Members ZERO HEROES Posted March 15, 2008 Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 48%.... the percentage of US teenagers who did not buy a single CD in 2007, up from 38% in 2006. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Instrospection Posted March 15, 2008 Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 Yeah, the industry is changing and it's harder to get people to buy. What i've never quite understood is that if people are complaining about how bad music is, then why the popularity of downloads, still? You'd think that people would just skip music altogether and move onto some other form of entertainment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted March 15, 2008 Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 Yeah, the industry is changing and it's harder to get people to buy. What i've never quite understood is that if people are complaining about how bad music is, then why the popularity of downloads, still? You'd think that people would just skip music altogether and move onto some other form of entertainment. Because downloads are cheap to free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted March 15, 2008 Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 48%.... the percentage of US teenagers who did not buy a single CD in 2007, up from 38% in 2006. Where did you get this info? I find it funny that since the 50's, the average number of top selling albums in the U.S has not fluctuated that much. For instance Elvis Presley's Christmas album sold 9 million copies and Miles Davis's Kind of Blue sold 3 million. In the past decade, Avril Lavigne has sold 6 million and so has Carrie Underwood. These numbers have gone down slightly, but I don't think it's the huge crisis that people portray it to be. Moreover, major labels can always use third party distribution and bootlegging outlets that are outside of Soundscan's scope. Who's tracking bootleg sales in Thailand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Alan Roberts Posted March 15, 2008 Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 48%.... the percentage of US teenagers who did not buy a single CD in 2007, up from 38% in 2006. I'd like to say I'm surprised, but I'm not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ZERO HEROES Posted March 15, 2008 Author Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 Where did you get this info? It was in the March 17th issue of Time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ermghoti II Posted March 15, 2008 Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 Where did you get this info? I find it funny that since the 50's, the average number of top selling albums in the U.S has not fluctuated that much. For instance Elvis Presley's Christmas album sold 9 million copies and Miles Davis's Kind of Blue sold 3 million. In the past decade, Avril Lavigne has sold 6 million and so has Carrie Underwood. These numbers have gone down slightly, but I don't think it's the huge crisis that people portray it to be. Considering that the population has increased by 50%, and the disposable income available to teens has increased exponentially, I'd say those are pretty grim numbers. For sales to be flat, I'd expect to see a typical popular/hit CD sell 20-30 million units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Standard8 Posted March 15, 2008 Members Share Posted March 15, 2008 Music popularity hasn't waned, it's illegal downloading and I have no problem whatsoever with kids getting snatched out of class by marshalls and thrown in jail for piracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 Considering that the population has increased by 50%, and the disposable income available to teens has increased exponentially, I'd say those are pretty grim numbers. For sales to be flat, I'd expect to see a typical popular/hit CD sell 20-30 million units. Considering that 1) every pimplfaced bedwetter with a Squire strat, a PV Bandit and Protools is making and marketing CDs and practically (or even actually) giving them away, 2) everything is niche marketed in sub-sub-sub genres now, and 3) about every CD in the world can be had for free on the internet, I'm surprised any CDs sell at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Instrospection Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 Because downloads are cheap to free. Yeah, for sure--I always just wondered what people's time was worth to them. Apparently not much if they're downloading "bad" music! I don't even bother with releases that I think are probably going to be bad....there's too much great music out there to bother with music that might have a few good songs on albums. I usually have a quality filter of friends whose musical taste that I trust, reviews, general word of mouth or street level buzz, etc. I'm sure that i've missed out on a few good ones--and I always end up with a dud every now and then-- but usually I have a pretty good rate of buying stuff that I really like. I still buy lots of music, lots of new music (i've got hundreds of cds and vinyl lp's)--but the older I get, the more i've got more reliant on my favorite bands that never (or rarely) let me down. For me, those are methods that work where I can buy stuff without fear, where I don't even have to use downloads. But that mindset is getting to be the exception, not the rule.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ermghoti II Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 Considering that 1) every pimplfaced bedwetter with a Squire strat, a PV Bandit and Protools is making and marketing CDs and practically (or even actually) giving them away, 2) everything is niche marketed in sub-sub-sub genres now, and 3) about every CD in the world can be had for free on the internet, I'm surprised any CDs sell at all. There's that. My point was, if you're making the same number of (or fewer) sales today as in 1954, you're not doing all that well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kurdy Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 Because downloads are cheap to free. Yeah. Ever buy something you don't really need at the grocery store just because it was on sale? It's sorta like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Trodden Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 Music popularity hasn't waned, it's illegal downloading and I have no problem whatsoever with kids getting snatched out of class by marshalls and thrown in jail for piracy. 60-70% of the bands people i know discover only do so because they can get their music for free on the internet. then they go to their concerts, pay 30 bucks for a ticket (45 after ticketmaster's charges), and buy a $20 tshirt. if they had to pay 12-15 bucks for their cd having heard maybe one song, they wouldnt. throwing kids in jail? get with the f*cking times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ZERO HEROES Posted March 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 60-70% of the bands people i know discover only do so because they can get their music for free on the internet. then they go to their concerts, pay 30 bucks for a ticket (45 after ticketmaster's charges), and buy a $20 tshirt. if they had to pay 12-15 bucks for their cd having heard maybe one song, they wouldnt. throwing kids in jail? get with the f*cking times. We give away our music for free. We do sell CDs (jewel cases), but we have cheaper copies (paper sleeves) that we give away for free at shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 60-70% of the bands people i know discover only do so because they can get their music for free on the internet. then they go to their concerts, pay 30 bucks for a ticket (45 after ticketmaster's charges), and buy a $20 tshirt. if they had to pay 12-15 bucks for their cd having heard maybe one song, they wouldnt.throwing kids in jail? get with the f*cking times. I understand your premise, but it's flawed. First of all, bands getting 30 dollars for a concert ticket aren't unknown bands being discovered by free downloads. And secondly, if "60-70%" of everyone who downloads for free did what you say they do, bands would be awash in money. The fact is, those 60-70% might go to one show a month, maybe two, while they're downloading ten or 20 bands a week. The math doesn't add up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 We give away our music for free. We do sell CDs (jewel cases), but we have cheaper copies (paper sleeves) that we give away for free at shows. Giving away CDs at shows isn't smart. I know a lot of bands do it, but it has been proven here time and again that a huge number of bands don't know jack about promo or the business in general, so it doesn't surprise me. Shows are the one place where people who have just heard you play are likely to be inclined to pay you 5 or 10 bucks. Some of the festival shows I do bands sell CDs for $15 and CD/Tshirt combos for 20-25. And they sell a boat load. Why? Because the people have just seen the band live, maybe talked to a couple of them, have had a few drinks, and are willing to shell out for something that just made them feel good. We sold 480 dollars worth of CDs during and after one 90 minute set at a festival, and that was at a marked up price (the festival sets the price so headliners don't get undercut) If you must give away CDs, do it in the days before a show to try to 'prime the pump' so to speak. But giving them away at shows when they've already heard you play is wasting promo value and missing income opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 Considering that the population has increased by 50%, and the disposable income available to teens has increased exponentially, I'd say those are pretty grim numbers. For sales to be flat, I'd expect to see a typical popular/hit CD sell 20-30 million units. Illegal downloading has definitely impacted the numbers. But if you look at units sold from the 70's to the 90's, the numbers weren't drastically different. Population increases have not had a significant impact on the amount of music sold or consumed within this country. Different barometers must be brought into that equation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ZERO HEROES Posted March 16, 2008 Author Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 Giving away CDs at shows isn't smart. I know a lot of bands do it, but it has been proven here time and again that a huge number of bands don't know jack about promo or the business in general, so it doesn't surprise me. You didn't bother to ask why we would or how we give them away. This is a numbers business, just like every other industry. Find the equilibrium and you'll be at your best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 You didn't bother to ask why we would or how we give them away. This is a numbers business, just like every other industry. Find the equilibrium and you'll be at your best. You're right. So, why are you? This is a numbers business, just like every other industry. Find the equilibrium and you'll be at your best. This is an utterly meaningless statement to me. Can you explain it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted March 16, 2008 Members Share Posted March 16, 2008 You're right.So, why are you? This is an utterly meaningless statement to me. Can you explain it? I suppose in his defense, giving away cds can be advantageous if you want someone to leak your material. Moreover, nobody defined what would be on cds. Are talking full length tracks, album snippets, live material, there are lots of things that can stuck on that little plastic disc. But if you want your live or studio material to be leaked so you can attain more exposure, giving away cds to one's dedicated fans is not a bad idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted March 17, 2008 Members Share Posted March 17, 2008 But if you want your live or studio material to be leaked so you can attain more exposure, giving away cds to one's dedicated fans is not a bad idea. Can you explain what the advantage is to giving them away to people who have just watched you play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted March 17, 2008 Members Share Posted March 17, 2008 Can you explain what the advantage is to giving them away to people who have just watched you play? First, I think we need to define what's being given away for free. What type of material would be on these cds? But if a band or artist finishes their set and then passes out a few demo tracks that are already on myspace or possibly live tracks from another show, that could be a good way for them to have their material potentially leaked...if their fanbase is loyal enough. I suppose it all boils down to the original intent of the artist. What works for one group may not work for another...so to answer your question, I feel the advantages and pitfalls are largely determined and evaluated by the artists themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted March 17, 2008 Members Share Posted March 17, 2008 First, I think we need to define what's being given away for free. What type of material would be on these cds? But if a band or artist finishes their set and then passes out a few demo tracks that are already on myspace or possibly live tracks from another show, that could be a good way for them to have their material potentially leaked...if their fanbase is loyal enough. I suppose it all boils down to the original intent of the artist. What works for one group may not work for another...so to answer your question, I feel the advantages and pitfalls are largely determined and evaluated by the artists themselves. I can buy that. I just ask because I've seen other local bands after shows doling out finished product CDs ( 6-10 songs, on average) like candy at a parade, and wondered why they didn't try to sell them during and after the performance. The only reason I can come up with is 1) they don't believe in their product or 2) they don't know anything about business. Or maybe they don't care about making money. I'm not obsessed with making money, but i don't want to lose any more than I have to, either. I'm not opposed to giving away CDs ever. I usually reserve 150 or so out of a run of 1000 for promo, family and close friends, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sabriel9v Posted March 17, 2008 Members Share Posted March 17, 2008 I just ask because I've seen other local bands after shows doling out finished product CDs ( 6-10 songs, on average) like candy at a parade Well giving away cds with 6-10 songs on there just seems excessive. Actually, it's just plain dumb. You've basically given the audience your entire ep or lp for free. I was thinking of those jam bands that give away live cds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members modulusman Posted March 17, 2008 Members Share Posted March 17, 2008 I recently ran sound for a local band that gave me a ten song CD. I thought the guy was just being nice to me since I was their soundman that night. Till I noticed he was handing them out to everyone in the bar. I'm with Blue Strat on this one. It makes absolutely no sense to me to give away your music for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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