Tapping VS splitting

[Walters9515]

whats the difference between signal Tapping VS signal splitting?

 

What is Tapping used for?

 

I know engineers use tapping for multiple Headphone mixes but why?

 

 

What else does engineers use tapping for ?

[Kiwiburger]

Try Tapping your head. Engineers use this to determine the reverberant response of the cavity. If you do this too much you get a Splitting headache. Not to be confused with Spitting. There is no spitting on the bus - it's not allowed.

 

Sometimes engineers have to record clients with multiple heads. Thats why they need multiple sets of headphone. Nobody really knows why this is.

[Walters9515]

Sometimes engineers have to record clients with multiple heads

 

Are u a client with multiple attitudes? if i recorded you i would think im recording a girls solo album from your multiple attitudes and mood changes

 

 

 

Most rack mount delays have tap outputs

 

But engineers use tapping for multiple headphone mixes

 

Where do most engineers tap the signals at? the aux outputs,send and returns, tapping the buss, etc

 

Because i think Splitting the signal and Tapping the Signal are two different things but im not a Engineer so i don't know what the difference between tapping VS splitting the signals are

[Phil O'Keefe]

Walters, context is everything... where did you read the terms, and exactly how were they being used?

 

Again it's kind of hard to understand exactly what you're getting at, but I think you might be confusing taps (as in taking a signal off of a channel to route it elsewhere - splitting, multing, etc ) and multi-tap delays...

[Walters9515]

thanks

 

how do u use tapping mostly? mostly engineers use tapping but i don't know how to use tapping?

 

 

I use tapping to layer things moslty

[Chao]

 

Originally posted by Walters9515 thanks how do u use tapping mostly? mostly engineers use tapping but i don't know how to use tapping? I use tapping to layer things moslty

Jesus christ, man. How do you ask what tapping is then proceed to tell us that you use it without your brains leaking out your ears?

 

If you want a clear answer, define your problem clearly.

[Lee Knight]

Walters. I understand you and agree 100% with what you're saying.

[Walters9515]

That is my problem what is the difference between tapping VS splitting?

 

How do engineers use tapping ?

[Lee Knight]

That's what I'm saying too, and I agree with you!

[Picker]

What do you mean by "Tapping"?

[Walters9515]

Delay rack mounts have tapping the outputs signals

inside they tap multiple taps on the delay chip DSP or BBD

so they tap the chip pins

 

I know engineers use tapping on the consoles like the SSL

consoles has tapping functions i think what do these signal tapping do ? how do engineeers use tapping? i think its for multiple headphone mixes

 

 

I think tapping is used for different layering techiques or multiple headphones mixes

[daklander]

 

Originally posted by Walters9515 Delay rack mounts have tapping the outputs signals inside they tap multiple taps on the delay chip DSP or BBD so they tap the chip pins I know engineers use tapping on the consoles like the SSL consoles has tapping functions i think what do these signal tapping do ? how do engineeers use tapping? i think its for multiple headphone mixes I think tapping is used for different layering techiques or multiple headphones mixes

 

 

Yes.

[Picker]

I don't think so.

 

Usually when I hear "tapping" as applied to delay, they are referring to "tap tempo". Basically, rather than manually setting the tempo on the delay by selecting a number such as 60bpm (beats per minute), this allows you to tap in time to the music and the delay will pick up the time automatically from what you are tapping.

[Walters9515]

No not that type of tapping thats tempo tapping thats just trigger the Clock to the BBD or DSP chip math functions

 

 

 

recorded 24 tracks on recorded audio the engineer will Tap the audio tracks to go to different rountings and places outputs , aux , different busses , different outboard gear but on the console the engineer taps the audio signals

[Zooey]

Originally posted by Picker I don't think so. Usually when I hear "tapping" as applied to delay, they are referring to "tap tempo".

 

This thread is custom-made for trolling (by design or accident?) because "tap" has more than one meaning when applied to delay.

 

A delay "tap" is an additional repeat that has an independent delay time. Here's an example of a delay with a tap control that is not a tap tempo.

 

[Walters9515]

A delay "tap" is an additional repeat that has an independent delay time

 

 

Yes the designer "Tap" the BBD chip to have multiple repeats like 2 or 5 delays tapping the signal off

 

 

Most delays just have one feedback loop to do repeats

 

A Multiple Tapped delay has 5 repeats or more because its been Tapped differently from the pin outs on the BBD chips its a special delay chip with TAPPED outputs

[Kiwiburger]

In his unique way, Walters is actually right. Walters approaches audio engineering from an electronics perspective.

 

'Tapping' is a plumbing term - like adding a 'tap' to a water pipe to divert water to where you want it.

 

Electrically, tapping (like phone tapping) involves splicing in a wire to divert a bit of the electrical signal elsewhere.

 

Splitting is similar - but I would tend to use the word splitting when splitting a signal to go two ways.

 

Its just a word - tapping or splitting or bussing - whatever floats your boat.

 

A multi-tap delay is a single delay line that is "tapped" at various points so you get a range of delays from the one delay. Like a tape delay with multiple heads.

 

Most mult-tap delays I know are digital - and therefore there is no actualy wiring that is physically tapped.

 

But Walters is basically right - if you were using discrete Bucket Brigade Delay chips, you could have a few of these to get the longest delay, and the circuit board could be 'tapped' at the various stages to get the intermediate delays.

[Kiwiburger]

Walters - yet again you prove to the world that you know a lot about audio stuff, and you aren't really asking questions for answers. Just basically to wind us up and stimulate discussion. Well done.

 

At one time I wondered if Walters was a Fletcher alter-ego. I don't think so ... but I think there might be a connection.

 

There is an interesting humorous article on Fletchers site by an incredibly famous person who would certainly have this inside technical knowledge that Walters displays. The intelligent spoofing of audio terminology seems rather Walter-esque to me. Fletcher has demontrated an unusual interest in Walters threads (which I don't think he would concern himself with if Walters was just your average troll). So i'm now thinking that Fletcher isn't Walters, but knows who Walters is and perhaps shares a similar sense of humour.

 

I won't say who I think this might be, but a few switched on people might be thinking what i'm thinking. We are talking legendary status - even if the name has been changed.

[Walters9515]

Thanks kiwi for the information

 

Splitting is similar - but I would tend to use the word splitting when splitting a signal to go two ways.

 

If splitting is putting a signal to go two ways what would tapping a signal do?

 

THey are similar but different im not really clear what the main difference is but i know they are way different in engineering and designing electronics

 

Tapping a Delay chip to get different ranges

example

 

is the delay chip was 1000ms long so thats the longest delay we can get. When tapping the chip lets say X times when can have a output Tap at 5ms, tap at 10ms, tap 15ms, tap at 20ms, tap 30ms, tap at 40ms, tap at 50ms ,tap at 60ms , etc etc, tap at 200ms, tap at 500ms etc . etc

 

When can have like 100 taps or more but what is tapping really doing and what is tapping different than splitting ?

 

tapping is a form of splitting

Tapping is at a different part of a signal path

Tapping has a output

 

Tapping Summing amp inside the delay pedal and then the tapping outputs each one gets and has its own feedback paths really Complex like reverb delays mulitple delay waves bouncing and clashing together

 

But look at this whats the different between a Slap back echo and a TAPPED delay being tapped at 5ms or less but being tapped A/B them and even if the delay is being "Tapped" around the range of a Slap back echo whats the difference of it being tapped VS a Non tapped slap back echo?

[Picker]

Well.... Looks like I'm out of my league here, but Walters certainly does generate some interesting discussion.

 

Wish I had more to offer, but I'll leave it to you pros and see what I can learn.

[Kiwiburger]

Walters - an ordinary delay has one delay time (which might be variable) and if you want more repeats, you feedback some of the output to the input. This might be called regeneration or feedback, but it just means that some of the delayed sound is sent back and delay again - and by adjust the amount of feedback you adjust the number of repeats you get.

 

With ordinary delay, the repeats get fainter each time (unless you have so much feedback that you get out-of-control endless repeats).

 

With a multi-tap delay - you are effectively tapping the same delayed signal at various time points. This means you have control over the level of each 'repeat'. You can set up more interesting delay patterns, because you aren't limited by simple feedback.

 

You could - for example - make the repeats get louder each time. They are never going to feedback, so it's no problem. You can do more things with a multi-tap delay - not necessarily natural sounding delays.

 

I like the way you just ignore most things that people say to you. Do you think I know who your are? Am I close? I think it fits ...

[Walters9515]

Thanks kiwi and no walters eat big macs

 

You can do more things with a multi-tap delay

 

What things can i do with a multi-tap delay VS a normal delay?

 

What makes a Multi-tap delay different i mean it has more functionality than a normal delay with only one delay time so what are some creative engineering techiques or tricks using a Multi-tap delay?

[Chao]

Originally posted by Walters9515 What things can i do with a multi-tap delay VS a normal delay? What makes a Multi-tap delay different i mean it has more functionality than a normal delay with only one delay time so what are some creative engineering techiques or tricks using a Multi-tap delay?

http://www.harmony-central.com/Effects/Articles/Delay/

 

A multi-tap delay's additional echoes make more complex patterns and sonic "textures" possible.

 

Tricks are a bit more subjective

 

Good usage of multi-tap delay can be found in most any triphop/dub.

[Walters9515]

How do most engineers use a multi-tap delay's ?

 

Can't multi-tap delay's create copying the signal and layering?

 

Its tapping a copy of a signal with a delay interval time?

it copys the signal but nudges the copy signal so its like layering

but with a delay interval time in microseconds or milliseconds

 

 

Whick Multi-tap delays have like 6 to 8 tapped outputs?

 

so it has stereo or mono inputs but the outputs are 6 to 8 tapped outputs to record 6 to 8 tapped outputs on the multitrack?

[Plenummusic ROC]

just jumping in here out of the blue.

It sounds to me like the tapping you are refering to is splitting the signal on the console into a running tape machine and bringing the tape machines signal back to the board at different intervals. A DSP chip does it electronically. I have seen engineers take a feed off of the patchbay at maybe the channel out or direct out patch. I beleive they would take the feed and patch it into an input on a tape machine. they would put the machine in Repro Mode and start the machine. Then you take the output from the channel on the tape machine that you were inputting signal and run it back to the patchbay. the signal would be delayed due to the difference in the distance of the repro and record head on the tape machine/the speed the machine is running at. You patch this signal to a mult on the patchbay and patch one mult out to an empty channel on the console. The other mult patch goes into the second input on the tape machine. again take the output of this channel on the tape machine and patch it into another Mult on the patchbay. Now this signal is delayed even more because it was originaly the delayed signal patched back into the tape machine. you washrinse and repeat. Now you look at your console and you have say 4 channels off of the tape machine coming back into the console. each one is a "tap" delay at varying intervals. you can mute or unmute the mixer channels to create the effect as desired.

 

I hope I explained this correctly