Members kwakatak Posted February 11, 2019 Members Share Posted February 11, 2019 It took me over 4 years to finish my first guitar. I'm at 7 years on #2 and now I have designs on #3. [ATTACH=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","title":"33041688148_6724b49357_z_d.jpg","data-attachmentid":32473630}[/ATTACH] Long story short, I traced my Larrivee OM for the mold because I love it and don't own a Martin. I've got pieces accumulating that are telling me to make a Martin-style 000-18VW (walnut.) The top is going to be student grade sitka spruce ($20 from RC Tonewoods...) [ATTACH=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","title":"46002891515_e0e45004fb_z_d.jpg","data-attachmentid":32473631}[/ATTACH] ...and a bunch of parts that I got from the Martin factory. That's 1/4" bracing with a serviced vintage 24.9" scale neck with a dovetail joint. I want to buy a set of black walnut from StewMac - which is on sale for $72 this week. [ATTACH=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","title":"45785869595_1abbee98c4_z_d.jpg","data-attachmentid":32473632}[/ATTACH] It will essentially an unserviced kit build. I loved the bending experience with EIR and hear that walnut is even more pliable. I hope to kick it off in the spring. I'm about to FINALLY close the body on #2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted February 11, 2019 Members Share Posted February 11, 2019 Hey, whadda ya want, speed or quality? Seriously, it's not like you don't have anything else to occupy your time and most of us haven't even attempted a build. Best of luck and keep us posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted February 12, 2019 Members Share Posted February 12, 2019 I'm rooting for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Idunno Posted February 13, 2019 Members Share Posted February 13, 2019 I'm a project starter but finisher is for someone else. They're all over the man cave from RC boats and planes to stylized carvings of animals. I even have a set of plans from StewMac for an OM that I've collected materials for (aluminum and composite). What I do professionally pretty much over-doses the tinkerer in me, always creating stuff from my own drawings on machine tools, that I tend to let the personal undertakings get dusty. But, I look at it as preparing things to keep me busy when I decide to knock off working. So, I say the more the better. Besides, the longer it takes new ideas emerge that better the project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted February 18, 2019 Author Members Share Posted February 18, 2019 Thanks, guys. You are keeping me honest but I have to confess that guitar is sort of viewed as a closet vice that I have to sneak behind my wife's back on. Stew Mac had a sale and I abused the plastic last night on a set of black walnut that should get here while she is out of town. It set us back $81. I don't know why I'm feeling guilty; I never spend more than $100 at a time and she doesn't feel it's necessary to advise me when she buys clothes, cosmetics, wine, luggage, etc. Amazon has been leaving a lot of boxes on our doorstep that don't always have my name on them! OTOH, my hints at a new guitar for my 50th well summarily squashed so I gotta do what I gotta do, right? ;o) Meanwhile, I need to sharpen the blade on my bench plane and whittle together a shooting board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted February 19, 2019 Author Members Share Posted February 19, 2019 UPDATE: Anticipation abounds. I placed the order the night before last and the package is out for delivery as of 8am this morning! It's not as thrilling as a NGD but hopefully that day will be soon - times TWO. ;o) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted February 21, 2019 Author Members Share Posted February 21, 2019 It's HERE! It amazes me how much packages are oversized. I feel like the shipping industry is getting really wasteful. When I opened the box it was mostly brown paper of a roll. OTOH I like that the wood itself was sealed in a plastic bag. In celebration I whipped together a shooting board and whittled away at the soundboard. Jointing bookmatched halves is an exercise in patience and restraint but I'm getting close. The trick is to stop and check your progress frequently, focus only on the places where you need to and only do a couple of passes at a team. It's sort of lather, rinse and repeat. I also made an impromptu light table to check my progress. It's so cheap that I'm embarrassed to post pictures. Never mind that the basement is a wreck too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted February 22, 2019 Author Members Share Posted February 22, 2019 Aw hekk, here are pix: Shooting board. Basically 2 pieces of MDF with a pine stopping block and a 2x4 underneath to anchor it to the workbench. Simple but effective: Light table: 1/4" Lexan on 2 horses over a desk lamp. It does the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted February 26, 2019 Author Members Share Posted February 26, 2019 I'm finding that using a shooting board is an exercise in patience and restraint. Any change in pressure will alter the depth that the blade will "bite" into the material, but I'm finding that a sharp blade, doing only 1-2 strokes at a time and marking lightly with a pencil where to concentrate is a prudent tactic. Meanwhile, for $20 I am actually quite pleased with the quality of the sitka. There is some slight silking and very little runout. I'm about 99% there. The only reason I haven't joined the plates is because we had a severe swing in temperature and my humidifier is struggling to keep up. I feel like 35% RH is the lowest I feel comfortable with; it went down to 28% according to my workbench hygrometer. Fortunately, the wood itself remains stable with minimal (if any) "potato chip" distortion. As you can see from a previous picture I keep it stored appropriately suspended on "sticker" blocks over a shelf that is slotted to allow for good air circulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted February 26, 2019 Members Share Posted February 26, 2019 I think a cut surface is much better for joining, but lately I have been taking the easy way out and just sanding it flat. Here is a top for an electric guitars - I've got some sticky back 120 grit sand paper on a carpenter's level and I'm just using the workbench as a guide. Work the top piece back and forth against the level and I've got a pretty good seam [ATTACH=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"medium","data-attachmentid":32482573}[/ATTACH] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jasaoke Posted February 26, 2019 Members Share Posted February 26, 2019 I was gonna ask about sanding vs. planing. I've never built a guitar (yet) but I've done lots of wood projects; canoes being my latest thing. I've always found that planing worked well to a point, and minute spot-sanding after that was the (albeit slow) way to go for joinery. I really dig Freemans straight-edge/sandingblock idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted February 27, 2019 Author Members Share Posted February 27, 2019 That’s what I’m thinking as well, but sanding requires a bit of dust cleanup on the exposed surfaces whereas planed, chiseled or scraped surfaces do not. Even still, I’d wager that any additional sanding should be done with an extremely fine grit of sandpaper- like 1500 or 2000. The challenge is that we’re talking about the need for a piece of sandpaper that is 24” long. By the way I also posted a similar thread in the Kit Guitars Forum and the AGF. A luthier on the AGF suggested that the joint onlybreall needs to be tight from the area where the soundhole will be cut out to the tail block. The upper bout will be stabilized by the fretboard and neck block. Meanwhile another amateur luthier on KGF suggested I use sandpaper on my straight edge which is similar to what Freeman suggested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted February 27, 2019 Members Share Posted February 27, 2019 I don't want to hijack K's thread but it was my understanding from some wood working discussion that cut or scraped surfaces make better glue joints. I always try to run a scraper along any significant joint - bridge to top, plates, braces to top or bottom. And while I have a great big smoothing plane (and don't have a jointer) I've been pretty successful running the plates against a router bit on a very straight edge followed by the sand paper on the level. I've bough sticky back paper in rolls at 120, 400 and 800 grits, the first for removing wood, the other for leveling frets. Works for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted February 28, 2019 Author Members Share Posted February 28, 2019 The plate is joined. Moving right along, I’m off to see if I set up some sort of deflection jig as I use the same plane (with a different blade) to reduce its thickness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted March 1, 2019 Author Members Share Posted March 1, 2019 They say a picture tells a thousand words: [img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","src":"https:\/\/farm8.staticflickr.com\/7874\/47194896932_85f83cbe71_z_d.jpg"}[/img2] The joint looks good but I need to hydrate before I do any work with this. I spent $30 at Harbor Freight for equipment to measure deflection and referred to my Larrivee OM-03R for soundhole and rosette location but it will have to wait. Even with the humidifier the weather is just too crazy right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted March 3, 2019 Author Members Share Posted March 3, 2019 I couldn't wait and started whittling away at the soundboard. I may have to start over with another top though. I didn't sharpen my blades well enough and had some tearout. The top is tore out pretty bad in spots and it's around .11" thick. It still seems to have a decent tap tone but those spots concern me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted March 4, 2019 Members Share Posted March 4, 2019 Without seeing the plate there isn't much I can say. My planing chops aren't good enough, I do all my thicknessing with a belt sander (both my local lumber yard and a cabinet maker friend have them). I guess I would sand it until the tear out is gone and see what you have - as you know a floppy top isn't necessarily bad. Ironically my lumber yard replaced their old belt sander and the new one only goes to 0.125. I asked what they did with the old one (which would go finer) and they said it went to recycling. I would have given that puppy a new home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted March 4, 2019 Author Members Share Posted March 4, 2019 I understand, Freeman. Personally, I don't like thickness sanders because they're messy and noisy and expensive. FWIW I enjoy being able to go down into my basement and just whittle away silently and not disturb my wife and kids while still being close by. Another thing is that I feel more aware of the material's properties by being able to handle it and inspect it without the use of automation. With a thickness sander I feel like the noise and dust are actually interfering with my ability to do so. It's a sensory integration thing; I feel like I can't do a tap test if my ears are ringing or do a candle test if I'm wearing goggles, etc. If it's really dusty, I'm more inclined to take a break and breathe some fresh air instead; it breaks my "flow." As for this top, using the depth gauge on my digital calipers I can see that the groove caused by tearout is as bad as .027" thick. I also hold the plate up to the light to help visualize how much thinner the top is in that area. If I pick it up and tap it the foundation note is getting very deep and the sustain is starting to become less and less. Those factors lead me to believe that maybe I should put this one aside. That being said, that won't prevent me from using it as a "test dummy" to reacquaint myself with routing for the rosette. I already have some shellac ready to go to prepare the surface to prevent tearout. I have yet to find a way to inlay without the use of power tools. I admit that I've watched a lot of videos on learning the proper technique and realized how poorly I know my tools. I've learned a little in the past couple of days and I'm hoping that I can use that to do better next time. I just can't let myself become discouraged and put it aside like I have in the past. That avenue has led to me forgetting things that would have helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted March 5, 2019 Author Members Share Posted March 5, 2019 It occurred to me that I failed to seal the working face of the top with a 1lb cut of shellac. That might have helped prevent tear out; at least it would have with routing out for the rosette. I have some shellac cut to those specs ready for that eventuality. I'll be sure to give both sides of the top a coat of it, but it's probably too late. Just to be safe, a new sitka top is on the way. I'm expecting it by Friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted March 5, 2019 Members Share Posted March 5, 2019 FWIW I thickness sand my tops, then brush a couple of coats of plain old Zinsser on it before I start cutting the rosette channel. When I get ready to cut the binding channel I put a couple more coats on it - helps keep the channel from getting fuzzy and keeps the tape from pulling out fibers. After the rosette and all the purflings are in I mostly just use a cabinet scraper. Up to this point I had always used a plunge base on my dremel for doing rosettes but was never totally happy with it. With Dano's guitar I bought one of LMII's fancy circle cutters (my rule is that with each build I add a tool that would have made the last one easier). The setup is a complete hassle with this thing but it does do a pretty nice job. [ATTACH=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"medium","data-attachmentid":32485746}[/ATTACH][ATTACH=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"medium","data-attachmentid":32485747}[/ATTACH][ATTACH=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"medium","data-attachmentid":32485748}[/ATTACH] The rosette on his guitar is some scrap Brazilian and I didn't want to screw it up so it was worth getting the tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted March 6, 2019 Author Members Share Posted March 6, 2019 Yeah, I recall you had to do some cutting up of a Dremel router base. I actually used mine today: FWIW I don't like using my bench top drill press for much beyond just drilling holes in the headstock. I see this it could be used in other ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted March 6, 2019 Members Share Posted March 6, 2019 I use my small cheap bench top drill press for lots of things besides drilling holes. With a Safe-T-Planer it thicknesses neck blanks and headstocks [ATTACH=JSON]{"alt":"Click image for larger version Name:\tIMG_4928.JPG Views:\t3 Size:\t131.8 KB ID:\t32486234","data-align":"none","data-attachmentid":"32486234","data-size":"full"}[/ATTACH] and altho I know the quill isn't designed for this, I use it to press frets (notice the piece of wood supporting the table) [ATTACH=JSON]{"alt":"Click image for larger version Name:\tIMG_5038.JPG Views:\t2 Size:\t147.2 KB ID:\t32486235","data-align":"none","data-attachmentid":"32486235","data-size":"full"}[/ATTACH]With Forstner bits I can hog out wood before routing, with a sanding drum I can, well, sand. I just need to clean the table off where it sits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted March 7, 2019 Author Members Share Posted March 7, 2019 That's a good idea. I could use a better fret press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted March 7, 2019 Members Share Posted March 7, 2019 That's a good idea. I could use a better fret press. It only works if you fret before gluing the board to the neck or are doing Fender style necks. And that brace under the table is to keep the pot metal from just snapping off. I keep thinking I should by an arbor press but they are so darn expensive and this literally is all I would use if for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Idunno Posted March 8, 2019 Members Share Posted March 8, 2019 https://www.harborfreight.com/1-ton-arbor-press-3552.html I use this one and a larger one routinely. It would be fine for pressing in fret wire and $60.00 doesn't seem outrageous. Good idea using the drill press with a support, though, and if that works for you why get an arbor press? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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