boxorox

I dunno. Doesn't seem like it would give a troll much satsfaction. If it's not a troll, there certainly a lot of these guitars turning up. I guess it's no surprise. As a cheap Pac-Rim import there's probably thousands in closets and in basements. After 30-40 years it's time Johnny's old guitar goes to the yard sale.

Howdy Jake. Good info. However, like Deepend I seem to recall a Bently budget line prior to '83. Possibly 'Bentley'? Sounds like your info hits the OP's guitar on the head though.

Good observations in/re electrics, but I'd have to say "No" on the acoustic. Unless, like JD Drafter's Dad's guitars, the bridge is specifically designed for it, thread 'em through the back, as intended. Minimzes down pressure on the saddle, but the most compelling reason is: Why risk screwing up a really nice guitar?

Picks, yes. Bridge saddles whenever I bone one. I have an older F-5 the previous owner put a rattlesnake rattle in. Often s not I put the sales reciept in there, so I know what I paid for it if I decide to sell. Now, what I may put in your guitar, that get's interesting. Was playing a gig where the Japanese Beetles were real heavy. I scooped 'em up by the handful, made a fist, and blew them into my guitar player's axe during the breaks. I don't think he ever figgered out where they were all coming from. Comes to mind that might be really pretty if you used lightening bugs...

Look at the same things you'd look for in a decent guitar. Solid woods, good build. If you aren't hung up on the Gibson designs, the Mid-Mo's and the old "Army-Navy" style Flatirons are great mandos for the money. While I don't agree that the "curlicues" add nothing to the sound, that's basically true in your price range. What I'd look for in a standard A-model would be 1) Solid top. 2) Solid Carved top. 3) All solid carved woods. I think you can find excellent mandos at good prices, especially if you go used. I have a Michael Kelly that's very nice, and the Morgan Monroes I've seen are good. Eastman's seem to be a step above them though. If electronics are an issue, I have a Fender FM62SCE. They have onboard Vol/Tone controls, which is handy, and a good unplugged sound. The Ovations are a little dumpy acousticly, won't hang in a jam with the Martins and Mastertones, but are pleasant to play and sound great plugged in They need ball end strings though, not standard. PIA. And if you run across a Tacoma, they're well worth considering. So Mando up, come run with the Dawgs.

There was another thread on this a while back. You might be able to pull it out of the archives. My info is that they were solid woods (which would place them in a higher bracket than 'low end Yamahas' at least in materials), shipped basically as kits and assembled in the Martin facilities. Now, there's some confusion as to how complete these "Kits" were when shipped. If the body was not assembled, there would be an opportunity to tune and shape braces, and otherwise apply the advantages of Martin craftsmanship. Any comparison to an Esteban, which is a cheap guitar made even more cheaply, and a Zagar, which is basically a Sigma with a low set up, is off target. I can only think that this explains and justifies the distinction between a "Martin Shenandoah" and a "Sigma, by Martin". Why people seem to be paying a premium for these guitars? Well, if it's worth it to them that's what it's worth. Me, I'm still trying to figure out why people play golf, collect Hummell figurines, or own Yorkshire Terriers. I suppose I have to accept the unknowable.

Well tan me hide when I die Clyde...

Generally speaking, if it doesn't specify "Solid" sides and back, it's lam. While the descriptions I've found all note "Solid top", sides and back are listed simply as "rosewood".

If this is your first guitar and you are not somewhat proficient, go for playability rather than construction. If you don't like to play it, you won't. Solid or laminate. My advice would be to buy a solid top guitar with Laminated sides and back. If it ever becomes an issue, a good tech can set it up for you, before you think you need to sell it. Get the best guitar you can for the money. One you can play, one that sounds good to you. Everything else is irrelevant.

OK. Took the strings off. Workmanship inside is fairly splooge free. The braces are heavy, but well shaped. But the heel block, while contacting the back, only runs up to the bass side of the top. It drops away at an angle and is about half an inch from reaching the top on the treble side. It looks like the holes for the strings were not drilled all the way through, or there was a mismatch in lining up the bridge and bridge plate. The solution was to hit the pins with a bigger hammer. So the bridge plate is shredded, splintered. Very, very bad. I think Carlos was one of those companies that contracted good guitars until they had a market share with distributors and retailers, then pulled the old bait and switch and shipped a bunch of crap, making an obscene profit. While mine is not the worst built guitar I've ever seen, the shortcuts taken were crude and brutal. Looks good, sounds pretty good, but it would have ben built better by drunken monkeys.

Write your Pop a song. "Dumpster Divin' Daddy". Sweet find. Always amazed at what people throw away. I bought a Carlos tenor guitar in Northern Va in the late 70's. Brass nut, saddle, dots. Cool. Sitting right here as I write. Thought it might need a neck reset, but the bridge is mondo high and I think I can lower it sufficiantly so it plays well again. Lam spruce top, lam hog sides. So cheap it had a clear plastic sticker that said Carlos instead of a decal or silk screen logo. Just kinda rolled up and fell off. Can't say it's much more than a very decent cheapo. Though the fact that it's held together in good shape for 30 years says a lot in my book.

Ahhh... So, Andrew, there's been a finish prob documented in Martins of this time frame? I take back the uncharitable comments on the previous owner then. Happens now and then. Guilds back in the early 70's, Mossmans (poor storage by distributor), Stelling banjoes (bad batch of lacqer). The description does sound like poly-rejection, and the time frame was suspicious, but stranger things have happened. Still, if the specs call for a matte neck, someone could have tried to shine it up and used something caustic. If it's a Martin prob it'd be worth seeing if they'd handle it.

Wouldn't be so quick to assume this is a Martin defect. It's a five year old guitar. A factory defect would usually have revealed itself in that time. Why didn't the original/previous owner avail themselves of the warranty? Possibility is that the previous owner tried to overspray to resolve some personal issue (glossy/flat preferance), and used a finish incompatible with that on the guitar. That would void the warranty and justify sale rather than seeking recourse with the manufacturer. Another thing that arouses suspicion is the time frame. A five year old Martin guitar with no issues has finish problems just two months after you come into possession? Bull{censored}. He steel-wooled the neck to make it faster for him, then sprayed Ace Hardware Poly on it so he could sell it as in "Original Condition". Youth, zeal, and ignorance showed me the wrong way to do refins. This is a classic crap overspray. This is way out of warranty business. On the good side, it's easy to fix. Talk to a luthier with a good hand at finish. You can reduce cost by doing most of the stripping yourself. You don't need to go to bare wood, just get the crap off. Heck, that might be all you have to do.

Probably have to find an old factory hand that remembers putting in the inlay or labels to know for sure. Mr. Dee might have known... Some things just remain mysteries.

Glad this thread came back up, as I got one at a pawn shop a couple months ago. Being from DC, it recalled the first "real" guitar I owned, an N-28, very good D-28 copy. I had started to doubt the "Veneman's" house brand, as the ones turning up are in such diverse places, but that doesn't mean much. Guitars have a tendancy to migrate. As for the Suzuki connection, they did sell guitars branded "Nagoya-Suzuki". Since they made guitars under many names for stores and distributors, they could well have made these. But we can't say that with certainty. The Nagoya area was the center of Japanese guitar and violin making industry with many companies in production, most of whom made "Your Name Here" instruments. I don't know if this will have relevance to those searching for more info, but, unlike other House branded instruments, I have seen only acoustic guitars. No electrics, no banjoes, no mandolins (Though mandos were produced by Nagoya-Suzuki). It's a very nice well made guitar, and compares well with a lot of D-28's I have seen, especially one's from that early-mid 70's era.