A visit to a Vietnamese Guitar factory

[Brindleleaf]

 

No discussion necessary really. I just thought I'd put up the link for everyone's edification. And knowing that when it's on another page, relatively few read the previous page, or even have a clue as to the topic, so here it is. The question was asked at another forum if guitars built in a humid 80-90% environment have a good chance of falling apart. I was wondering if they found it as controversial as you guys do. A few guys have since answered. http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187187

 

 

Well, I now feel certain that NO MATTER HOW GOOD your starting materials (pages 1-9), anything produced in an environment of 80-90% stupidity, with NO stupidity control, no rigidity control, and no anal-retentivity control is going to be a heap of crap!

[NealP]

Cool! I'm glad we all agree.

 

Hey, seriously, sorry to ruin your beliefs in the tooth fairy. The guitars ain't gonna do well outside of their build environment, 80-90%.

 

No Virginia, there ain't no Santa Clause.

 

 

well it had died `til you brought it back. This used to be a cool thread.

 

 

Yeah, too bad, eh? Hey, here's another thread about building a guitar in 80-90% RH and bringing it into our zone, so far 2 professional luthiers have chimed in. Wanna guess their take?

 

http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/103967

[zenbu]

like a pit bull that .... just....won`t...let....go.

[zenbu]

 

Cool! I'm glad we all agree. Wanna guess their take? http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/103967

 

 

no, but if we all pretend to care will you go away?

[NealP]

no, but if we all pretend to care will you go away?

Don't be silly. It's an interesting subject, one that we all know so little about, apparently. I have no bad intentions here, but given the degeneration of the thread from a nicey-nice-look-at-the-cool-3rd-world-guys-make-a-living-ain't-that-sweet thread to claiming that the guitars built in those conditions will survive just fine in a zone that averages more like 30-50% humidity... well, it's just a heads up. Nothing wrong with a little more knowledge, is there?

 

It can work the opposite, too, the only point is that build conditions are very important.

I have built guitars in very low humidity (10% - 20%) without any humidifiers. I shipped one to a humid area (Eastern Georgia) and the bridge joint failed within a few months. All others have been fine. One just went to Santa Barbara a few months ago.

But you all can read what guys that do this for a living have to say, don't go by me, not that you would, after all, as you said- 8000 beats 180.

[zenbu]

 

don't go by me :

 

 

`K.

[NealP]

 

`K.

 

 

Oh fock. 6000 posts beats 180 too! I'm DOOOOOOOOMED!!

 

 

Like I said, it's just a head's up for folks that care about it. You don't, that's cool.

 

http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/103967

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187187

 

[Chordchunker]

Don't be silly. It's an interesting subject, one that we all know so little about, apparently. I have no bad intentions here, but given the degeneration of the thread from a nicey-nice-look-at-the-cool-3rd-world-guys-make-a-living-ain't-that-sweet thread to claiming that the guitars built in those conditions will survive just fine in a zone that averages more like 30-50% humidity... well, it's just a heads up. Nothing wrong with a little more knowledge, is there? It can work the opposite, too, the only point is that build conditions are very important. But you all can read what guys that do this for a living have to say, don't go by me, not that you would, after all, as you said- 8000 beats 180.

 

The guy that started this thread swears his Viet made archtop is better than a Benedetto (snicker).

[Ralph onion]

Thanks for the story and the photos. Sure brought back some memories but not of the Luthiers art.

[zenbu]

no, I just don`t care for you.

[Etienne Rambert]

 

The guy that started this thread swears his Viet made archtop is better than a Benedetto (snicker).

 

 

I don't think mine is necessarily better than a Benedetto. But I'll bet you $100

it's louder. I have never played an arch-top that's even close in volume. This

has 5 1/2" deep Mahogany sides, arched-back w/a solid carved Spruce top.

The F-holes are larger than normal too. That means it has a lot of acoustic

volume. I doubt the neck is as nice as a Benedetto. But it's a nice neck too.

 

Go back to snickering. If you want to bet - PM me. Otherwise, feel free to

ignore the thread. And I hope you do.

 

I'm in China right now. When I get back, I'll post a youtube video review of

that arch-top. I'll also read an email from someone named Nicholas T.

Dickless, who sounds a lot like Neil P & I'll respond to it. I don't know

what the "T" stands for,

 

BTW. I'm starting a youtube channel about these guitars. An expat brought over a nice 335-style guitar.

Beautiful sunburst. It was made by a different shop. I'd like to review it too.

Beautiful workmanship. But it's very heavy and I don't like the sound of the

pick-ups.

 

Every review I do will have a nice email from N.T. Dickless & a

response from myself./

 

I don't know why Neil P keeps posting in this thread. It's a free country I

guess. There's airspace for every idiot to express himself or herself.

[NealP]

 

I don't think mine is necessarily better than a Benedetto. But I'll bet you $100 it's louder. I have never played an arch-top that's even close in volume. This has 5 1/2" deep Mahogany sides, arched-back w/a solid carved Spruce top. The F-holes are larger than normal too. That means it has a lot of acoustic volume. I doubt the neck is as nice as a Benedetto. But it's a nice neck too. Go back to snickering. If you want to bet - PM me. Otherwise, feel free to ignore the thread. And I hope you do. I'm in China right now. When I get back, I'll post a youtube video review of that arch-top. I'll also read an email from someone named Nicholas T. Dickless, who sounds a lot like Neil P & I'll respond to it. I don't know what the "T" stands for, BTW. I'm starting a youtube channel about these guitars. An expat brought over a nice 335-style guitar. Beautiful sunburst. It was made by a different shop. I'd like to review it too. \nBeautiful workmanship. But it's very heavy and I don't like the sound of the pick-ups. Every review I do will have a nice email from N.T. Dickless & a response from myself./ I don't know why Neil P keeps posting in this thread. It's a free country I guess. There's airspace for every idiot to express himself or herself.

 

 

 

This is good. The OP decides to post, and offers someone else a 100 dollar bet! Do you have another act? We'd like to see it! Heck, this is a totally different bet than you offered me on these {censored}-boxes! You losing faith?!

 

That was rude, and I'm sorry for calling them {censored}-boxes. You can see that this isn't an edited thread, so I didn't feel bad after the fact. They are not {censored}-boxes if kept in Vietnam, or another wet atmosphere., but will soon be when delivered to Arizona or Wisconsin.

 

Anyway, nice to see you here. Keep informed!

 

BTW genius, I can understand that Neal is often spelled with an "I", but having been spelled correctly these many pages... ....but go ahead, I answer to "Neil" as well as the correct spelling.

[NealP]

 

I don't know why Neil P keeps posting in this thread. It's a free country I guess. There's airspace for every idiot to express himself or herself.

 

 

I post because mis-information drives me crazy. It makes me angry. You had a chance to be nice, and you failed to take it. I would have left it at that, but yet.. you did not. Facts regarding wood are universal, and you chose to challenge that. This is why. Good luck with your business selling bad Vietnamese guitars, but do it in another forum.

 

Don't expect any takers on your bets. Most folk would take bets only from those they KNOW would pay.

 

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187187

http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/103967

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[katopp]

[Chordchunker]

I`ll take that bet.

[Chordchunker]

 

Don't expect any takers on your bets. Most folk would take bets only from those they KNOW would pay.

 

 

Didn`t think of that, but you are probably right. Do I get to pick the song? You play your pac-rim and I`ll play mine. How about Stella by Starlight, or Giant Steps?

[NealP]

You are correct. Well and well deserved. TWI I was. Hangover today! Ouch! Let me blow that up for you a bit, it's a good cartoon.

 

[guitarcapo]

I've played $30,000 (Something like a prewar Martin D28 for sale in some vintage boutique) guitars that sounded horrible and $150 guitars that made my jaw drop. One thing I've learned, price and sound often have very little to do with each other. It can be pretty much random.

That's not to say that there isn't some value in terms of collectability, rare woods, brand name, vintage status etc....but sound? You can't put a price on that either way.

[BryanMichael]

To be fair, I think this is a great thread, amazing really....and I think NealP in his ORIGINAL POSTS was being polite and Mar was being a little reactionary and the whole thing has deteriorated

 

Can we suffice it to say that while NealP is offering technically "correct" information about the nature of wood, and Mar has admitted that the guitars may need a neck reset, that despite the lack of "techincal" climate control in Binh's shop, however he is processing the wood (maybe the rafter-kiln:) ?)

and other factors have allowed him to make guitars that hold up very well in a variety of climates because Mr. Binh knows what he is doing and is a fine luthier I've seen Gibsons with split tops here in Columbus, Ohio and we are a pretty HUMID place during the warm months. The bottom line is that someone didn't properly CARE for the guitar during the different seasons, so could it be that any guitar that is well made should hold up okay as long as reasonable care of the instrument is practiced

[Brindleleaf]

To be fair, I think this is a great thread, amazing really....and I think NealP in his ORIGINAL POSTS was being polite and Mar was being a little reactionary and the whole thing has deteriorated Can we suffice it to say that while NealP is offering technically "correct" information about the nature of wood, and Mar has admitted that the guitars may need a neck reset, that despite the lack of "techincal" climate control in Binh's shop, however he is processing the wood (maybe the rafter-kiln:) ?) and other factors have allowed him to make guitars that hold up very well in a variety of climates because Mr. Binh knows what he is doing and is a fine luthier I've seen Gibsons with split tops here in Columbus, Ohio and we are a pretty HUMID place during the warm months. The bottom line is that someone didn't properly CARE for the guitar during the different seasons, so could it be that any guitar that is well made should hold up okay as long as reasonable care of the instrument is practiced

 

 

Ah a voice of reason.! And if we add in that the OP is happy with his guitars, that NealP thinks it's a bad bet to buy one, and that for 200-300 bucks I think it might be worth the risk of buying one after having seen them and heard about them (thanks Etienne Rambert!)....even after being REALLY WELL informed as the dangers of buying one of these guitars due to the nature of wood and humidity etc (thanks NealP!)...i think we've done everything we can with this one.....

 

Yep...seems like everyone's happy with what they did/didn't/might concievably buy.... CASE CLOSED!

[FretFiend.]

 

...CASE CLOSED!...

 

 

You're new around here, aren't you?

[Brindleleaf]

You're new around here, aren't you?

 

LOL.

 

Just trying to be hopelessly optimistic..(someone mentioned that it was a prime quality in someone learning the guitar...)

[BryanMichael]

I don't know why I referred to the original poster as "Mar" :facepalm:

[NealP]

Ah a voice of reason.! And if we add in that the OP is happy with his guitars , that NealP thinks it's a bad bet to buy one , and that for 200-300 bucks I think it might be worth the risk of buying one after having seen them and heard about them ( thanks Etienne Rambert! )....even after being REALLY WELL informed as the dangers of buying one of these guitars due to the nature of wood and humidity etc ( thanks NealP! )...i think we've done everything we can with this one..... Yep...seems like everyone's happy with what they did/didn't/might concievably buy.... CASE CLOSED!

 

 

Hey, your fault. You had to scoff. Yep, had to scoff at the notion that folks are concerned with build environments.

 

You, my friend, are a SCOFFER! Hope you're happy.

 

Scoff scoff scoff scoff scoff. And scoff.

 

To be fair, I think this is a great thread, amazing really....and I think NealP in his ORIGINAL POSTS was being polite and Mar was being a little reactionary and the whole thing has deteriorated

This is also true, I did start out nice, didn't I.. But let's be reminded of the great cartoon above from Katopp, it' just the focking internet. I should remember that more frequently.

[Etienne Rambert]

Exactly as promised -- here's my arch-top.

 

NloqXuE_cdg

 

Let me know how it sounds. I recorded it on the internal mic of my CANON FS200.