Members hottub Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 I recently picked up a pair of Yorkville Y150's that I'm using with a Mackie 808S head. I'm considering adding a sub but unclear as to whether it should be passive or powered. If powered, would I need to get involved with crossovers, etc. I'm basically looking for a schematic of how it would be done, one with a passive sub and one with a powered sub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members flanc Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 Since you don't really have enough power to drive subs + mains with the 808, you'll have to get either powered subs or passive subs with an amp. The requirement for a crossover will be their whether you use passive or active subs. You could just get an inexpensive Behringer crossover like the following:http://www.zzounds.com/item--BEHCX2310 Here is how you would connect everything: On the front of the Mackie 808S their are two 1/4" out's labeled "l mixer out" and "r mixer out". These are the left and right line level outputs of the mixer prior to the amplifier. You would connect 1/4" cables to the left/right inputs of a crossover from these points. From the Left and right "high outputs" of the crossover, you would connect a 1/4" cable back to the Left and right "PWR AMP IN" connection points on the front of the 808S. These will drive your Yorkville Main speakers. From the left and right "Low Outputs" on the crossover, connect to the new amplifier and subwoofers (either powered subs or discrete components). Voila! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted August 20, 2003 CMS Author Share Posted August 20, 2003 In addition to what flanc says, you could look for a power amp that has a built-in crossover. Some Mackie (the 1400i), some Peavey and some QSC amps have these. One less box to tote around. One potential issue is having the Y150's receiving a full-range signal....you don't really want them getting lows if you have subs. If possible, it might be better to use the 808's amp for monitors and run your mains completely from external amps and a crossover. Of course, all this extra equipment negates the advantages of using a powered mixer, so if space and number of boxes matter, then it might be better for you to go with a powered sub. Look for one that's got it's own crossover too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Audioeast Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 Yorkvilles line of active subs (elite series anyway) have the perfect solution to your problem.... They have low pass filters (xover feature) on them and have line/speaker level option on them so all you do is plug the output of your powered mixer into the powered sub and then jump up to the top box - the sub will only take the line level and pass the powered signal thru to the top box.....i don't know how but sure is cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted August 20, 2003 CMS Author Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by Audioeast Yorkvilles line of active subs (elite series anyway) have the perfect solution to your problem....They have low pass filters (xover feature) on them and have line/speaker level option on them so all you do is plug the output of your powered mixer into the powered sub and then jump up to the top box - the sub will only take the line level and pass the powered signal thru to the top box.....i don't know how but sure is cool! You sure about that? They convert speaker output to line level? Link me to these please, I'd love to see what they say about 'em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ashivraj Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by Craigv You sure about that? They convert speaker output to line level? Link me to these please, I'd love to see what they say about 'em. nope, quite the opposite. like the jbl m-pro series of powered subs. they take full-range line-level in, and havea) line-level full-range out - basically a parallelb) line-level m/h out - basically a post x/o signalc) speaker-level m/h out - post x/o, post amp they might also have a line-level low out, to parallel to another powered sub/amp+sub, im not sure. to go speaker-level > line-level, what you need is a pad - most DIs will let you do this. of course, i could be very wrong here... AS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DaBender Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by ashivraj of course, i could be very wrong here... I think so. From www.yorkville.com - The power section of the LS800P active subwoofer has an ingenious input / output system. XLR balanced inputs as well as TRS 1/4-inch balanced ins make sure you can get into the LS800P from any source. 1/4-inch inputs will support either line level or speaker level source signal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted August 20, 2003 CMS Author Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by DaBender I think so. From www.yorkville.com - The power section of the LS800P active subwoofer has an ingenious input / output system. XLR balanced inputs as well as TRS 1/4-inch balanced ins make sure you can get into the LS800P from any source. 1/4-inch inputs will support either line level or speaker level source signal. Coupla questions.... How much power can those 1/4" inputs handle before the circuit gets fried? Why would anyone want to use speaker-level source to feed powered speakers? If you're 'wasting' power(I'm assuming that speaker-level signal power isn't utilized), may as well just run some balanced lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DaBender Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by CraigvWhy would anyone want to use speaker-level source to feed powered speakers? I would think the most obvious answer would be for the application mentined by Audioeast - namely - tap the normal speaker line for the bass, and use a short patch chord to continue to your tops for mids/highs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted August 20, 2003 CMS Author Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by DaBender I would think the most obvious answer would be for the application mentined by Audioeast - namely - tap the normal speaker line for the bass, and use a short patch chord to continue to your tops for mids/highs. It just seems better to use line-level signal to the powered boxes. It's got to be better quality than a yet-again converted signal. I suppose we'd have to know if the speaker line is actually powering any drivers ir is just being 'soaked up' and converted to line level for the inboard amps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Audioeast Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by Craigv You sure about that? They convert speaker output to line level? Link me to these please, I'd love to see what they say about 'em. yep sure as a chicken has a beak.... www.yorkville.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Audioeast Posted August 20, 2003 Members Share Posted August 20, 2003 Originally posted by Craigv Coupla questions....How much power can those 1/4" inputs handle before the circuit gets fried?Why would anyone want to use speaker-level source to feed powered speakers? If you're 'wasting' power(I'm assuming that speaker-level signal power isn't utilized), may as well just run some balanced lines. Now i personally would not build a rig like this but if somone already owns a powered mixer and just wants to add a sub yorkie's made it simple..... before you'd have to find a line level out (non powered) go into a xover then take the high out back into the mixer somehow then come out of powered out into the tops,..... geez what a fricken mess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted August 21, 2003 Members Share Posted August 21, 2003 It's done all the time... look at most of the fender line output and direct output circuits on their bass amps (for example) and you will just toss your cookies. The speaker output feeds a resistor level pad and then to the line output jack... often no coupling (DC blocking) capacitor!!! It's not that big of a deal for that application since any high frequency noise will not be reproduced anyway. Nothing wrong for that application, though I wouldn't design anything that way, doesn't mean it's absoultely wrong as long as there is protection built in. My only worry is that feeding the powered sub with the output of a bridged full range amp may create some issues, but an internal isolation transformer (also called a signal bridging transformer in this application even though it has nothing to do with bridged mono mode) will solve all such problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted August 21, 2003 CMS Author Share Posted August 21, 2003 Originally posted by agedhorse It's done all the time... look at most of the fender line output and direct output circuits on their bass amps (for example) and you will just toss your cookies. The speaker output feeds a resistor level pad and then to the line output jack... often no coupling (DC blocking) capacitor!!! It's not that big of a deal for that application since any high frequency noise will not be reproduced anyway. Nothing wrong for that application, though I wouldn't design anything that way, doesn't mean it's absoultely wrong as long as there is protection built in. My only worry is that feeding the powered sub with the output of a bridged full range amp may create some issues, but an internal isolation transformer (also called a signal bridging transformer in this application even though it has nothing to do with bridged mono mode) will solve all such problems. Just please tell me my Ampeg SVT-4PRO isn't set up that way..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted August 21, 2003 Members Share Posted August 21, 2003 Originally posted by Craigv Just please tell me my Ampeg SVT-4PRO isn't set up that way..... I doubt it... the later Ampegs were a little less "crude" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted August 21, 2003 CMS Author Share Posted August 21, 2003 Originally posted by agedhorse I doubt it... the later Ampegs were a little less "crude" That's okay, 'tis better to run my direct from my Sansamp than the head anyway.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members drummer_jay Posted August 21, 2003 Members Share Posted August 21, 2003 Originally posted by hottub I recently picked up a pair of Yorkville Y150's that I'm using with a Mackie 808S head. I'm considering adding a sub but unclear as to whether it should be passive or powered. If powered, would I need to get involved with crossovers, etc. I'm basically looking for a schematic of how it would be done, one with a passive sub and one with a powered sub. I think most people will agree that you'll probably need TWO subs. NOW, for a shameless lug.. I've got two for sale!!! Two Mackie SRS1500's in great shape!! If you want to know anything about them, email me... Honestly, they are a great sub. Look into anything mackie or yorkie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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