Permissions Required to Use Sampled Political Speech from TV/Radio Broadcasts?

[Ani]

BTW, I listened to the sound bits and it sounds like the interest would be worth pursuing the clearance rights.

 

Rabid,

 

Imitations and impressionists just don't have the same effect as the original.

[Ani]

Okay, here is a sample letter of a Permissions Request for the use of pre-existing media that would be mailed to the publisher owning the works from which you extracted your samples. Use the "quote from" option.

 

Permissions Request

 

This is a sample of the non-exclusive copyright license that would accompany the letter.

 

Sample: Non-exclusive Copyright License Agreement

 

For a very comprehensive list of media agencies of all types located anywhere inside the USA, use this link and either enter your specific zip code information or click on an area of the map to pull the agencies.

 

Don't attempt to submit your request through the email; click on the link to the station you're interested in and look up their physical address under their "Headquarters" link. Mail the letter through a mail courrier service such as the USPS or likewise competition.

 

http://www.congress.org/congressorg/dbq/media/

 

 

If you are wanting to use samples from pre-existing MUSICAL WORKS, then BMI, ASCAP, and SESAC will have the names of the copyright owners in their repertoire. However, although these agencies list the publishers or owners of the copyright; you would also need to find out other parties that may hold interests in ownership rights such as producers, labels, banks, and etc. Once you have your p's and q's together, clearance will be obtained by following procedure and submitting your works to EMI for review and approval (that is, unless something has changed)

[BenOne]

Ani, Thanks for the link and the advice. Looking through the Harvard Law article along with the basic info on copyright.gov, I am getting the impression that strictly speaking, I would need to get clearance for the samples even if I simply made my pieces publicly available on the web for free. Certainly, soundclips from third-party sources exist abundantly on the web without being challenged, but I just like to do things the proper way, small-scale as my project would be. (I am generally a worry-wart and the fewer things to worry about, the better!)

 

Robert, Thanks for mentioning the impressionist idea--I actually had the same thought as well! I do think that impressions would have a different effect than the actual, historical speech. It made me think of TV/radio commercials which employ impersonators of famous people--the effect can be good, but it's definitely different. For my project, it seems (at least in my mind's ear) that the original speech would convey my intended effect the best.

 

Ben

[MorePaul]

It IS the normal interpretation, : a unamimous decision delivered by te US Supreme court in CAMPBELL, et al. (2 live crew) v. ACUFF ROSE MUSIC, INC. : 92-1292

 

They ruled therein that commercial nature does NOT itself negate fair use

 

Of course it doesn't void IP law, it *IS* part of IP law -- remember IP law is an attempt to BALANCE

1) the right of the creator

2) The advancement of culture,economy and technology

 

not soley to protect the creator of a work - that's why there are concepts such as fair use, limit to life of copyright and patents (trademarks are a different animal) , unfair use of IP, etc

 

 

The cases cited aren't so much rare as landmark (as they define the interpretation)

 

Trying to look at how common cases are is not a very good way of approaching a legal analysis for a couple of reasons

 

1) The legal interpretation can change

2) The fact patterns of the cases themselves may be different (cases vary, so you have to look at what within a case applies to another case)

3) Litigation is a self-selecting sample (If you have a strong case pre-litigation, the other party may simply never pursue)

 

That's why it is important to read the actual decisions, not just who won or lost (sometimes, even though party may lose, the full decision upholds an element of their argument), not how many, not just a news article - but the explanation within the opinion itself.

 

 

The "4 element" test of fair use has HIGHLY INTERDEPENDENT parameters (which is why it can get kind of dicey at times).

So, if one parameter is such (say, you use a large portion), the bar for how transformative the work needs to be, it's nature as comment, etc will be held to a higher standard

 

[linwood]

What about this... I have a reel of Bruce Springsteen that i got from a guy that use to do sound for him. The tape was recorded just before he did Greetings. ( I was working in a band with Southside Johnny at the time) I think there are around 14 tunes, recorded live in concert. None of these songs have ever been released, as far as I know. So.. what do I do with it. Can I sell it on ebay to some crazed Springsteen fan. Can i release it or would I go to jail. This thing has been in my sock drawer since '75. It might pay off my mortgage.

[MorePaul]

Ben - as Ani was saying, there is always the option of simply asking permission (I have yet to have a chance to listen yet -- the system I am on does not have speakers)

 

If they give it to you, great, if not, that doesn't necessarilly mean they can stop you (C&D letters are just these warning shots across bows - a lot of time "blow me" is appropriate response -- OK, that's a bit harsh, but a C&D is just a statement, request, possibly a threat)

[MorePaul]

Lin -- It would be handled civilly (get it )

 

but as it was never offered for sale you wouldn't be under first sale protection and the fixer (the recording engineer) may not have had release to dispose or even record that copy

 

This is something that the Lomax archive has had major problems with (and is sort of a similar situation - many of the artists are gone and tracking kin to get release is difficult due to the "rural" nature of the recordings)

 

I'd suggest archiving it - enjoying it and writing Springsteen to let him know that this copy exists and what to do.

 

Again, you can always ask permission -- maybe offer to give 30% of it to charity

 

 

[MorePaul]

asking is always a great option

 

I have a pal who found a digital archive of Device magazine, downloaded it into cold archive and simply asked Anderton, our lovely host, if he could thaw the archive and use it (for personal enjoyment) and if he owed payment for doing so.

 

Anderton simply let him have it for the grand total of hitting Anderton's website and listening to some tunes

[Ani]

Anderton simply let him have it for the grand total of hitting Anderton's website and listening to some tunes

 

Well, that's just the sweetheart of a guy that Craig is... not all are quite so nice.

[MorePaul]

Originally posted by Ani Well, that's just the sweetheart of a guy that Craig is... not all are quite so nice.

 

ain't that the truth

[BenOne]

Thanks to this excellent feedback, I've decided to try to ask a TV/radio program for how to get clearance for one of the samples. My test case might be NPR or the Chris Matthews show where two of the samples came from...I'll try to do this as soon as possible and if I get a response I would post the results on this ongoing thread. I can't tell you how much I appreciate this discussion...It provides so many fresh perspectives on something that has been bouncing around my head for months!

--Ben

[Ani]

 

It IS the normal interpretation, : a unamimous decision delivered by te US Supreme court in CAMPBELL, et al. (2 live crew) v. ACUFF ROSE MUSIC, INC. : 92-1292 ........

 

 

Paul,

 

As I stated in my first post inside this thread; I am not an attorney. I do not have the credentials to get deeply involved in intense discussions surrounding IP law. If I had those credentials, I would be setting behind an executive desk and earning $175.00+ an hour to share expert advice with a client while having little to NO time to post in Internet forums.

 

Being a songwriter. I have been following IP and Copyright law for the last 30 years to make sure that I did not infringe upon any other artist rights as well as securing and protecting my own rights. Prior to publishing my web site initially in 2000, that is now recognized internationally, I researched all aspects of multimedia to ensure the stability of my site and to NOT infringe upon anyone else's rights.

 

I think that it is wise for ANYONE who creates anything of a multimedia type for public release to educate themselves as much as possible to avoid legal issues. Although, I encourage the use of attorneys when signing contracts or involved in lawsuits. It's just best to know what you need to be doing to AVOID those situations that instigate legal action taken against you. It's also wise to have some idea of what YOUR rights are prior to hiring an attorney to represent you in signing a contract that protects your interests.... I'd rather read LAW than a novel.

[MorePaul]

Originally posted by Ani

As I stated in my first post inside this thread; I am not an attorney. I do not have the credentials to get deeply involved in intense discussions surrounding IP law. If I had those credentials, I would be setting behind an executive desk and earning $175.00+ an hour to share expert advice with a client

 

Sadly, that'd be your firm billing rate, but you'd wind up making less...often a lot less (the PPs often wind up charging less)

 

while having little to NO time to post in Internet forums.

 

you'd be surprised

 

 

 

Being a songwriter. I have been following IP and Copyright law for the last 30 years to make sure that I did not infringe upon any other artist rights as well as securing and protecting my own rights. Prior to publishing my web site initially in 2000, that is now recognized internationally, I researched all aspects of multimedia to ensure the stability of my site and to NOT infringe upon anyone else's rights.

 

That's totally, cool - I never meant to imply you were infringing anywhere

 

I think that it is wise for ANYONE who creates anything of a multimedia type for public release to educate themself as much as possible to avoid legal issues.

 

Absolutley

 

Although, I encourage the use of attorneys when signing contracts or involved in lawsuits. It's just best to know what you need to be doing to AVOID those situations that instigate legal action taken against you.

 

totally - that's exactly where I find retaining counsel BEFORE the issues arise is a good thing.

If one can't afford to retain counsel, there is always the option of searching out services supplied pro bono (most firms require a certain ammount from their staff)

 

"Legal is often like dentistry, people often consult only after it's root canal time" - I heard it once said

 

 

It's also wise to have some idea of what YOUR rights are prior to hiring an attorney to represent you in signing a contract that protects your interests.... I'd rather read LAW than a novel.

 

For shizzy, just sometimes the legal resource will be able to dig a little deeper into the issues (hence counsel) and has some detatchment (hence the "represents himself..." crack we hear)

[Ani]

You lost me on the "shizzy" part; I've never heard the expression before. Care to clarify [Ani turns beet red, drops her head, and looks away feeling silly while awaiting for an explanation of what shizzy means]

[MorePaul]

"for sure" -- basically a faux "hip-hopism" inserting (or replcing letters) with "Z" in the middle of words

[Ani]

Oh, nevermind.... shizzy must mean something like "for what it's worth" or something like that.

 

When I made my earlier post, your statement stopped at this....

 

For shizzy, just sometimes the legal resource will be able to

 

I was left out in the cold wondering what you meant. I see that you have gone in and edited to finish the statement.

 

I do agree with you entirely. Although, I don't bother hiring an attorney to fill out and turn in my copyright applications to the Library of Congress to secure a copyright.... There are certain "little" things that I feel comfortable with doing by myself.

[MorePaul]

sorry, abt that -- I had a "user input error" problem

[Ani]

:D

[valkyriesound]

Well... all I can tell you is that NPR pays for certain recordings of public officals.

 

There's a press pool feed in Washington for all the major speach venues like the White House or Pentagon. NPR and other news agencies pay for a feed from this pool for most major accouncements to use in their broadcasts.

 

NPR also has a deal with CNN to use their news bites in their productions. NPR can use CNN's recordings of public officals but not any recordings of CNN reporters or hosts.

 

Someone has to pay the engineers!

 

Good luck in your search...

Valky

[BenOne]

Valky,

Thanks for the info. Sharing a press pool feed (and paying for it) makes a lot of sense. I've sent a note to the NPR Permissions Coordinator asking for additional information on the use of soundbites from political speech aired on NPR (beyond what is written in their Rights and Permissions FAQ). If the NPR Permissions Coordinator imparts additional insights, I'll convey them in this thread!

Ben

[MorePaul]

Ben -

 

 

 

 

beyond what you have already done (which is cool), may I suggest contacting your local Bar Assoc to find out about some legal help done possibly on a pro bono basis.

You've got some things in your favor there

1) it's an arts project

2) You are seeking advice *before* the {censored} has hit the fan (ie you're not asking someone to simply clean up your mess)

3) The issue is "topical" (ie it deals with the a contemporary issue that is still being defined/refined)

 

your use is going to have some differences as it is transformative borrowing of another work

[BenOne]

Paul,

 

Thanks for your note and encouragement! I may contact the Local Bar Association, as you suggested. I am also thinking of contacting the Chris Matthews show, where I got one of the soundbites for my demo, just to see the response.

 

Basically, I am going through all these steps so I can know how to proceed with my project, i.e., whether it will be feasible for me to use soundbites or not and whether I should plan to sell any copies.

 

The thing that has surprised/astounded me is that the answers to these questions aren't readily known to others in this community. I assumed that I was just asking a naive question that others on this forum could answer in their sleep! Towards these ends, I'm happy that some of these questions are new and useful to others.

 

I'm guessing that if you're a major-label musician, you have the resources to deal with these licensing issues. I hadn't realized, however, that there weren't clear answers for basement musicians like me!

 

But for small- and large-scale musicians alike, I guess one needs to keep in mind the uniqueness of each individual case, and the ever-changing legal landscape, as you, Ani and others have explained so well!

 

Ben

[Ani]

BenOne,

 

I am not sure of your intentions and just exactly how you intend to use these samples, but I'd like to offer a word of caution before you shell out any money for licensing or attorneys. Judging from the samples used in your clip, it seems as though you are wanting to put together something to portray our politicians in a derogatory manner. Some of these fly, others DON'T.

 

Here are just a very FEW of the cases that have landed prison time or launched Federal investigations over using President Bush's name. These cases are REAL!!! Also, we had one of our forumites that received a visit from the Secret Service after a thread discussion that got a little heated in politics. The guy was only a kid and he was being provoked by the opposition. Some freak involved in the discussion, THAT KNEW THE GUY BLEW SMOKE ALL THE TIME OVER ANYTHING, called the Feds. I don't know if the kid ended up doing time over the incident, or if he just backed away from the forums for a while; but it was pretty absurd that one of our own community would be such a bastard to someone that he, himself, provoked.

 

It's fun to poke fun at political figures, and I absolutely LOVED that video "This Land is Your Land" that featured both Bush and Kerry in an negative manner... (the video was hilarious) but, be careful about how you phrase your presentation if it's for public release in anyway shape or form.... even if it's discussing the content while setting at a bar. There have been several cases; these are just two of them below...

 

 

 

Richard Humphreys - A Burning Bush Joke landed him in prison

 

Glenn Given - Editorial for a College Publication

 

Glenn Given - Interrogation by Secret Service and a copy of the article

[MorePaul]

Ben;

 

Is the song gone? (I couldn't find the link)

 

As Ani mentioned - there are other issues (like terroristic threats) if you feel you might run afoul of these sorts of deals, contact the ACLU

[Ani]

 

As Ani mentioned - there are other issues (like terroristic threats) if you feel you might run afoul of these sorts of deals, contact the ACLU

 

 

Or anything that could be remotely construed as a terroristic threat.... not even if it's a parody, satire, or just a joke.