK SWEATSHIRT. Thank God they got him in time. THIS time.

 

 

Well, if he tells you his name right off, then he must be lying.

 

Would you like one lump or two?

 

 

A car slows down at a stop sign and keeps driving. A cop sees him and pulls him over. The cop asks, "Why didn't you stop?" The man says, "I slowed down." The cop pulls out his nightstick and starts beating him. "Now," the cop says, "do you want me to stop or slow down?"

 

[guildfire]

So when was the last time you went to Beverly Hills? Hell everybody looks like Dylan down there. He may be scruffy but he sure as hell doesn't look like a vagrant, least ways the ones I've seen. I didn't see where his clothes were tattered and he smelled like puke and piss. Anyway, I would at least hope to assume that he might be recognized in an upscale neighborhood.

 

 

You missed my point about upscale neighborhoods and cops. And no, I'm not going to explain it to you. And yes I have been to Beverly Hills and no, everyone does not look like Dylan down there.

[Mike_C]

Boy, am I glad I live in a city. If I see a 'for sale' sign on something, it's good to know that if I stop to look at it there's not somebody squinting through blinds with their finger hanging above the 911 autodial button. I guess that's 'small town values'. Not for me.

And it's so true, how much was lost by not asking if he needed help, finding out it was Dylan, etc. Damn. Must have been a must-see-tv night, so it didn't really matter I guess. Talk about not getting out of the house.

Why are we ceding our common sense to the police? don't they have enough to worry about already? What the hell happened to "Hey! Are you ok? Can I help you?"

[Ohioarrow]

Why are we ceding our common sense to the police? don't they have enough to worry about already? What the hell happened to "Hey! Are you ok? Can I help you?"

I agree 100%. People are getting so pathetically paranoid anymore. 'Course I live out in the middle of nowhere, so I can not confess to knowing what it is like living in the city or the 'burbs. Maybe the paranoia is more justified than I know.

Heck, I can't even remember the last time I locked my doors when I was at home.

[garthman]

Heck, I can't even remember the last time I locked my doors when I was at home.

I often forget to lock up when I go to bed too.

[Frets99]

Different towns and cities require different approaches. Small town versus city. High crime area vs no crime area. Most likely going to be handled differently. Old folks in the Bronx would gladly cede some liberties for the ability to walk to the grocery store safely.

[missedmyexit]

Different towns and cities require different approaches. Small town versus city. High crime area vs no crime area. Most likely going to be handled differently. Old folks in the Bronx would gladly cede some liberties for the ability to walk to the grocery store safely.

 

 

"Those Who Sacrifice Liberty For Security Deserve Neither" - Benjamin Franklin

 

The "Old folks in the Bronx" shouldn't have to give up their civil rights to walk to the store safely. We are the riches Country in the world less bail outs and more money for cops in bad areas would go a long way to fix the issue.

[missedmyexit]

I agree 100%. People are getting so pathetically paranoid anymore. 'Course I live out in the middle of nowhere, so I can not confess to knowing what it is like living in the city or the 'burbs. Maybe the paranoia is more justified than I know. Heck, I can't even remember the last time I locked my doors when I was at home.

Yeah this is more a factor of where you live. In my nieghboorhood you lock your doors, you lock them when you leave, you lock them when you sleep.

[knockwood]

"Those Who Sacrifice Liberty For Security Deserve Neither" - Benjamin Franklin

 

 

This is one of my favorite quotes of all time. There are several paraphrased variations out there in different Franklin publications. Probably my favorite:

 

"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

[rhancox]

Yeah this is more a factor of where you live. In my nieghboorhood you lock your doors, you lock them when you leave, you lock them when you sleep.

 

 

Do you see any irony in your two posts?

 

You shouldn't have to lock your doors either. But just like someone willing to give up a right here or there to walk to the store safely, it's the reality of today's world/society.

 

You're giving up some freedom for some security by locking your doors. I know it may seem like a stretch, but I see a very stark parallel. You have to become a prisoner, of sorts, in your own home because you can't trust anyone on the outside. It's very much the same thing.

[rhancox]

This is one of my favorite quotes of all time. There are several paraphrased variations out there in different Franklin publications. Probably my favorite: "Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

 

 

Yet, our govt, both liberal and conservative alike, have created things like the Patriot Act and sobriety checkpoints.

[missedmyexit]

Do you see any irony in your two posts? You shouldn't have to lock your doors either. But just like someone willing to give up a right here or there to walk to the store safely, it's the reality of today's world/society. You're giving up some freedom for some security by locking your doors. I know it may seem like a stretch, but I see a very stark parallel. You have to become a prisoner, of sorts, in your own home because you can't trust anyone on the outside. It's very much the same thing.

 

 

Actually I don't see the irony at all. Comparing locking my doors to being held or questioned without cause is a stretch at best. Would I like to live in a world where I didn't have to lock my doors? Of course I would. Would I be willing to allow cops to stop me, search me and question me without a warrant to make the world a reality. No I wouldn't.