AVOID Keith Holland Guitar Hospital in Los Gatos, CA

[Foulacy]

http://media.putfile.com/Buzzy-Notes

 

or

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnSA7gDtliE

 

in youtube the sound is delayed by a second or two for me so try putfile if it's the same for you. you don't really need to watch though, just listen!

[theblackkat]

 

Yay Area represent.

 

 

Lmao

This is how it happens it the bay

Man, I've lived here too long, {censored} the bay!

[Jealousblues]

 

Keiths side..... Hi John, Thanks for the heads up. It's obvious that you are able to read between the lines. This individual is obviously upset, and he should be. He is the only person in existence who has been asked to leave and will never be welcome to return to one of the coolest guitar shops is the SF Bay Area! I heard and expected that he had/would respond this way and that I would probably choose to ignore his insults. However, upon reading his original entry and subsequent additions through the threads, I have decided that I must respond. The many untruths aside, the deciding factor is his demeaning of my employees, who are not teenagers (I have an apprentice in his early 20's. The 2 journeyman technicians are late 20's and early 40's in age), which has no bearing on their ability to do guitar work, and hold no responsibility to the customer for blame if work is not up to the level that they require. These, intelligent, friendly, and talented young men do not deserve the insults and berating of this lunatic. I love what I do, and I can absolutely say that my employees feel the same. I work 7 days a week and have my hands on every guitar that comes in and out of here. The 4 of us work as a team and no one participates, hands-on, in any part of any customer project that is beyond their abilities. Therefore, with the final result of each workorder in my hands, I am the one to be held responsible for any subjective customer complaint. That said, I am always very clear with customers that I want their guitar to be perfect and I want it back here if not. This individual had some problems with this guitar that I was more than willing to help with without additional cost to him, but was not receptive to my input or willing to allow me to make simple adjustments that I thought would help. Instead, he demanded (his word) that the entire job be done over. Eventually, we came to the agreement that he would give it a few days to decide if we should make the small changes that I thought could help. Eventually, upon his 3rd trip back, he belligerently and demeaningly demanded that the work be done over. I relented, with the stipulation that he not return again, with any more problems with this instrument or any others. He blew his stack, insulted all of us, grabbed his instrument and left. Before he walked out, I asked him not to return. He never did ask for his money back. Now, please understand that I wish no ill will towards this young man. Truth is, he is very young (probably younger than any of my technicians) and has a lot to learn. I'm not talking about guitar playing here. Unfortunately, he made a lot of mistakes here that will hurt him a lot more than me in the long run. My good customers know what I am all about and that's what matters to me. I understand that I am here as a servant to help those who want it and that's what I will continue to do. I have gone to the Harmony Central website and registered as a member. I am unable to respond to this thread however, as I believe there is a period of initiation or time before it is allowed. Please feel free to share my letter with anyone if you feel so inclined. Sincerely Keith Holland

 

 

I want to know if anyone ever mailed him some cat {censored}.

 

and if so, maybe he could make it his "thing"

 

Like free cat {censored} with every internet order or something. I think it would get a lot of attention.

[Foulacy]

video is posted a couple posts up, but ill post it again here:

 

http://media.putfile.com/Buzzy-Notes

[Brown Rug]

interesting... let's see how the drama unfolds

[C-4]

I try to avoid most of the pompous California "luthiers" but for people such as Scott Lentz and John Suhr.

They think that because they are in California, that there is something mystical and specatular about their shops that no other place can match.

Sorry, but California just "ain't all that."

[Alex W]

After watching the video I'm gonna have to side with the kid (lol like I'm somebody or something). A guitar tech in my area did the exact same thing on the exact same string to one of my old acoustics.

[fw190]

Looks like both sides could work on their people skillz.

[stingxnj]

Dude, how many forums are you going to post this drivel on??? Why don't you call up ABC News and get 7 on your side as well? WTF? Take it back and let the guy fix it, go somewhere else if you really can't stand him, or don't do anything and just go away already. I own an old 90s RG and a '06 RG1570. You cannot get the action super low and not have buzz. It doesn't matter what you read or what anyone tells you. It doesn't matter how level your frets are, it's simple physics. If this guitar you bought had fret issues when you bought it then you should have passed on it. The luthier you brought it to did work on it and you didn't allow him to do as he suggested. Why didn't you at least try raising the action a pinch? As entertaining as this saga is it's really getting aggravating now with the he said, she said nonsense.

 

A little advice...the customer is always right, so next time do not pay unless you are satisfied with your service or use a credit card and dispute the charge if you have issues. Also, dealing with people in a polite, adult manner will yield far better results than acting like an idiot and yelling, screaming, demanding. There's absolutely no reason this could not have been settled in a reasonable fashion and, in the rare instance it couldn't, re-read the first bit of advice.

[d_dave_c]

Okay. Go ahead and open that package from Nashville.

[Ryan Trevisol]

lets mail him some cat {censored}

 

:lol::facepalm::lol:

 

Post of the month.

[cephus]

My frets buzz when i play too hard with low action. Touch is everything. Developing touch takes a long time. If you don't have the touch, then the action needs to be higher. period.

 

I notice you never answered the questions:

 

How old are you and how long have you been playing?

[GibsonQC]

 

I want to know if anyone ever mailed him some cat {censored}. and if so, maybe he could make it his "thing" Like free cat {censored} with every internet order or something. I think it would get a lot of attention.

 

 

It's already been done. There's a site called Poop-Senders. Google "Poop Mail" and it will come up. Just for future reference. They even have ELEPHANT {censored}!

 

 

FWIW, I am with the others. I don't know who I'd side with...that guitar does sound pretty {censored}ty, but I'm sure Keith tried to get it to sound/play better. If it was used (but practically new) in the store, maybe that buzzing problem is the reason why... I'd just take the damn thing back to the store where I got it, and make THEM fix it. Or, better yet, just return it. Ask Keith for your money back... nicely.. though, it sounds like you may have foiled those plans with all the internet dramatics.

[Lucio]

All this {censored}-sending hilarity makes me wonder...How long 'til this thread gets locked?

[aclarke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnSA7gDtliE

 

OK, just watched that.

 

at 2:20 or so, you measure the action.

 

2.1mm for the low, 1.5mm for the high.

 

Problem is, you're measuring that at the 24th fret.

 

 

If your neck has any angle at all, it's going to be quite a bit lower at the 12th. Probably around 1mm or so. Ibanez recommends 1.5mm at the 12th fret. Gibson goes as low as 1.2mm, again at the 12th. Anything lower than 1.2mm pretty much guarantees you're going to have some buzz when you pick hard.

 

Raise the string 0.5mm.

[outtahear]

OK, just watched that. at 2:20 or so, you measure the action. 2.1mm for the low, 1.5mm for the high. Problem is, you're measuring that at the 24th fret. If your neck has any angle at all, it's going to be quite a bit lower at the 12th. Probably around 1mm or so. Ibanez recommends 1.5mm at the 12th fret. Gibson goes as low as 1.2mm, again at the 12th. Anything lower than 1.2mm pretty much guarantees you're going to have some buzz when you pick hard. Raise the string 0.5mm .

 

+1 Is there a reason you require action so low?? (In this case, possibly lower than the physics of your guitar will allow??

 

Can you understand that you can only go so low with string height, before a buzz occurs (Ibanez tends to think so-the folks who designed the guitar??)

Especially with your attack...

Was there something that you read on the net that made you think otherwise??

[outtahear]

I try to avoid most of the pompous California "luthiers" but for people such as Scott Lentz and John Suhr. They think that because they are in California, that there is something mystical and specatular about their shops that no other place can match. Sorry, but California just "ain't all that."

 

{censored}YEAH! They SUCK!!

 

(Seriously?)

 

As opposed to New Hampshire, jewel of the North Atlantic??:poke:

[Thri11_H0use]

 

lets mail him some cat {censored}

 

 

i LOL'd.

[Foulacy]

OK, just watched that. at 2:20 or so, you measure the action. 2.1mm for the low, 1.5mm for the high. Problem is, you're measuring that at the 24th fret. If your neck has any angle at all, it's going to be quite a bit lower at the 12th. Probably around 1mm or so. Ibanez recommends 1.5mm at the 12th fret. Gibson goes as low as 1.2mm, again at the 12th. Anything lower than 1.2mm pretty much guarantees you're going to have some buzz when you pick hard. Raise the string 0.5mm.

 

http://www.ibanezrules.com/tech/setup/action.htm

 

i raised the action to about 1cm, problem is still there. completely loosened the truss rod, problem is still there.

 

btw, action at the 12th fret is 2.5mm on the Low E

 

also, there is a difference between low string buzz which is COMPLETELY ACCEPTABLE and the buzz that these notes are producing. notice there is absolutely NO buzz on the other strings directly next to it, and that it sounds perfect on an open high E.

[Foulacy]

+1 Is there a reason you require action so low?? (In this case, possibly lower than the physics of your guitar will allow ?? Can you understand that you can only go so low with string height, before a buzz occurs (Ibanez tends to think so-the folks who designed the guitar??) Especially with your attack... Was there something that you read on the net that made you think otherwise??

 

did you hear the other strings? They sound FINE! The action is NOT THAT LOW. and I'm picking quite softly in this video! do you not HEAR the string vibrating heinously and unavoidably?? how is that "lower than physics allow"? every other note sounds perfect except for the spots on the board where the frets are high... there is bow in the neck, and the action is not very low. this is not physics, it's a {censored}ty fret level.

[Foulacy]

 

My frets buzz when i play too hard with low action. Touch is everything. Developing touch takes a long time. If you don't have the touch, then the action needs to be higher. period. I notice you never answered the questions: How old are you and how long have you been playing?

 

 

i answered it in another forum i'm sorry. 23, been playing over 10 years.

[MrChitlins]

[Electric Blues]

I don't think it's a fret problem. Hard to tell without looking or playing it but I think the problem is the nut is a "pinch" to low on that first string.

[lenduffy]

[MrChitlins]

I don't think it's a fret problem. Hard to tell without looking or playing it but I think the problem is the nut is a "pinch" to low on that first string.

 

 

This would make sense if the buzzing happened when the string was played unfretted, but it's only happening when he frets it.