Am I the Only Person Who Doesn't Care About the Dixie Chicks?

[Brittanylips]

Originally posted by blue2blue Tom Cruise makes Rock Hudson look like Laurence Olivier.

funny you mention Tom Cruise and Rock Hudson in the same breath...



-peaceloveandbrittanylips

[SoulHitchHiker]

Aren't most of the posts proving the original point? I brought up my own interest in their newest work with Rubin and NO ONE BIT! Nope. Most of you guys seem more interested in gossip than in their actual work. C'mon. You're all intelligent folks......... (Hey, most of you don't get excited about Tom Cruise either, so you guys gotta be smart!) The question? Why should we care? The answer? We don't. Right?

[Brittanylips]

Originally posted by Lee Flier Sure. I just think a lot of celebrities aren't really very extraordinary. I don't think Tom Cruise is really all that talented, he just doesn't have that much depth to me (same as I feel about the Dixie Chicks). That doesn't mean I hate all famous pretty actors though - I like Brad Pitt and Johnny Depp. Just not Tom Cruise.

Yeah yeah yeah... Quit bashing poor Tom

Personally, I thought Johnny Depp was contrived in "Chocolate Factory" - it's like he's become too self-consciously wierd - but I generally like his movies.

But I think Tom Cruise is consistently great, from Risky Business on. In Rainman, for example, it's easy to credit Dustin Hoffman's performance, but Tom Cruise was quietly amazing. Because of the movies he makes and his looks, I think the caliber of his acting is sometimes overlooked.

Originally posted by Lee Flier But some celebrities, I have no friggin clue why they're famous except that they look good or do freaky-stupid things to get attention, and have a good publicist.

Anyone who can find a good publicist deserves to be a celebrity.

Originally posted by Lee Flier Why there are entire magazines dedicated to how much weight Britney gained when she had her baby, or who Jennifer Anniston is dating this week, and all that stuff in the grocery store checkout lanes, is beyond me. I can't fathom being interested in that stuff.

Maybe it's the vicariousnessness that keeps people buying this junk or perhaps it taps into some deep human drive for information about exalted citizens (whether they deserve to be exalted or not).

-plb

[amplayer]

Originally posted by Brittanylips Personally, I thought Johnny Depp was contrived in "Chocolate Factory" - it's like he's become too self-consciously wierd - but I generally like his movies.

I liked Depp alot in "Chocolate Factory". The Burton-Elfman-Depp team never ceases to amaze me.

[philbo]

Yup - - I think the Dixie Chicks are fabulous musicians who make great music. Not my cup of tea, but I appreciate great music wherever I hear it...

But using celebrity to foist your views on anybody else puts you on exactly the same footing as Rush Limbaugh. And I just can't respect that.

[Bob Keelan]

I like the Chicks because I like their music. Throw in the fact that Rick Rubin produced and that Mike Campbell, Ben Tench, Larry Knechtel, Chad Smith, Gary Louris and others are on this one and I'm sold.

And I think the fact that this thread is almost 5 pages long more than answers the original question.

[Brittanylips]

Originally posted by amplayer I liked Depp alot in "Chocolate Factory". The Burton-Elfman-Depp team never ceases to amaze me.

My favorite JDepp movie is What's Eating Gilbert Grape. What a great movie. Next to that I like his "Ed" movies: "Ed Wood" and "Edwards Scissorhands" I think with Chocolate Factory, the original is so amazing, that I'm biased against the remake.

-plb

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by Brittanylips My favorite JDepp movie is What's Eating Gilbert Grape.

Mine too! He and Leonardo di Caprio were just jaw dropping in that movie.

[MrKnobs]

Originally posted by Billster I'm sorry, that's not true. Exactly what is chilling about having a No. 1 chart position. Big punishment there.

I still disagree.

It cuts to a fundamental question that I guess a lot of you don't care about.

For every few dozen vacuous Britney or Whitney "performers" who aren't using music for anything other than selling product, there is the occasional ONE artist or group who still sees music as it was more commonly seen in the 60's, a vehicle for social commentary.

It's nothing less than the "American Idolization" of music, the ascension of mediocrity and soullessness to the throne of pop music.

And then, surprise, one artist who was assumed to be among the vacuous crowd uses the stage to speak out. I disagree with you guy's speculation and cynicism (that's a first for me, huh?) because I've met Natalee and I can tell you she's the sort of right brained person who thinks with her heart and is inclined to blurt out her feelings without thinking of the consequences, much less getting it cleared with her manager before doing so.

So I wasn't there, but I don't think it's a publicity stunt. It cost them dearly for a while, and it's really a testament to how good they are that they could survive the sort of institutional blacklisting they got from the incident.

Music matters to me, and so does freedom of speech. I'd pawn my guitars and give it up before I'd become the Hall and Oates or Taylor "American Idol" Hicks of music.

Terry D.

[UstadKhanAli]

Originally posted by Lee Flier Mine too! He and Leonardo di Caprio were just jaw dropping in that movie.

Great movie!!!

[jamesp]

Depp should stay away from Chocolate movies in general. He's been there. It's over. Can't wait to see he and Keef go at it, tho'.

A friend of mine tore off a good rant one night:
"DeCaprio, he's always wet and crying. Gilbert Grape: wet and crying, Romeo and Juliet, he's wet and crying. Titanic? Hell, he's drowning and crying! You call that acting?"
Maybe you had to be there...

[amplayer]

Originally posted by philbo But using celebrity to foist your views on anybody else puts you on exactly the same footing as Rush Limbaugh. And I just can't respect that.

Limbaugh is a celebrity BECAUSE he "foists his views", not the other way around. Nevertheless, Limbaugh doesn't get my respect for other reasons...

I used to agree that celebrity view foisting was dishonorable. However, I've had to rethink that because I came to the realization that celebrities are people too. Why shouldn't they be allowed to voice their opinions? On the other hand, celebrities should be aware that since their opinions are publicized, they bare a certain amount of responsibility for such.

[blue2blue]

Originally posted by philbo Yup - - I think the Dixie Chicks are fabulous musicians who make great music. Not my cup of tea, but I appreciate great music wherever I hear it... But using celebrity to foist your views on anybody else puts you on exactly the same footing as Rush Limbaugh. And I just can't respect that.

Not sure about that analogy... I mean, Limbaugh's merits or total lack thereof aside, his celebrity is focused around his political views.



At any rate, I think celebs have EVERY bit as much right to their political views and to speak their mind about them as any of the rest of us do.

And -- just like us -- there can be professional consequences if they do. Just as our bosses might not like us spouting off about our personal b

[Ani]

To be quite honest, there is only ONE song that Dixie Chicks did that I am familiar with. They butched one of Stevie Nicks tunes and it made me cringe every time I heard it play on the radio. It was so terrible of an experience for me that I don't even recall the name of the tune.

I just remember hearing the song play and then asking my daughter who was singing.... never cared to ever bother listening to another one of their tunes. My first impression of hearing the Dixie Chicks left a lasting, LAST TIME, impression that they were poor imitation artists. I've never heard any of their original stuff, nor did I ever care to pursue listening to any of it after that chop job they did with the Nicks tune. Sorry, but Nicks is a tough act to follow. She's unique in her own style....

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by amplayer I used to agree that celebrity view foisting was dishonorable. However, I've had to rethink that because I came to the realization that celebrities are people too. Why shouldn't they be allowed to voice their opinions?

Yeah exactly. If audiences don't like it, they don't have to buy the records. I don't tend to like overtly political music (I think Dylan is an example of somebody who does a great job of writing political stuff that is personal and never sounds dated, but most people fail at it), and I like political speeches at concerts even less. But I respect anybody's right to express their opinion and if they've managed to secure a bigger soapbox for themselves because they're famous for something else, so be it - at least somebody is on equal footing with the political hype machine, as a lot of us wish we were.

[Billster]

Originally posted by angstwulf Billster: There was some newsworthiness about the incident when it occurred: this was a one off, unscripted comment, made during a show in Europe. Because of the actions of a small organization who used the internet and the press in a very clever manner, the band made national news and attracted the scorn of the people presumed to be their core audience. At the time many people, including their supporters, thought that they were sunk and that would create a true chilling of artistic expression in the US.

Or, the marketing people said "Let's run with this!"

and...

Originally posted by angstwulf Instead, a counter movement organized and used many of the same means as their attackers to put the Dixie Chicks at the top of the charts.

--------------------------------

And to Mr. Knobs:

I'm not familiar with Dixie Chick music. Do they sing political songs, or do they sing other music, and occasionally shoot their mouths off?

I mean, to go in the Tom Cruise direction he speaks out about his Scientology stuff, but he hasn't made any movies about it. Of course we all heard about John Travolta's Battlefield Earth, so maybe that's a good thing.

What I mean is, there's a difference between using your artistic ability to express your politics, compared to using artistic ability to do non-political stuff and then throw in politics on other grounds in order to generate some headlines.

[blue2blue]

I'm very fond of the Dixie Chicks' "Travelin' Soldier"...

I like their rootsy stuff -- but I'm not that fond of the country pop stuff.

You know -- when's the last time you heard a JAW HARP SOLO on a Nashville song? (Of course, there's also a fuzz guitar, twin fiddles, mandolins, pedal steel, and I think there was a banjo in there, too. "Sin Wagon.")

[Ani]

Originally posted by blue2blue I'm very fond of the Dixie Chicks' Travelin' Soldier ...

Blue,

Just to give them a fair chance, since I've only listened to the Nicks tune they did, I searched the song Travelin' Soldier on the internet and found this link Travelin' Soldier

The song is very sad, it has a full story line, but in knowing folks that have spouses or love ones away at war and in actually knowing and staying in contact with some at war; I think that the song diminshes the hopes that the soldiers may return someday. It's a harsh reality, but nonetheless, those at war and their families left behind need optimism more so than having someone talk about how it all ends in tears. They need encouragement that many soldiers DO return without crippling injuries. Although most will be scared for life with the gruesome memories of the lives lost, many WILL return without physical maming.

By NO MEANS am I supportive of war, but where some folks think they are doing everything they can to help, sometimes their support has a negative impact. I communicate with some of the soldiers over in Iraq and ALL of them, unless they are inhumane, suffer great depression as they watch their friends and other troops get slaughtered. They are torn apart by the fact that they HAVE to kill others (enemies fighting for the same cause-because their leaders sent them to the front lines) to stay alive... Some of them have experienced their families falling apart stateside because their spouses have given up hope and found new love and etc.... What the soldiers DON'T need is negativity.... hearing the soldier dies in the end doesn't leave much hope.

I'm just of the opinion that "support" should offer a positive and inspirational outlook with the promise of HOPE.... Support does not feed depression and, with the negative ending to the song, it doesn't leave much to look forward to.

From an emotionally removed standpoint, the song was WAY TOO LONG and began to lose my interest before it ever reached the bridge. Had it not been for recommended listening, I would have moved on to something different long before the "NEGATIVITY".

I would love nothing more than to see this war end...

[franknputer]

Umm...just to point out a small fact here: Travelin' Soldier was a #1 hit in 2002, before the war started.

I'm not a fan, but I like their stuff & I think they have talent. I don't care what they had for breakfast, but I do care about the way they were raked over the coals for voicing their opinions. I should think that would be of concern to any of us as artists.

I'd much rather hear about the Dixie Chicks than Paris Hilton or Anna Nicole Smith any day of the week.

[blue2blue]

Sorry you didn't like it, Ani.

You're not imagining that it's a long song, though I have to say until you pointed it out, I'd never noticed. Though at five and a half minutes I'm shocked I hadn't. That's a good 2 minutes after I'm usually reaching for the next button.

I hadn't thought about the negative aspect. I suppose that's a bit shortsighted given the subext of some of the comments and controversies.

Frankly, most of the music with lyrics that I listen to -- quite a bit of British and American folk and generally, I suppose, darker modern writers -- is fairly dark.

And when I think about the music of my youth -- it seemed dominated by the same kinds of things, from Teen Angel to Soldier Boy.

Cheer up though... I was just listening to some classic 60's Brit neo-folk from Pentangle... gorgeous guitars, stand up bass, percussion... and lyrics about jealousy, sibling murder, dismemberment, singing bones... so, you know. That's why the negativity one might find in "Travelin' Soldier" didn't strike me.

_____________

PS... Hmmm... I just looked up the lyrics to the Shirelle's Soldier Boy... don't know if these are complete but there's actually nothing particularly dark in them. I guess it was just growing up at the time of the Cuban Missle Crisis, Kennedy assasination, etc. Hmm. Imagine. I always thought they sounded so mournful. Well, I know the Teen Angel's dead, anyhow.

______________

PPS... with regard to culture-bombardment, I have to say that I'm delightfully mostly free of it. I mean, I can enjoy the Dixie Chicks or Black Eyed Peas (or whatever rare pop band that catches my fancy) for what they are because I simply don't go places (radio stations, TV channels) where I'm subjected to the kind of hype that makes it impossible (for a guy like me) to enjoy its object.

If I was getting them jammed down my throat, I'd probably hate 'em as much as anyone.

It's kind of nice, sometimes, being a cultural naif...

[Jotown]

Originally posted by MrKnobs I still disagree. It cuts to a fundamental question that I guess a lot of you don't care about. So I wasn't there, but I don't think it's a publicity stunt. It cost them dearly for a while, and it's really a testament to how good they are that they could survive the sort of institutional blacklisting they got from the incident. Music matters to me, and so does freedom of speech. Terry D.

I agree with you Terry. To believe that they attempted to ruin their career on purpose is about as funny a thing I have ever heard.

Someone asked about which country stations are blacklisting them; 95 percent or so. That anyone familiar with how hard it is to get a music career could believe that the chix dumped their own on purpose defys logic.

That despite no country airplay they have managed to get to number one on both Amazon and iTunes says something. I think it says that a lot of people are now agreeing with what Natalee said. They see the war is a mess and they get that this is a free speech issue.

Something that many here just can't grasp I guess.

[UstadKhanAli]

I doubt they tried to ruin their career on purpose, but I can't help but think that you'd have to be a moron not to realize that speaking out against Bush would alienate a lot of your fans. They may not have realized the severity of the backlash, but they would have realized that the statement was inflammatory.

But no, I doubt it was a big giant plan.

And while these people who were raking them over the coals for expressing their dislike of Bush were certainly exercising their freedom of speech, CD burnings and canceling shows and this kind of thing is rather extreme for an artist simply exercising their freedom of speech.

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by UstadKhanAli I doubt they tried to ruin their career on purpose, but I can't help but think that you'd have to be a moron not to realize that speaking out against Bush would alienate a lot of your fans. They may not have realized the severity of the backlash, but they would have realized that the statement was inflammatory.

Exactly. Jotown, that's pretty disingenuous of you to say that anybody claimed they "tried to ruin their career on purpose." Nobody said they did that. If it really is true that 95% of country stations have blacklisted them, that's {censored}ed up in its own right, and I doubt seriously that the Chicks thought the backlash would have that kind of scope... but like Ken said, they could not have been unaware that the remark would cause problems with their "base" nor that the resulting brouhaha would likely turn out to be good publicity.

[blue2blue]

I don't think it DID turn out to be good publicity for them... even now, when some in their old fan base have presumably rethought their position on the Iraq invasion, I can't believe there's not a lot of resentment and bitterness among their old fans.

They were seen as traitors. Traitors to their fans. Traitors to country. Traitors to the nation. (That seems extreme but just try googling "traitors dixie chicks" and take a look at the 55,000 odd returns on the phrase.)

People may change their mind about their own political positions -- but I think it's MUCH harder for most folks to re-embrace someone they feel (rightly or wrongly) they've been betrayed by.

[Billster]

I agree, I don't think it was a plan to say something outrageous and then run with it.

I think it was a case of saying something from the heart and then the marketing people ran with it.

I've seen Santana in concert, and he made this weird speech in the middle of the show about Nelson Mandela and "angels all around us if you look for them", and so on and so forth. I'm sure that is part of the show everywhere he goes...and no one makes a stink about it.

BUT, if he wanted to, he could have his publicist get it on CNN that "Santana says Bush is a loon" and get a lot of attention for himself.