The Apprentice

[Gary Palmer]

She's looking well.

It often pays to opt for planing the sides/ribs down when exotic grain is present, but there's nothing wrong with removing surplus by sawing before refining by planing to the line.

HELPFUL HINT

If the lines you've marked prove a little wide a fine ^ indicating the correct side of the line to be worked at given intervals can save a little time and help improve accuracy. I normally leave a small trace of the line for removal when radius dish time arrives. ;-)

[gitmo]

How about a Dremel tool with drum sander attachment for the rough cut?

[Gary Palmer]

How about a Dremel tool with drum sander attachment for the rough cut?

 

 

Which rough cut? I think they have their uses, but if trimming the contour line using a Dremel I'd err in favour of it's saw attachment. I think it's a little underpowered for sustained cutting in hardwoods. I much prefer Japanese pull saws as they provide a ram rod straight cut with little/no chance of splitting the timber - when removing bulk from pre-bent sides sets - and then move onto the block plane to refine the edge to the line.

 

Those dinky little sanding drums are fine for comparatively small work, but can tend to wear out quickly and aren't too accurate unless a guide were devised as a means of controlling the tool's alignment.

[gitmo]

Which rough cut? I think they have their uses, but if trimming the contour line using a Dremel I'd err in favour of it's saw attachment. I think it's a little underpowered for sustained cutting in hardwoods. I much prefer Japanese pull saws as they provide a ram rod straight cut with little/no chance of splitting the timber - when removing bulk from pre-bent sides sets - and then move onto the block plane to refine the edge to the line. Those dinky little sanding drums are fine for comparatively small work, but can tend to wear out quickly and aren't too accurate unless a guide were devised as a means of controlling the tool's alignment.

Maybe a larger hand drill with drum sander. The only thing that would scare me about a saw would be pulling a big chunk off along a grain line. I suppose a fine tooth blade and care can minimize the chance but I'm not an apprentice so I like power EVERYTHING anyway.

[Gary Palmer]

Maybe a larger hand drill with drum sander. The only thing that would scare me about a saw would be pulling a big chunk off along a grain line. I suppose a fine tooth blade and care can minimize the chance but I'm not an apprentice so I like power EVERYTHING anyway. Quit screwing around man! http://www.horrorstew.com/images/Chainsaw003.jpg

pmsl Not so much pulling a chunk off, but perhaps more akin to creating a running split if using a western handsaw, or knocking the crap out of a side set with a power drill and sanding attachment.

Using a handsaw is far less scary than hitting a side set with an hand held drum sander and having it temporarily whip out of control and hashing the job up.

Japanese pull saws tend not to risk splitting side sets as much as western saws can have a tendancy to, because they don't rely on forward pressured push strokes or grab timber in the same way as western blades. They also cut extremely quickly and accurately.

[garthman]

Hmmmmm! I think this thread has reached the stage where some luthier jargon-buster dictionary software thingy would be useful :poke:

[rickoshea]

as usual I've kept myself late for work by spending all my time in the workshop on the guitar .... great

The curvature was cut without the use/risk of power tools lol. Its much more accurate and almost as quick using a well set up plane. Plus ... theres no rush and its good to get it as perfect as possible :



hopefully you can see the tail to head curve here. I cut to just shy of the scribed lines :





the headblock height according to LMI's plans should be approximately 94mms (remember 6mms will be added for the combined thickness of the soundboard and the backboard). I've left it at just under 95mms as some will be removed when radiusing :



the same is done at the tailblock end.

Pretty technical part of the build that but good fun and its great to see it coming together. Many thanks have to go to Gary as I wouldn't have stood a chance without his guidance ... cheers mate Soon some artistic talent will be required as I'm going to inlay into the end graft before inserting it. First we need to change the tailblock a touch as Gary has described then get the reinforcement strips and kerfed lining on and radiused.

[gitmo]

The curvature was cut without the use/risk of power tools lol. Its much more accurate and almost as quick using a well set up plane. Plus ... theres no rush and its good to get it as perfect as possible :

That turned out great Rick. I'll bet that plane was razor sharp!

[Gary Palmer]

That turned out great Rick. I'll bet that plane was razor sharp!

I couldn't agree more regarding Rick's progress.

The option for sharpness is either shaving sharp or scary sharp.

[LiFeStArTs@40]

Rick,

Awesome thread!!! I noticed that your hand plane is set pretty aggressively. You would be well served to dial that back a bit. That's one of the handiest tools to have in the shop, but they do require that the iron be EXTREMELY sharp and the soul to be FLAT. Idealy, you want your plane to produce shavings that resemble see through tissue.

GREAT THREAD!!!

[rickoshea]

Rick, Awesome thread!!! I noticed that your hand plane is set pretty aggressively. You would be well served to dial that back a bit. That's one of the handiest tools to have in the shop, but they do require that the iron be EXTREMELY sharp and the soul to be FLAT. Idealy, you want your plane to produce shavings that resemble see through tissue. GREAT THREAD!!!

its whats called an Irish setup , actually you're right but it worked well as it was razor sharp throughout. Thanks for the appreciation

Garthy .... ok :

Guitar : the thing that makes nice sounds when you hold it and strum it
body : the big bit on the guitar, or the curvy bit on a woman
neck : the straight bit on a guitar or the nibbly bit on a woman
plane : something to shave off wood or something to fly in
sheep : something you find a lot of in Wales

:poke: :poke:

[rickoshea]

time for some radiusing of the back and top to refine and even the curves. This is where the radius dishes that I made come into play. The back has a 15' radius and the top a 30'. I double checked that I was using the right dish for each before starting

The side to be worked is first coated in chalk which will enable me to see where material is being removed (we keep going till all the chalk is gone) :



a bit of work on the dish and we can see where the wood is being removed :



and on the dish as well :



a bit of elbow grease later (actually quite a bit ) and both top and bottom are nice and even with the correct curvature :





so next I'll get the tail block adjusted to reduce the endgrain contact with the top and back and define the 1.5 degree angle on the head block. I'll get to inlaying eventually

[Johnnyb8612]

Rick, that's really looking awesome. The back and sides are really striking, I love it. What kind of wood did you say it was? It brings back so many memories. Everything so far looks very similar to our #001, Except all we had to bend sides with was a spray bottle and a four-inch copper pipe with a blowtorch down the middle of it. That's interesting about using dentist drills. We had a Dremel tool with a router base and a 1/32" bit, and it made inlays so simple. Great work, keep the updates coming.

The binding on my project was flamed maple from LMI. The people there have always been great to deal with, and their stuff is quality.

[rickoshea]

thanks ... the back and sides are Zebrano or Zebrawood. When all's finished they should turn out something like this :



I was actually going to make a side bending pipe from an old fire extinguisher and a heat gun but couldn't find a used extinguisher so just bought that one you see from e-bay. It seems to work fine. I could easily cut the outline of the inlays with my burs and turbines at work but getting a flat base to set the inlay into would be tricky - so I've also got the dremel and StewMacs dremel router base setup plus a wide selection of dental burs. I haven't tried it yet but it seems to be a nice bit of kit and should hopefully make the cuts nice and tidy ... hopefully
That flamed maple is beautiful. I'll be using cocobolo rosewood for the binding with b/w/b purfling and I agree with you about LMI. Their wood is top quality and certainly I couldn't be happier with everything they sent me. Let us know if you're going to start another build

[Gary Palmer]

She's looking grand mate. Not long til end graft and linings time.

Then on to bracing the soundboard and backplate.

[Gary Palmer]

nodes? .... oh come on mate, you know I need info Garthy .... ok : Guitar : the thing that makes nice sounds when you hold it and strum it body : the big bit on the guitar, or the curvy bit on a woman neck : the straight bit on a guitar or the nibbly bit on a woman plane : something to shave off wood or something to fly in sheep : something you find a lot of in Wales :poke: :poke:

I was saving the topic of nodes until we hit the bracing and voicing, so you'll just have to wait.

I'd never mention the number of sheep in Welsh Wales, but there are areas of Northumberland where the women are very butch and the sheep are extremely scared.

[garthman]

. . . . . . but there are areas of Northumberland where the women are very butch and the sheep are extremely scared.

Funny you should mention that mate - I was in that very county last weekend (just north of Morpeth) and I noticed the wary look on some of the sheep LOL. Didn't see many women though - and those I did see were on horseback. Phew:facepalm:

[dgimcmillan]

Some ideas for Inlays:

1. Gold would be really neat!:cool:Now where could I get some nice gold that I could melt down? Who's coming in for a crown today?

2. What about some really nice aged enamel for that yellowy look? Well, most frenchmen do smoke a lot....

Now before you decry the insensitivity of my posts, don't forget that most tribes use the parts from their hunts as ornaments. And a dentist is a hunter and gatherer...sort of.

Ian

[Gary Palmer]

Funny you should mention that mate - I was in that very county last weekend (just north of Morpeth) and I noticed the wary look on some of the sheep LOL. Didn't see many women though - and those I did see were on horseback. Phew:facepalm:

Alnwick, Rothbury, or Longhorsley by any chance? I used to head into deepest Northumberland as often as possible many moons ago for shooting and fishing and love it up there. I still receive xmas cards from Baaaarbara.

[garthman]

Rothbury - good pint of Daleside Brewery "Old Leg Over" in the Queen's Head on Saturday afternoon too (they had "Black Sheep" bitter on too but though I'd better not risk that LOL).

[LaurentB]

Aha, so you've started I see! I was in the US for two weeks and only now am checking back here.
This is going to bturn out great, I'm sure!

[LaurentB]

A brave man indeed! I envy you.....had I a work bench or room to work in, I'd be right behind you. I can't wait to see this unfold...I have been threatening to make my own for years and want to see how a novice (like myself) goes through the pain. One quick early on question. What kind of finish? I hope you are considering a hand laid French polish....that's what I would want to do and I'd like to see how one would work out......Best of luck!

 

I didn't have a workbench and only the one room where I live in, so that's no excuse

 

I did French polish my kitguitar by the way, see this post:

 

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showpost.php?p=38066874&postcount=159

[rickoshea]

Aha, so you've started I see! I was in the US for two weeks and only now am checking back here. This is going to bturn out great, I'm sure!

good to see you back Laurent ..... its a lot of fun and I'm sure the end result must be satisfying in the extreme

[Gary Palmer]

I didn't have a workbench and only the one room where I live in, so that's no excuse I did French polish my kitguitar by the way, see this post: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showpost.php?p=38066874&postcount=159

And she sounds brilliant too!

Good to see you Laurent.

[Gary Palmer]

and and and .... my first attempt at an inlay in the end graft - wha heyyy lol

Your inlay and all it's permutations should look grand.