Members Frippian Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 Hello HC Forums, I've been playing guitar, both electric and acoustic, for about a year and a quarter, and having enjoyed my electric guitar more than my acoustic, have decided to proceed into further study from that point. As such, I am now considering the purchase of my second electric guitar. As I am the only one of my siblings (or friends) with an interest in studying music, I have no one with whom to confer on such matters; living on a farm in northern AB, Canada doesn't seem to help either. To get to the point now, I'm looking for an electric guitar under $1000 Canadian, so probably around $800 American, ₤500 Sterling, and so on. I tend to play music in the style of king crimson, that is, Robert Fripp. My current electric is a simple Epiphone Les Paul Junior, the single hum-bucker, wrap-around bridge/saddle style, which I've been playing through an Epiphone Electar Century Amplifier. Though I learned all the theory under my belt in E Standard tuning, I've started tuning in NST (New Standard Tuning, C2 G2 D3 A3 E4 G4 Low to High), and found that I quite the like the particular play-ability of 24.75 inch scale length guitars. I do not currently own any pedals, my Epiphone Electar having no preset effects, so I would prefer a guitar with pick-ups that sound good both distorted and clean; I'd rather not change out any parts right after purchase. Thank you for your advice on this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hellion_213 Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/esp-ec-1000s-emg#productDetailesp-ec-1000s-emg#productDetail Saves you a little - killer pickups, killer guitar http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/esp-ltd-ec-1001fr-electric-guitar If you can save a few more $$, same thing with a Floyd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 16, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/esp-ec-1000s-emg#productDetailesp-ec-1000s-emg#productDetail Saves you a little - killer pickups, killer guitar http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/esp-ltd-ec-1001fr-electric-guitar If you can save a few more $$, same thing with a Floyd. Thanks! Very pretty. Propper scale length, and it looks like it would balance quite nicely, since I tend to sit and play. Doesn't ship to Canada, but would be worth a drive into the nearest city for a test run! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 The obvious choice to me is a Les Paul style guitar with coil splits. Lots of tones there and that's what Fripp played, at least in his early days. The PRS SE line makes 25inch and 24.5 inch scale guitars and are great bang for buck. ESP ltd makes good ones too in your price range. You could get a use Gibson Les Paul Junior too. Do you know about reverb? https://reverb.com/marketplace?query=les+paul+studio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 16, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 The obvious choice to me is a Les Paul style guitar with coil splits. Lots of tones there and that's what Fripp played, at least in his early days. The PRS SE line makes 25inch and 24.5 inch scale guitars and are great bang for buck. ESP ltd makes good ones too in your price range. You could get a use Gibson Les Paul Junior too. Do you know about reverb? https://reverb.com/marketplace?query=les+paul+studio Can't say I'd ever heard of till now. Thanks Billy. All of Fripp's gear is pretty sexy http://m.musicradar.com/news/guitars/rig-tour-robert-fripp-609374/#next The Les Paul Body Style has pretty well been the only guitarshape I've found comfortable to play, So yeah, I'll probably go with something of the like. I haven't tried any PRS guitars yet, but a small music shop about an hour out from my home is going to stock them in the coming months, so I'll have my chance, soon enough! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Emory Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 You have a solid body with humbucker, so I would suggest broaden your palette. Perhaps a semi or hollowbody. Maybe something like a G&L Bluesboy semi hollow body tribute: like a tele, semi, has single coil at bridge and humbucker at neck. Then there are strats galore to mess with also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 16, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 You have a solid body with humbucker' date=' so I would suggest broaden your palette. Perhaps a semi or hollowbody. Maybe something like a G&L Bluesboy semi hollow body tribute: like a tele, semi, has single coil at bridge and humbucker at neck. Then there are strats galore to mess with also.[/quote'] That seems like the correct way to progress, I suppose; try something new. But I don't really like the feel of strats much. I do enjoy the sound of hollow bodies on the otherhand. Theonlyproblem is, all the seemingly well built one's are out of myprice range. I had tried anEpiphone Les Paul Custom a few months back, priced at $1100 Canadian, which I thought was quite nice indeed. Two humbuckers, withasplit, as Billybilly had suggested for me above. I'll probably wait until I can try out afew PRS guitars, and then make my choice, based off of my original criteria, the most important of all, being the balance, which Ididn't feel in a strat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 Well under your price bracket. http://www.prsguitars.com/sezachmyers/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 16, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 Well under your price bracket. http://www.prsguitars.com/sezachmyers/ That's a very beautiful guitar. I'm definitely leaning towards a PRS, but as I mentioned before I'd like to try one, and the nearest music shop to me is going to stock them shortly. I'll probably give them a call in a few days and find out what models they're going to stock. The semi-Hollow aspect is of interest to me, as is the satin neck! I usually only touch my thumb and occasionally the upper part of my palm to the neck, so I don't really have a problem with friction, but I love the feel of unfinished necks. On a separate note, I used to listen to Shinedown when I was younger. A good band. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drummer44 Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 Emory's comment about broadening your palette resonates with me, but I'd also admit that I usually can't hear enough difference between one electric and another -- once the amp or pedal effects or whatever have been dialed in to whatever target tone the user is aiming for. Yes, I can hear the difference between an electric 6-string and an electric 12-string, I can hear the difference between an electric 12-string and an acoustic-electric 12-string... but one Les Paul pretty much sounds like another TeleStrat to me (again assuming the player dials in his/her preferred post processing through amp, pedals, mixer, whatever). (Hmmm... Edit: I'll leave what I said first (above), but it's not a perfect representation of what I really mean. I actually CAN hear differences; I just mostly can't distinguish which sound is "better" or "best." One electric guitar with a bunch of overdrive dialed in sounds about as good to me as another guitar with a bunch of overdrive dialed in. And so forth. Sustain is a different kind of factor though, not exactly related to tone (pitch); some guitars will sustain more than others and I can hear that. I still can't identify "better" or "best," though) I can't tell whether you mean to end up with two electrics (keeping your Epiphone) or whether you're replacing, but... All that leads me to perhaps a more useful comment: don't spring for new -- within the same basic class, e.g., electric 6-string, etc. -- unless you can really feel and hear (and can articulate to yourself) an improvement. I didn't make any special trips for it, but last time we were visiting family 600 miles away, I just happened into one of the larger music stores, noticed an item I'd been thinking about (but putting off) for maybe 50 years... played it, and sure enough it got my attention... so it came home with me. Totally unexpected, but anyway my point is that I could not have made that decision without hands on, and that was the first hands-on opportunity I'd ever had without having to leap through hoops and so forth. In the meantime, a good existing guitar gives you the platform you need to make yourself (versus the equipment) better. FWIW, PRS guitars are made local to us here; you can't hardly go to any music store in this area without seeing a raft of 'em... They feel good and sound good (to me) but I can't say as I find their electric 6-strings better than a Gibson I've already got. Haven't noodled on 'em often, though, so that's not really a well-informed opinion. That Zach Myers model is very nice looking; I'm guessing he must be a big-name guitar players others have heard of. -D44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 " Yes, I can hear the difference between an electric 6-string and an electric 12-string, I can hear the difference between an electric 12-string and an acoustic-electric 12-string... but one Les Paul pretty much sounds like another TeleStrat to me (again assuming the player dials in his/her preferred post processing through amp, pedals, mixer, whatever)." That's a big statement. You must be dialing in a lot of effects because the difference between a Les Paul and a tele or a strat is profound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WRGKMC Posted March 16, 2015 Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 I always found a Tele is a good instrument to complement a Paul type guitar. The tones you cant get on the Epi you can usually get on a Tele. The bridge pup on most Tele's are usually pretty hot too so you can still get some drive from a cranked amp, and the neck pickup can get those warmer tones happening. You may want to consider something in the $500 range then use that extra money for a few pedals. That way you can contour your tones for even more variety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 16, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 " Emory's comment about broadening your palette resonates with me, but I'd also admit that I usually can't hear enough difference between one electric and another -- once the amp or pedal effects or whatever have been dialed in to whatever target tone the user is aiming for. Yes, I can hear the difference between an electric 6-string and an electric 12-string, I can hear the difference between an electric 12-string and an acoustic-electric 12-string... but one Les Paul pretty much sounds like another TeleStrat to me (again assuming the player dials in his/her preferred post processing through amp, pedals, mixer, whatever)." I understand what you mean by saying you cannot often hear the difference in highly processed signals, but I don't tend to go much for distortion; I like clean tones, mabye a slight bit of reverb, but nothing that gets in the way of a beautifully voiced instrument. As such, I suppose I'm really just looking for the guitar that I feel has the most suitable voice for the idea's I try to express in the music I make with it. "(Hmmm... Edit: I'll leave what I said first (above), but it's not a perfect representation of what I really mean. I actually CAN hear differences; I just mostly can't distinguish which sound is "better" or "best." One electric guitar with a bunch of overdrive dialed in sounds about as good to me as another guitar with a bunch of overdrive dialed in. And so forth. Sustain is a different kind of factor though, not exactly related to tone (pitch); some guitars will sustain more than others and I can hear that. I still can't identify "better" or "best," though) I can't tell whether you mean to end up with two electrics (keeping your Epiphone) or whether you're replacing, but... All that leads me to perhaps a more useful comment: don't spring for new -- within the same basic class, e.g., electric 6-string, etc. -- unless you can really feel and hear (and can articulate to yourself) an improvement. I didn't make any special trips for it, but last time we were visiting family 600 miles away, I just happened into one of the larger music stores, noticed an item I'd been thinking about (but putting off) for maybe 50 years... played it, and sure enough it got my attention... so it came home with me. Totally unexpected, but anyway my point is that I could not have made that decision without hands on, and that was the first hands-on opportunity I'd ever had without having to leap through hoops and so forth. In the meantime, a good existing guitar gives you the platform you need to make yourself (versus the equipment) better." As it happens, I do plan on keeping my Epiphone, as I think I'd be a fool to throw it away or sell it. If I purchase a new guitar in the foreseeable future, I would tune my acquisition in The New Standard Tuning, and return my Epiphone to E Standard. I'm not really purchasing a second guitar because I feel that it will improve my somewhat shaky skills; I'm purchasing a new guitar, because I feel that a new voice will provide inspiration for improvement. "FWIW, PRS guitars are made local to us here; you can't hardly go to any music store in this area without seeing a raft of 'em... They feel good and sound good (to me) but I can't say as I find their electric 6-strings better than a Gibson I've already got. Haven't noodled on 'em often, though, so that's not really a well-informed opinion. That Zach Myers model is very nice looking; I'm guessing he must be a big-name guitar players others have heard of. " -D44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 16, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2015 I might consider buying a reverb pedal of some sort in the near future. No distortion for me though, I prefer the clean stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bucksstudent Posted March 17, 2015 Members Share Posted March 17, 2015 As arguably the biggest Fripp fan on the forum, I will point you in the direction of the Epiphone Les Paul Custom. They are about $550 new, though mine is an older model that doesn't have the same bells and whistles as the newer models, and it's Korean made. I am slightly puzzled that you prefer clean tone over distortion as a Fripp fan. Fuzz is such a big part of his sound. Perhaps you prefer his cleaner or acoustic playing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drummer44 Posted March 17, 2015 Members Share Posted March 17, 2015 Yeah, my cross to bear. Like I said in the second attempt, though, it's not exactly that I can't "hear" the difference; it's more like I can't choose one as being better than another. (And actually -- perhaps because of that -- I mostly use no effects at all. Sometimes a bit of reverb. Fuzz or overdrive or whatever, to me, usually doesn't sound like a guitar anymore; more like a tortured cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 18, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 18, 2015 As arguably the biggest Fripp fan on the forum, I will point you in the direction of the Epiphone Les Paul Custom. They are about $550 new, though mine is an older model that doesn't have the same bells and whistles as the newer models, and it's Korean made. I am slightly puzzled that you prefer clean tone over distortion as a Fripp fan. Fuzz is such a big part of his sound. Perhaps you prefer his cleaner or acoustic playing? I do. As it happens, I'm going to purchase a used Roland Gr-30 synth shortly to start getting a little more into progressive rock sounds.I'm kind of new to guitar, so I must ask, for the sake of not making a fool ofmyself, sounds such as reverb, flanger and chorus are considered clean tones, corIrect? I Suppose I should have clarified earlier that I just don't like screaming distortion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bucksstudent Posted March 18, 2015 Members Share Posted March 18, 2015 I do. As it happens, I'm going to purchase a used Roland Gr-30 synth shortly to start getting a little more into progressive rock sounds.I'm kind of new to guitar, so I must ask, for the sake of not making a fool ofmyself, sounds such as reverb, flanger and chorus are considered clean tones, corIrect? I Suppose I should have clarified earlier that I just don't like screaming distortion. If you're so new that you're not sure of how reverb, flanger, and chorus affect the tone of the guitar, then I wouldn't recommend getting into guitar synth just yet. Keep in mind, Fripp didn't have a guitar synth until perhaps the late seventies. His sound was based on a Les Paul, fuzz pedal, volume, and a Hiwatt amp. It was Adrian Belew who was responsible for much of the sounds on the eighties albums, and much of that comes from his extreme use of flange, chorus, and his volume knob. Even though he and Fripp both had synths, Belew had a pedalboard and eventually a refrigerator sized road case of effects. Fripp certainly used the synth to great effect, but honestly, most of those tones are attainable through pitch shifting pedals like the Digitech Whammy. The technology at the time was still very limited. I suggest you do basic experiments with effects like reverb, chorus, and flange (yes, unless you have distortion or overdrive on, your signal is still considered clean). And watch this video with Belew from the eighties: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bucksstudent Posted March 18, 2015 Members Share Posted March 18, 2015 By the way, this is a cool Wiki site I've frequented since I was first trying to learn Crimson material: http://www.elephant-talk.com/wiki/Tabs_/_Transcription There are several interviews with Fripp and Belew there as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 18, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 18, 2015 Thanks a lot Buck! The only song I've actually attempted learning by King Crimson so far, has been Fripp's part in "Discipline". This'll be really helpful! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Frippian Posted March 18, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 18, 2015 After Reviewing the suggestions posted in this thread carefully, I have decided to wait for a few more months before deciding on a guitar to purchase, but I will defiantly be purchasing a guitar of Les Paul Body Shape when it comes to it. In the mean-time, I'll explore the sounds of my newly purchased Roland GR-30. Thanks for all the help on this issue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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